I kind of take offense (very mild offense, I assure you) to everyone here suggesting that it is some how gay people’s sole responsibility to make their sexualities known to everyone.
I am an openly gay man, but that doesn’t mean everyone knows I’m gay. If anyone asks, I’ll tell the truth, and I won’t get upset about it. If people ask me if I have a girlfriend, I’ll say no, I have a boyfriend.
But if someone never asks me about it, and never assumes it, then they’ll never know I was gay. I’d hate to live in a world where everyone would just expect me to announce I’m gay to everyone I meet so that they know.
In your uncle’s case it may be the same. Maybe he just doesn’t care, and doesn’t think you care, and just never talks about it because frankly it’s just not that important. That doesn’t mean he would be rude or resent you for asking.
So, to everyone here who thinks there is something intrinsically rude about asking a person you suspect of being gay if they are gay, there isn’t. For some gay people who just don’t make it an issue, like myself, asking might be the only way you’ll ever find out.
Yeah, thats why that whole “in the closet thing” is an absolutely totally disproven myth.
What you really mean is if he REALLY wanted him to know and had no fear/embarassment in telling him (and what his reaction might be) and could figure out an easy way to tell the OP then he probably already would have. That is not remotely the same thing as what your statement suggests IMO.
My departed friend could not bring himself to tell me till he was on his deathbed. I think things would have been better for his mental health if he could have brought himself to tell me way sooner than that. And he would be in his mid 60s now if he was still alive. So he most likely grew up in an environment that was significantly more gay tolerant than some 80ish year old guy.
Sure, it is possible Uncle ain’t gay or doesn’t want anyone to know he is or doesn’t think its anyones damn business either way. But, IMO its quite possible he is and would be relieved to tell a dear “relative” and know said relative doesn’t give a fuck and might actually enjoy meeting and getting to know any possible long term “friend” uncle has.
IMO what should be argued here are the probabilities of what reality is and what manner of approach maximizes the potential for good for uncle and minimizes the potential for bad.
I absolutely agree with the “no pushing an old man”-crowd, but at the same time I think there is an option to let him know how you feel about matters of sexual orientation.
I like the “oh look Ricky Martin came out, that’s awesome, pass the butter” idea. Maybe incorporate, in as natural a way as possible, a little politics about recent developments in the gay rights area. Casually glancing through the paper “Well, I’ll be glad when there is finally marriage equality. Denying gay people the right to love and happiness sanctioned by marriage just seems ridiculous to me.”
Your goal is his happiness, that’s clear. Surely that just means that you want him to know that, should he be gay, that would be fine with you and his fantastic-uncle-factor is undiminished. If he responds it’s fine, if he doesn’t he knows how you feel. If it were the case that he is not gay at all, or perhaps even disapproving of homosexuality, then he knows your politics and he has something to think about. Win-win.
Is an 80+ year old man even going to know who Ricky Martin is? Anderson Cooper would probably be a better bet, if the OP chooses to go the “Oh, how nice this celebrity came out” route.
Thanks all. Please keep your suggestions coming. What I’ve decided to do for the time being, unless anyone thinks it’s a really bad idea, is to bluntly ask my granny what she thinks. My granny is an enigma; to someone who doesn’t know her she could be described anywhere between slightly and extremely bigoted, but at the same time she has extreme family loyalty(+) and extreme pragmatism to the extent she is in no way bigoted towards any family member - it’s fear of the other if you unfamiliar if you know what I mean - so I think would certainly not be peturbed by the question and would answer what she knows.
*who is not my gran with the stroke for anyone really interested in family Linctus - that’s the other side. But my granny herself currently has a supremely painful kidney infection atm. It’s not a good time for the elderly Linctuses atm.
(+)by the standards of this message board, where most of you would turn in a family member for murder. There is no way that me or my granny would turn each other in for any non-family crime.
If you’re going to ask anyone, ask your uncle. Personally I think you should probably just mind your own business, but asking a third party seems like a terrible idea to me.
I’m not asking her whether my uncle is gay (or not directly anyway). I’m asking her what she thinks.
I have had a go at explaining the exact family dynamics between her and him but it was getting too obviously personally identifable. A vague impression can be given if I say that him and her both live on a family owned very large piece of land, him as the last surviving [his direct] family member of his generation in a huge manor and her in a big pad; furthermore she was brought up by his mother and father. But you can’t really think of them as brother and sister either.
Anyway I can basically say anything I like to my granny and she certainly won’t feed it back to him; its more whether the advice she gives is useful or not. I’m basically asking for context more than advice from her.
Why on earth would you want to drag your granny into this. Has she ever, in all the years you’ve known her said anything about her brother’s (I’m guessing that’s the relationship) social life, lost loves, private personal struggles or anything else that suggests she’s concerned he might be keeping a secret?
If she hasn’t said anything then she either knows and is respecting your uncle by not talking about it, she doesn’t know and doesn’t want to feed speculation, or she doesn’t even suspect and it’s not your place to suggest that your uncle is hiding something from her.
ETA: I just read the OP’s response to** Lamia**. My response remains the same. Keep your granny out of this.
It doesn’t matter. I cannot imagine any way that it would be better for your uncle if you discussed this with your grandmother first, and a whole heck of a lot of ways it would be much, much worse. I personally would not be at all offended if someone I was close to asked me if I were gay. However, I would be offended if I found out that someone I was close to had been gossiping about my sexual orientation with another family member behind my back rather than coming to me about it.
It is not your place to out your uncle to your grandmother, not even if you trust her to keep quiet about it.
I know you’re answering in good faith and I really appreciate it but you aren’t aware of the three way relationship between my granny, my uncle, and I.
For example my uncle has just lost his driving licence due to parkinsons (also crap vision) and me and my granny have been discussing that for over a year now.
There have been plenty of other cases - for example he is the last of three and has been seriously depressed on occasion as the other two have both died in the last two or three years. Once again my granny and I have spoken very frankly about him.
You will have to trust me it’s appropriate to discuss this with my granny (who is certainly not my uncle’s sister or anything like that; cousin would be closer) because I do understand the circumstances there.
Not much else I can say really.
Tell you what though: I can ask my mum if I should ask my granny. That’s about the only other alternative I have.
(And by the way, I cannot remmeber how old I was when I asked this but I would guess around twelve: I asked my mum if we had any gay people in the family and she said “well uncle X hasn’t ever been married…”)
NO!!! Do NOT start going around gossiping about the poor man, especially by, “I’ll ask so-and-so if I should ask what’s his name if I should say something to you know who…”
And talking about taking away someone’s driver’s license is a whole different ballgame. Issues vital to his health and well being are one thing. That’s a necessity. Wanting to if the guy’s gay and going around asking various family members about it isn’t!
Just because you’re in the habit of talking about your uncle with your granny doesn’t mean that he’s okay with this in general or that he’d be okay with it in this specific instance. If your uncle wanted the two of you talking about how he’s gay then he would have told at least one of you that he is gay.
If you’re determined to talk about this with your grandmother then I can’t stop you from doing so, but you did say you wouldn’t do it if anyone here thought it was a really bad idea. Well, I think it’s a really bad idea.
Gosh, why don’t you just put an ad in the paper while you’re at it? You have plenty of other alternatives, the two big ones being talking to your uncle first or just minding your own business.
I don’t think there’s any convincing the OP on this. He/she has clearly made up his/her mind to get to the bottom of this at any cost necessary.
However, honestly it’s beginning to smell like a witch hunt, however naive or even pure the motivations are. Why can’t the OP just go visit Uncle X frequently, shower the old man with love and compassion, and cherish what little time they have together? I’m sure that’ll make him feel a lot more at ease than “coming out” to who is essentially a grandchild.
I mean, really, what’s the point, why do you care?
Leave him with his sexual privacy.
Also, consider that you may create a divide because he may not be able or willing to admit his sexuality, especially at his age and especially considering how he was brought up. He may become angry or distant with you as a defense mechanism. You may end up damaging or destroying the relationship for no possible gain.
In the end, it’s not your business whether he is or not, it affects you in no way whether he is or not and so why do you think you have any reason to stick your nose where it’s not wanted? (I say the last part because if he wanted you to know, he would’ve told you himself).
And considering he’s in early stage dementia, do you really want that to be one of his last memories? He’s probably more likely to get aggitated, in fact, due to the nature of such a condition.
This is a very bad idea. He doesn’t need to tell you ANYTHING and he shouldn’t have to! Leave the man his privacy. If he had wanted you to know definitively one way or the other, he’d have told you! Leave him be.