Alas and alack. I didn’t even get a “Zeke has been suspended” note in this forum. I’m somewhat saddened by that.
The suspension was unfair. Here was the sequence of events.
1)I guess I crossed a line (apparently one can be insulted repeatedly but one may not respond in kind) and immediately after submitting my final post I got a PM informing me of the a warning.
2)I told [Idle Thoughts that I didn’t understand why others were allowed to slag me but I wasn’t allowed to slag back BUT I would abide. I further said that I had just made a post and since it was sent before I got the notice I hoped it would not be held against me or be considered ignoring mod instructions. I sent the PM.
3)I got a VBulletin message thing saying I was suspended for 2 days.
I’m not arguing with the warning. I don’t think it was warranted but TPTB did and c’est la vie. I’m not even really arguing with the suspension (because what good would it serve?)
But I will say that it sucks to be busted for violating a ruling that I hadn’t had a chance to read.
Again, the warning was given while I was writing. As soon as I got the warning (via PM) I replied and said I would abide. As soon as I sent the PM I was informed of my suspension.
I’m not going to reply to anything in this thread because I really don’t see that this is something worth scrapping about. It was a bad beat and that happens, suck it up buttercup (buttercup being, in this case, me). I will say that, in my opinion, it was bad form.
And, just as an FYI thing, when you are suspended you can’t even read the board. That was news to me. I had assumed that one could read but not post. Turns out not to be the case.
“I didn’t see the mod note/instruction” is not a valid reason for breaking the rules. If you had been breaking the rules already, many times, in a topic, then you should preview your post before you post it. This allows you to see any newly added posts made while you have been typing up your post.
If you think others were breaking the rules, you need to report it. There were no reports received from you in that thread. Not to mention, I think your definition of being “slagged” on and you slagging on others is vastly different. I didn’t see anyone in that topic being as snarky or insulting as you were being…not even close. Still, if you think a poster or post needs to be looked at then report it rather than reply with insults, because you’ll be the one getting in trouble–either by yourself or along with the other person–if you respond in kind.
Well, I’ll take your word for it, I just didn’t remember seeing a report from you. I guess I’m mistaken.
If no action was taken, then the mods didn’t agree with you that a rule had been broken.
Your posts, however, rose to the level of needing a warning. You are within your rights to defend yourself, but you need to not insult others while doing so. You may feel others were insulting you, but nowhere in that thread did I see anyone breaking the rules for insults other than you…so it’s possible you just needed to take a step back to cool off, which I tried to give you.
My suggestion to you is one I’ve given posters many times: It’s always better to err on the side of caution and use the Pit if you find yourself getting that upset or heated up or feel that other posters are needling you or insulting you, especially if you report posts but no mod action is taken, because that means there wasn’t a mod that agreed with you. When/if that is the case, it’s better to Pit those posters you feel are being out of line just so you don’t run afoul of any rules yourself.
That’s a judgement call, and you’re not the judge. Actually, yours is the first suspension I remember seeing for name-calling like you did. Usually, repeat name-callers are banned.
The moderation here is uneven, but IMO it’s mostly OK. The only warning I ever got was IMO ridiculous; I think the mod’s mother-in-law must have been visiting that day. On the other hand, every so often I forget which forum I’m in and do clearly violate the rules, and I haven’t got a warning for that yet, although I’ve gotten a few “no warning issued”'s. So I guess it evens out.
Since I already broke my own prohibition I guess I’ll do it again.
So, I didn’t receive (not see, but receive mind you) the warning until after I’d made a post violating it doesn’t wash but “I just didn’t remember seeing a report from you. I guess I’m mistaken.” Somehow does? How can a mod that doesn’t recall seeing a report disagree with the report?
The tone toward me was, from many insulting, derisive and aggressive and dismissive from the start. I responded in kind.
Did I break the rules? You say I did and I have not once disputed it. I did then and do now accept the warning. I replied to your PM respectfully and calmly. I accepted your ruling and said I would obey. And then I got smacked.
You chose not to reply to the PM I sent accepting your restrictions. That’s cool. I PM’d you when I got back just to say I didn’t think it was good form and I got snark in return.
As to “but nowhere in that thread did I see anyone breaking the rules for insults” really? I was called laughable, ignorant, pointlessly contrarian, stupid, a troll (that one you did jump on - thank you) and a number of other things.
I became insulting once I started to get insulted. One poster said something to the effect of “Owing to your ignorance I’m going to dismiss you” this isn’t insulting, being a jerk or threadshitting? That is the post I reported.
I didn’t dispute the warning I did say that I thought the suspension was unfair owing to the sequence of events but I also said I wasn’t going to fight it.
You seem to be taking this somewhat personally and it isn’t personal at all.
I wasn’t snarky at all in my PM reply to you, in either of the two I sent tonight. I’m sorry you took or read it as such. Both just gave you suggestions on what you should have done and basically said what I said in both of my replies in here. There is absolutely nothing personal in this matter for me.
Anyway, there’s not much else to say barring repeating myself. This is probably my last reply to this thread.
Just keep insults in the Pit and report posts you think are insulting you. If no action is taken, start a Pit thread, don’t start flinging snarky replies everywhere.
I guess I’d have linked to the Zeke has been suspended notice (which would have linked to the reasons for it) but there wasn’t one.
Here is the thread in question I think I got bounced somewhere on page three.
Just to be clear - I did insult posters. Many of them. I did break the rules. I’m not disagreeing with the warning. I’m not even really disagreeing with the suspension. I am saying that, given the sequence of events the suspension was a bit heavy handed.
I was replying to posts from multiple people and replying to PMs. When the warning was issued I was mid response. I posted the response - pm notifications don’t pop up while you are posting - got the warning, and said I’d abide - I did it via pm because I wasn’t allowed to post to the thread - and as soon as I sent the pm I got my suspension notice.
I felt I was attacked and insulted first, I did report a post but got no response because it got missed I guess - so says Idle Thoughts - and I attacked and insulted back.
Again, I am not fighting the warning. I’m not even really fighting the suspension. My whole point was that, given how things happened the suspension heavy-handed.
And, after my suspension I continued to be attacked and insulted.
You know I thought that you had crossed a line in that thread and that I anticipated a bannination. Perhaps you should consider yourself lucky to have got off so lightly.
Zeke, you’ve spoken of the sense of being bullied, I understand that, but I know you are not wholly right. My contributions there were no part of a pile-on, in fact I have a great deal of sympathy for the POV that the Beatles are over-rated.
You have a particular style that invites polarised comments, if you insist on being so strident and hyperbolic, others are going to respond with increasing edginess and snark – if you want to keep your style, you’re going to have to accept that snark.
The posts insulting you after your suspension were made while the thread was still in the Pit, so they were within the rules of that forum. Miller moved it back to Cafe Society yesterday, so nobody insulted you after he did that.
Great Unwashed Thank-you. I appreciate and agree with everything that you said. If I recall you said the same in a rather prescient PM which I, to my detriment(?) didn’t heed and so I got 2 days in the dock.
Yeah, about that, I thought there was some sort of policy around here that threads get locked once the OP has been suspended or banned in order to prevent the defenseless from being thumped upon in their absence.
In fact, in PM my response to the warning, I asked for precisely that and for that reason. Instead it got moved to the pit after my banning and then, once Miller decided that the only not nice person was gone he moved it back to Café Society so the thumping could continue unabated.
I don’t see how any thumping can continue once it’s back in Cafe Society. In fact, IvoryTowerDenizen made it a point to remind people that insults were no longer permissible, and if anyone had a problem with another poster, to take it to the Pit. So it seems like Miller cut you a break by moving it back to CS where people can’t continue to thump on you.
I didn’t get an email alert about a report from you and don’t see a report logged in the moderation forum. I got other reports that night- did you use the report button?
As the OP of the thread you knew exactly what forum you started it is, and knew any insults were off limits. That you didn’t see IT warning before you insulted again is no defense. You can’t even claim you forgot what forum it was in.
The purpose of the suspension was a cooling off period before you racked up too many warnings or crossed a line, like insulting a mod. That you were tossing off insulting posts without reading the thread is a clear example of why you needed the suspension.
Thing is, it’s a very cool thread and I’ve learned a lot. The topic (is there evidence that The Beatles should be called the greatest band) is a great one, worth discussing. It’s just the insults and personal way you were discussing it that causes problems.
I did not see other posters attacking you. I saw frustrated posts and a lot of passionate debate.
As another CS mod I think Idle Thoughts suspension was spot on as a cool down, and I hope the interesting discussion can go on.
You lobbed a lot of insults and name calling in a forum where such is forbidden. Moving it to the pit, so those you slagged can reply in kind and NOT break the rules was definitely the right move.
Are you saying, ‘I broke the rules, insulted others and called people names, but I should have been able to avoid any reciprocity by asking to have the thread closed?’ That seems kinda unreasonable. I think you’re being purposely obtuse here.
Yup I used the report button. I don’t know why it didn’t get to you guys but I guess it didn’t.
I didn’t claim I didn’t know what forum it was in. I said I was attacked and insulted and I responded. I was respectful to those who were respectful and I wasn’t to those who weren’t.
I read and replied to cites that were given (the first couple of times they were given) and I got pissy after having the same - demonstrably false - claims kept coming back up. I don’t expect you to re-read the whole thread in order to see that - though you can if you want I guess.
Again, I don’t say that I didn’t deserve a warning. I don’t say I didn’t deserve the suspension. I do say that, the way things worked, I really had no chance to abide by the warning. By the time I received the notification of the warning it was already too late.
I said I would abide and I would have. I just got bounced before I could demonstrate that.
As far as not noticing other posters attacking me, I’m not going to spend the next hour or so dragging up quotes to support my assertion. If you don’t see it then cool beans. Idle Thoughts used one of them in my warning (the one from Mean Mister Mustard. If you don’t see that as an insult or attack then I suppose we’ll agree to disagree.
Nope, not at all.
I did break the rules. I did deserve a warning. Maybe I even deserved a suspension. I’ve not denied that.
I got hit, I hit back. I got busted. Cool. Hakuna matada.
I asked for the thread to be closed because I had thought, I guess erroneously, that once a poster is rendered defenseless their thread is shut to prevent one-sided thumpings.
Pixels can attack and pixels can say whatever they like. You guys don’t know me and I don’t know you. We are all pixels and none of us matter much to the others in real life (with the exception of those of you who are actual friends and have a relationship beside this place.)
But I hardly think that my conduct or posting history here suggests an unwillingness to engage or a fear of reciprocity - so long as my hands aren’t tied.
My hands got tied, the thread got moved to the Pit AFTER my hands were tied, I had asked for the same courtesy that I had, up until now, thought was policy here - if a poster is unable to defend themselves the thread is closed.
I was wrong about that I guess.
I think moving it to the Pit while I was suspended was maybe a bit outside and I think Miller bringing it back and explicitly saying that it was because the one mean person was gone was perhaps a bit much.
Now if other people don’t see that there were attacks and insults launched at me that’s cool. But just because you don’t see it doesn’t mean it isn’t there. I think it’s called microaggression.
Would you have risen to it? Clearly not. But I saw it and I replied in kind - just more overtly.
So the rule appears to be that you can slag someone so long as you are in the majority and you couch it in barely less blatant ways.
Again, cool beans.
Like I’ve said, I don’t have my nuts in a knot about this, I’ve lost no sleep yet and don’t expect I will in days to come. I’m not arguing about the warning or the suspension. I just think the suspension was unneeded since my reply to the warning was complete complicity. Had the suspension not come down right on top of the warning I’d not have been suspended.
By the time I got the warning it was too late. C’est la vie.
It doesn’t matter if you saw the warning. You were given a time out because you were continuing behavior that was far out of bounds for most of the board and particularly the forum you were in. A short cooling off period is not often done but is sometimes used to keep long time posters from totally flaming out when they get too worked up on a particular subject. You could have been given more rope and then you would have that announcement thread you seem to regret not getting.
This is the crux of the biscuit, here. If you feel you’re being insulted - outside the Pit - it is never a good idea to reply in kind. You’ve been here long enough to know that.
As for whether the suspension was ‘heavy handed’? We elected to give you a short time out to cool off. You didn’t get a month that could potentially lead to a ban or anything similar. It was just a chance for you to cool off and return to the thread in a better place.
