So, is it possible to get some DIPLOMACY advice?

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

Just starting my first Diplomacy game. I pulled Russia and the first dead line is on Tuesday.

The plan so far

F Sev-BLA
A Mos-StP
A War-Gal
F StP-BOT

The background: Austria wants to bounce me in Gal and I’ve gotten a good contact with Turkey but we arrange to bounce in BAL all the same just in case some one cries JUGGERNAUGT if we don’t. After that we will see what happens but seem to have a good communication.

Turkey suggests that we split up the Balkans A-Ser, T-Bul and R-Rum. I’ll have to take it in the autumn with my fleet. Might be stood off here by either T or A I guess.

I should get Sweden so that I get at least one build.

The plan is then to demilitarize the BAL and then head NW.

I’m desperate to get of to a good start in my first game. So I want to ask you guys with experience. Should I try for the Juggernaugt directly? Am I setting myself up here but can’t see it? How’s this for a plan?

2

I would set up a Jugg (if he’s amenable) right away.

For what it’s worth I find those ‘planned bounces’ to be long-term counterproductive. It ties up a unit (for both parties) that could be better spent positioning for later turns. In my experience that always comes back to haunt you.

So if he’s amenable to the Juggernaut then make him commit. And agreeing to give anything to Austria is sort of counter to the Juggernaut, isn’t it? If he’s making nice with Austria where else can he go? Through you.

Be warned.

3

I should have known I couldn’t beat the Chance here.

I’m not as much against the bounce in some situations. It does tie up units, but failure to bounce in certain territories (primarily the Black Sea) telegraphs immediately an alliance, or at least non-aggression. That will guarantee an alliance between Italy and Austria. With Italy’s two fleets heading immediately east, that can really slow down Turkey.

In the English Channel, as a contrast, lack of a bounce does not necessarily mean an alliance. There are directions for either of them to go without necessarily working together. Plus, E & F alliances won’t turn the whole board against you like a R & T might.

How well do you trust Turkey?

You are starting out pretty weak in the south there. If Austria Turkey get together, they could bounce you out of Rumania quite easily, or even give it to either one of them. If they have any brains at all, they’ll be in contact with Germany, and have him move F Kiel-Denmark, and then bounce you out of Sweden, leading to No builds for the Tsarists in the first year. Disaster.

I would seriously consider moving Moscow to Ukraine, to support your fleet into Rumania in the fall. That way, if Turkey reneges and moves into the Black in the fall, Sev would be open for a build of a fleet if necessary.

The T & R alliance is best done if nobody notices it until it’s too late. If you can somehow arrange for your fleet to take one of Turkey’s territories in the spring and for him to retake it in the fall, you accomplish two things. One, you hide your alliance. Two, you get rid of your Black Sea fleet, allowing Turkey to safely take his fleets into the Med.

I’m a big fan of Russia/Italy. You can pretty much divide up Austria, and then go into Turkey. Also, if you decide to stab Turkey, having Italy in his rear would be a big help.

4

What these guys said. The Juggernaut’s awesome if you get it rolling before the Westerners can stop squabbling, and it favours Russia more than Turkey in the longer term. Try to get Germany to agree not to open F Den-Swe. Bonus: if he agrees, then he’s an idiot, ripe for the crushing :slight_smile: :smiley: :wink:

Check out The Diplomatic Pouch for absolutely stacks of reading matter. I gotta try out some of the variants they’ve got there! :cool:

5

I might just start one of those for the dopers.

Who’s interested?

6

If you feel you’re set in the north, then it would be much better to move Mos-Ukr to make sure of Rumania and to give yourself some protection in case A/T have teamed up. Also you’re fairly well protected if Germany goes nuts and decides to rush east.

7

I, like ppg_shg, don’t favor the Gal bounce for Russia. I think it favors Austria FAR more than Russia, and makes your southern opening weak, inviting A/T against you. My personal thought regarding the southern relationship as R or T is to pick an ally – either the other half of the Juggernaught or Austria – and stick with him for the first couple of years. Letting the Balkans get all messy doesn’t help anyone, and as Russia you don’t want to get drawn into fighting on too many fronts as you’ve automatically got at least 2 to worry about.

I hate planned bounces too. Particularly for Turkey, who has a hard enough time getting out of the gate as it is, wasting a unit languishing behind the lines is very damaging.

Regarding Germany and Malacandra’s comments, I don’t think there’s necessarily anything wrong with opening F to Hol instead of to Den. It’s pro-Russia, sure, but that’s not a bad thing, and it gives him veto power in the lowlands. Opening to Den and bouncing Russia in Sweden has fallen out of favor but evidently was quite common in years past.

Just some random thoughts from somebody who’s not too good at this game himself.

8

Yeah, but you’re so cute we like you anyway, Lightnin’.

9

My take on the situation is that if you’re opening to the north like you’ve suggested, I think you’d better be damn sure that it pays off quickly. Like everyone else has said, there’s no such thing as a peaceful beginning to A/R/T. The planned split of the Balkans may happen in 1901, but you’d better be planning on the next step. There’s too many units committed to the area for everyone to pick a different enemy and peacefully part ways. So, if you’re not planning on a stab in 1902, I promise you they are planning on stabbing you.

That leaves you with a couple options, open to the south and take the controlling position and pick your ally. (I prefer Turkey, unless Italy has a juicy plan and seems trustworthy) If you open north, be sure to marry one of the southern powers and offer them the lions share of the spoils to ensure that you’re not the odd man out. Once you’ve gotten your 2 builds and are in control in the north, then you worry about renegotiating and making things more equitable in the south.

What’s the background with you and England and/or Germany? The northern opening is a threat to them both, but England is certain to get feisty as a result. If he opens south you might just make out like a bandit. The last thing you want is a 2-front battle.

10

Thanks a bunch for the input. I starting to think I should go with the Romanian opening here.

I better write a new mail to Germany to get a grip on him…

11

One of what? I might very well be :cool:

12

Ok, you’ve got to be exceedingly careful. If Austria and Turkey are in collusion, you are in big trouble. Don’t trust the Turk, and no matter what you do, don’t let him take BLA. This is imperative, and worht going to war over if you have to.

Cement an alliance with either Austria, or Turkey. You can’t have both. If they are both seemingly open to the idea, get ready to get stabbed.

Start dipping with England. If you’re going to get into a conflict in the South, you need your north free, or at least not heavily involved.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

13

I’d sure be up for another game, JC.

14

You always were a kinky sod JC. I’d be up for a variant.