Survivor - 12/14

Cafe Society
41

[QUOTE=John Mace]
Good episode, considering the low probability for surprises. I think Yul made a wise move in choosing Parvati (even though I said last week he should go after Adam). She’s actually better, all around, at the challenges than Adam is-- witness her performance last night. Also, it breaks up a potential chick-alliance sometime down the road.

But Adam is suddenly in a pretty powerful position. His move should be to approach Ozzy and Sundra to convince them to vote off Becky. Yul is untouchable in the next IC, but they can weaken him considerably in the IC after that by getting rid of his strongest ally. Then, going into the FF, if Yul doesn’t win IC he gets booted. Ozzy and Sundra must know that Yul is tighter with Becky than with either of them, so this is their best shot to get the F3, without Yul.

So, Does Yul anticipate this and secretly give Becky the HII before tribal council next week (assuming she doesn’t win the IC)? I think he needs to consider that option **very **seriously.

It’s interesting how the producers haven’t shown any discussion among the remaining Survivors about the jury situation and the fact that something different has to happen. There’s no way they haven’t figured that out and talked about it. I guess they want to save the “surprise” for the finale.

Can’t wait 'til Sunday-- this is going to be good!
[/QUOTE]

Except again, I can’t see a single way that Yul fails to make the final three no matter what you do. The existence of the HII means that someone in your proposed Anti-Yul alliance has to be willing to get voted out just to get rid of Yul’s idol (to take one for the team, as I said before).

So say Adam, Sundra, and Ozzy team up and vote out Becky next, leaving Yul, Adam, Sundra, and Ozzy as F4. Yul’s idol is good up to and including F4, so he’s into the F3. Adam, Sundra, and Ozzy could theoretically get rid of idol at the next TC, if one of them was sacrificed, and depending on the rules. All three could vote for Yul, and then whoever Yul and Becky target goes home but at least the HII is out of the picture. But why would Sundra or Ozzy put themselves at risk when the safest play is vote with Yul and Becky for Adam?

They won’t, so Yul is in to the F4 with idol and partner intact, and thus into F3.

Given that Yul is certain to make F3, everyone else should just be ignoring him and jockeying to be one of the other two. Count him as a given, because you’re not getting rid of him, and find a way to outlast the other three remaining.

Actually, looking back, I wonder if Jonathan’s best play back after Yul told him about the HII wouldn’t have been to vote with Raro anyway (but let Yul and the other Aitus think he was voting for Nate). He could have simply walked up to the voting booth and voted the opposite way, but otherwise done everything exactly the same as he did. Nate still would have gone home, yes. But Yul’s HII would have been burned away in the process. Jonathan wouldn’t have alienated Candice, Parvati, and Adam, and would have been proven right - and might have been able to join with the three of them, draw in Ozzy, and vote out Yul at the subsequent TC as the biggest threat to win.

Hm.

42

[QUOTE=Ethilrist]
Which, technically, is a spoiler.
[/QUOTE]

:smack:

43

I absolutely cannot stand Parvati, but I have to give the girl her props. Not only is she a legitimate threat in every challenge, but the past several challenges she’s competed in have been with a partially severed thumb (and one of those challenges, she won!). You know that thing has to be throbbing from pain. Yet, not only is she playing and winning (or coming damn close), she hasn’t complained about it once, let alone used it as an excuse of any kind.

I’m damn glad she’s gone from the game, though.

44

[QUOTE=storyteller0910]
Except again, I can’t see a single way that Yul fails to make the final three no matter what you do. The existence of the HII means that someone in your proposed Anti-Yul alliance has to be willing to get voted out just to get rid of Yul’s idol (to take one for the team, as I said before).
[/QUOTE]

Damn!! I thought the HII was good only up to the F4, but not *including *the F4.

So, we need to add one more twist to my scenario. :slight_smile: They somehow let Yul or Becky overhear them when they’re plotting, so that Yul feels he must give Becky the HII. Then, they vote for Yul at TC and get him out with one fell swoop! But I guess that still leaves Becky with HII going into the F4…

Wow, that HII is even more powerful than I thought. I think they should not let the owner use it in the F4, to make it more interesting. The way things are, whoever gets it can pretty much control the whole game right up to the F3.

45

[QUOTE=John Mace]
Damn!! I thought the HII was good only up to the F4, but not *including *the F4.

So, we need to add one more twist to my scenario. :slight_smile: They somehow let Yul or Becky overhear them when they’re plotting, so that Yul feels he must give Becky the HII. Then, they vote for Yul at TC and get him out with one fell swoop! But I guess that still leaves Becky with HII going into the F4…

Wow, that HII is even more powerful than I thought. I think they should not let the owner use it in the F4, to make it more interesting. The way things are, whoever gets it can pretty much control the whole game right up to the F3.
[/QUOTE]

Plus, imagine how powerful it could be, in this case, if Yul happens to win immunity at F4. He would then determine, all by his lonesome, the composition of the F3, by giving away one of the two idols to the right person.

I agree with you; it would be more interesting if it expired before the F4 tribal council.

46

[QUOTE=storyteller0910]
Plus, imagine how powerful it could be, in this case, if Yul happens to win immunity at F4. He would then determine, all by his lonesome, the composition of the F3, by giving away one of the two idols to the right person.

I agree with you; it would be more interesting if it expired before the F4 tribal council.
[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I had a feeling when they first introduced the HII that once people figured out how to use it properly (as Yul has done), they’ll have to discontinue it. Or make it less powerful. Especially if they’re ending the island part of the competition at the F3!!

47

Can the HII owner hand it out to whomever he wants AFTER the vote? (i.e. block any vote without premeditation)

48

[QUOTE=Sapo]
Can the HII owner hand it out to whomever he wants AFTER the vote? (i.e. block any vote without premeditation)
[/QUOTE]

No, whoever uses the HII must have it before they get to Tribal Council.

49

First off, I want to pit CBS. I missed the show so I went to their website to watch it. What’s the first thing that pops on your screen when you go to the Survivor section? A huge banner with Parvati’s picture saying she was voted out. Gee guys, did it ever occur to you that some of us coming to your site to watch the episode might appreciate you not giving away the ending?

I’m glad Ozzy won immunity because those knuckleheads seemed to be on the verge of making a huge mistake - voting off Ozzy before Adam or Parvati. Did it occur to them that they would have cut their majority down to one vote? And if Ozzy is “iffy”, Adam and Parvati are open opponents. You take out your enemies first then your allies (admittedly they’ve already made this mistake once with Jonathan).

Funniest moment was Adam and Parvati sitting around discussing their situation at the start of the show. “We’re in trouble.” “Yup, we need to do something.” “Yeah, like a plan or something.” “Damn, I wish one of us had a brain.”

Jeff was annoying with his needling on the hat (why didn’t Yul just point out that he had left it there anonymously?) but he made up for it with his “bad performance art” remark.

I also think that Yul’s open leadership has become part of his strategy. He wants the jury members to see that he deserves the credit and isn’t just riding along with the alliance. He has to convince them to vote for him rather than Becky or Sundra (who are inoffensive) or Ozzy (who has dominated the challenges) and his strongest selling point is portraying himself as the mastermind who outplayed everyone and essentially carried the other three along in his alliance.

50

[QUOTE=PunditLisa]
Adam and Yul are still around after how many trips to Exile Island?
[/QUOTE]
Yul’s only done one stint on exile island, and it was pretty early. Adam and Candace served exile duty something like 7 of the last 8 times, with Jonathan sneaking in there last week.

Agreed completely on Candace. She was way hotter on the show, but she wasn’t the first. I finally put it together the other day that the “hot chick” hostess on ESPN’s fantasy football show – Danni Boatwright – was a recent Survivor winner. She was way cuter in-game than she was all cleaned up at the final show. IIRC, cleaning up for her meant going all bridge-and-tunnel.

As for Parvati, I can’t say I share your catty girl-hate for her, mainly because I have too much dopey guy-lust for her. I get woozy from lack of blood to the brain when she’s on the screen. Needless to say, I’m not thrilled she’s gone.

Was Parvati the best female challenge contestant in survivor history? She swims faster than pretty much anyone I can remember on any season other than Ozzy, and as mentioned upthread a gaping thumb wound didn’t seem to slow her down at all. Very impressive. Here’s hoping she doesn’t ugly down like Candace now that she’s on the jury.

I dunno about Yul; he’s kind of a douchebag. “Don’t talk to Ozzy.” Whatever you say, sparky. As for a geek winning, isn’t “poor social skills” one of the defining characteristics of a geek? I can’t see how that would be helpful in Survivor.

At this point, I’m 99% pulling for Ozzy. That’s not a surprise to me, as I gravitate toward the players who dominate challenges. Hell, the only reason I watch the show in the first place if for the goofy physical challenges. (Hey, the RW/RR Duel is approaching the finale as well…oh the shame.) That’s why I was totally rooting for Terry the Dickhead and Fireman Tom in their respective seasons. That’s part of why I wanted to see an Ozzy/Parvati final two, though the other was just enjoying a hot chick on the screen.

sigh I feel a little like I felt when Boston Legal got rid of all three hot chicks and replaced them with Candice Bergen. WTF? Who am I supposed to drool over now? Becky? Meh. I could at least respect Parvati for being strong in the challenges, and Candace for powering through an avalanche of exiles. Becky doesn’t seem like she can formulate a coherent thought beyond “hide behind Yul.”

The other 1% of me wouldn’t hate it if Adam won, similar to how I ended up rooting for Chris when he outlasted the entire female alliance that one season. There’s something to be said for going it alone. Still, Ozzy is the only one to date who truly deserves it. He’s the only one who doesn’t seem smarmy, conceited, dumb as a box of rocks, or impotently hiding within an alliance.

51

[QUOTE=Little Nemo]
Jeff was annoying with his needling on the hat (why didn’t Yul just point out that he had left it there anonymously?) but he made up for it with his “bad performance art” remark.
[/QUOTE]

You’re not allowed to talk or communicate with the jury in any way, so Yul really couldn’t have done that. I think Jeff was helping him out, although I don’t think he should have. But how does one point out that one has done something anonymously, anyway? Once one points it out, then there’s no “anonymous” about it… right?

52

[QUOTE=John Mace]
You’re not allowed to talk or communicate with the jury in any way, so Yul really couldn’t have done that. I think Jeff was helping him out, although I don’t think he should have. But how does one point out that one has done something anonymously, anyway? Once one points it out, then there’s no “anonymous” about it… right?
[/QUOTE]

You thought Jeff was HELPING Yul? I think he was shooting him in the foot.

Yul’s bringing the hat could have either been an innocent decent gesture, for which he expected no credit, or it could have possibly been something he might have considered bringing up during the final vote (See? I’m a decent guy…). Whichever way it was intended, Jeff certainly made it look as if Yul had intentionally set it all up to make himself look good. That’s where I think Jeff is getting too much into the game. I’d rather he be an observer than inject himself so deeply into the game.

53

I was surprised Jeff even allowed Yul to return the hat, since it’s basically interacting with the jury. What’s next, everyone starts bringing little presents and leaving them for the jury “anonymously?”

There’s nothing anonymous about it anyway because whoever got voted off that night would just go back and tell the other jury members who left what, and without any further discussion of it, it might actually have influenced Jonathan.

At least this way if Jeff was going to let Yul leave the hat, he might as well try to wring some (annoying) drama out of it.

54

On Jonathan’s hat, it’s very possible that Yul did offer the same defense that others and myself have said. One of the most annoying flaws on Survivor is the way they edit out key facts in order to deceive the audience.

I agree that Parvati is damn fine looking. I’d watch a series featuring just her and that black bikini. But I figure it was all going to end this week anyway so I was willing to see her go.

Besides, Becky and Sundra are still there for me to rest my eyes on.

I think it’s very frequent. Most of the women on the show have looked better in the field than they have on the jury. Whoever the make-up people are for this show seem to love piling the crap on to these women. They take a bunch of attractive women and make them look like stepford wives.

I’ve just never seen the challenges as the main factor in the game; to me they’re secondary. This isn’t a series of atheltic contests. I’ve always thought the real play was politics; figuring out ways to convince a bunch of other people to act in ways that benefit you. Yul is far and away the best politician in this game and, for that, I think he deserves the big prize.

55

[QUOTE=Little Nemo]
I agree that Parvati is damn fine looking. I’d watch a series featuring just her and that black bikini.
[/QUOTE]

Heck, I’d watch even if she wasn’t wearing anything!

56

On the “hotter on the show” thing, you also have Stefanie from Palau and Guatemala. On the show she was an athletic, very attractive woman. At the reunion show, she looked like she should be hanging out at a mall in Jersey.

57

Let’s start some jury speculation:

Brad: Adam voted against him. Was on the original tribe with Yul and Becky and seemed to get along okay with them.
Rebecca: Adam voted against her. Was close to Sundra early in the game.
Jenny: Another negative for Adam. Was on the original tribe with Yul and Becky and seemed to get along okay with them.
Nathan: Likes Adam and Ozzy. Often targeted women.
Candice: A guaranteed vote for Adam. If he’s gone, a toss-up.
Jonathan: Most likely to Yul.
Parvati: Another Adam vote. If he goes, may vote for Ozzy, Becky, or Sundra.

And of those who might be joining the jury (all predictions subject to change due to last minute betrayals):

Adam: Would probably try to vote for himself. After that a toss-up. Porbably Ozzy because he’s the guy who’s most like him.
Becky: Most likely Yul with a possibility of Sundra.
Ozzy: The lone wolf. Impossible to predict how he’ll vote.
Sundra: Probably Becky with a chance of Yul.
Yul: Becky or a slight chance of Ozzy.

58

I give up – what does this mean?

59

[QUOTE=squeegee]
I give up – what does this mean?
[/QUOTE]

She had her teeth fixed and they gave her a douche. :stuck_out_tongue:

60

[QUOTE=squeegee]
I give up – what does this mean?
[/QUOTE]

“Bridge and tunnel” is a disparaging way Manhattanites refer to people from Brooklyn, Queens, NJ etc.–no matter how they try to clean up, they’re still pale imitations of “real” NYers. :rolleyes:

Anyhoo–

I have always been a fan of Jeff’s manipulations–as long as it was simply putting a spin on facts already out there. But this little stunt with the hat was waaaay out of line! When the players entered TC, Yul placed the hat on the bench before the jury entered, and I thought, “OK, that was classy. Just return Jonathan’s hat anonymously, and there’s no controversy about currying favor with any jury members.” And then, Jeff outs him when that’s the last thing Yul wanted. There’s a line between stoking a fire and pouring gasoline on it, and Jeff crossed it BIG TIME!

Now, I’ll grant you, the show’s been pretty predictable so far and could probably benefit from a little controversy, but this was the wrong way to do it. It was cheap and tacky…and if I wanted that, I would have watched Temptation Island ! :eek:

That being said, I am 100% in favor of Ozzy winning the million. IMHO, no one else even comes close to deserving the big prize. Not even Yul, whose whole game seems to have consisted of “I have the HII, you can’t vote me out, THHHPPPPT!”

You talk about Sundra being under the radar, but how about Becky? I can’t think of a more useless, undeserving coattail rider since I don’t know when! (OK, maybe Amber, but it was too satisfying to see her win over Rob to complain.) Adam is the biggest dope in the Final Five since Ian (sorry, rockle ), but at least Dolphin Boy had some physical abilities.