Tell me about removing a parent from your life

In My Humble Opinion
1

My father is a textbook narcissist. Nothing is ever his fault; he never does anything wrong; and even if you had his fingerprints on the smoking gun, he would say “that’s not what I intended to do” and expect to get away with murder. I’m going to be thirty in a few months, and his attitudes and behaviors are strewn across the wreckage of my childhood and teenage years, and only recently have I been able to pull away from his negative influence.

The most recent go-round started because he insists on “disciplining” (read - yelling at) my three-year-old every single time we go to his house, for perfectly normal toddler behavior. I’m always in the room, and yet he yells over me because he thinks it will get better/faster results. This scares my son, who begins crying; and then he yells at him for crying!

Fast-forward to a week later, and I have been treated to no fewer than five pages of vitriol aimed at my mother and all of her shortcomings and failings as a wife and mother. All because I mentioned something that her psychiatrist said (according to her, that is).

I am done. He is absolutely insistent that he has never done anything wrong EVER and if he did, well it was all just a misunderstanding and he didn’t mean it so I shouldn’t take it that way and why am I not over this yet??

It took my mother twenty years of marriage to realize that she was never going be able to change herself enough to be able to cope with him. To be sure - she was NOT an angel or a saint! She had serious mental health issues, and still fights them to this day. However, she’s perfectly willing to discuss the past in a fairly rational manner, and admits that she screwed up just as much as he did. She admits it, and is sorry for it, and has moved foward to try to heal the hurts she was part of causing. He was just the victim of crazy woman.

I am ready to cut the ties, once and for all. Thirty years is certianly enough, and I don’t want to spend the rest of my life wondering what he’s going to go ballistic over next, and waiting for him to see someone else’s side of things for once.

How do you do it? Make an announcement; don’t return calls; send a letter?

2

You do it however feels good to you. You cannot do anything for him now, and you do not owe him anything - your priority now is your child. He is bad for you.

If you want to tell him that you are not talking to him, I suggest a letter. And stop answering the calls, now and forever more. You may consider changing your number.

In my cases, my parents were extremely persistent. They showed up at my job on multiple occasions, humiliated me in front of my boss, and at least one time gripped my arm hard enough to leave bruises as they tried to bodily drag me out.

They called day and night. The only way I was able to get them to leave me alone was to threaten to call the cops on their harassment tactics. In truth it was a desperate ploy on my part and I never thought I could actually do it - but they immediately pulled back as if they’d been burnt.

You know your dad best, and what will work best.

3

There’s a thread over in MPSIMS started last week by someone who was talking about her totally overbearing, smothering mother. A number of good resources were mentioned in that thread. It’s not quite the same situation but you might find them helpful if you check them out, as they’re about setting boundaries. Your ideal boundary might be never seeing or speaking to him again, or you might decide on an occasional phone call, or something like that. Whatever it is, advice on setting the boundary and sticking to it can help.

If there’s anyone in your life who’s still putting up with him, be ready to discover that they’ll still interact with him, to the point of excluding you from family gatherings instead of excluding him. I’ve seen it in my husband’s family, over their father, and compared it to “Stockholm Syndrome.” Some abused people take the side of the abuser because he’s got the power, and no one else protects them.

4

Good advice, Ferret. It can be as simple as not calling/returning phone calls or visiting. If you know there is no discussion to be had, you don’t have to have one - just set your own boundaries and stick with them. It doesn’t have to be all-or-nothing, either - maybe you see him occasionally without inflicting him on your son. Maybe you don’t see him at all. You’d know best what you’re willing to do. You don’t need to feel guilty about this, either - like you say, you’ve tried for 30 years. Some people are just too toxic to have in your life.

5

Bear in mind that if you attempt to shut him out, he may attempt to sue for grandparent visitation. The requirements and conditions therefor will vary from state to state, and it may not be available in all states, but you might want to look into it before making any decisions.

6

And of course, if you do opt for some contact, you don’t have to put up with anything during the visit/phone call/whatever. You can say something like, “I have to be going now” or “This isn’t working” or “I won’t have you yell at me/my child” or whatever if the behavior goes outside acceptable bounds, then leave/hang up. Try again when you feel like it. You might be lucky enough to redirect him into “behaving” while you’re around.

There’s no reason to not cut him off completely if he’s very toxic. I feel sick that my husband’s siblings let their kids be exposed to their abusive father; at least he wasn’t sexually abusive - that he or I know of - but he still causes damage.

7

It can be a wise and proper choice to cut someone out of the family this way. Making and accepting no invitations may be enough - of course, any proactive move can also be seen as another step in the dance, too.

People are not entitled to be part of your family without regard to any of their actions. To think otherwise is crazy.

Good luck.

8

Pronoun abuse! Let me try to rephrase: “I feel sick that my husband’s siblings let their kids be exposed to an abusive grandfather; at least the guy wasn’t sexually abusive - that my husband or I know of - but still caused damage in the grandkids’ lives, mentally and emotionally.”

9

Good luck with this. My husband achieved it by moving to the other side of the planet, but I’m sure it can be done with less extreme actions.

Just as a slight aside, how good would you say you are at setting boundaries? Are you clear about what things you will and won’t tolerate from other people (not just your dad) and are you prepared to act accordingly?

10

This is not legal advice, and not intended to insult Oak up there personally, but if you are in the United States, the advice above is somewhere between “very unlikely” and “paranoid.” You’ve got enough to worry about, most likely, without worrying about this. cite

Good luck.

11

I disagree. If there is some animosity between the grandparent and the parent, a suit for grandparent visitation might be brought, if allowable under local law. I’ve seen it happen in my state. I’m not saying it is especially likely, just that it is possible, and one factor that should be considered prior to deciding to cut the grandparent out entirely.

12

I haven’t had anything to do with my brother and sister since 1980. If you were serious about cutting ties you DO IT. You don’t play games by writing letters or making announcement.

The fact that you’re even considering that leaves me to think you’re not serious. You don’t want a dissolution of the relationship, but you want to strike another punch.

But this is your decision and your life and I would like you to think about something.

You don’t hve to LIKE someone in order to LOVE them.

You’re not a kid. You can make boundaries and make others respect those. You’re an adult you can do that.

Now sometimes a total break is the only answer. It’s your choice.

You’re gonna make a lot of decisions in your life, but one thing I know for certain, you will never be happy with the choices you make because of anger and made out of spite

Good luck

13

Tap-dancing penguin, clown in a frog costume, and one of those pie-throwers. Oh, and balloons, make sure there’s plenty of balloons. Figure out the card on the way over.

14

Really? It suggests to me only that she simply doesn’t know what the best way to do it is. That’s why she’s asking for advice in the first place.
The only insight I will offer to the OP is this: You will probably feel guilty about this. Expect it and be prepared to deal with it. But don’t let it influence your decision.

Good luck.

15

I would suggest consulting a therapist for assistance in dealing with your history and managing your relationship with your parents, including the breaking of contact if need be.

16

This. Your first obligation is to yourself and your kid. Keep that in mind if you’re contemplating backing down. Your father is old enough to deal with the break; you have to look out for your own best interest.

And find ways of keeping your mother in your life. You apparently are on good terms with her, and she needs you. But don’t back down if she tries to reunite you with your dad.

17

Harsh as Markxxx sounds, at the core, he’s right. The way to get people out of your life is to never allow any contact with them, ever again.

If they force the contact on you, you take Anaamika’s tact and say NOTHING to them except that if they keep harassing you, you’ll seek legal action against them.

Right now, it sounds like you’re trying to get used to the idea. You’d really, really like to find a way to deal with him in which he can’t cross your boundaries. I wish you luck in finding that, but it doesn’t sound likely. The guy has a pervasive personality problem, and he’s had it for decades longer than you’ve been alive.

I was in a six-year relationship with a narcissist. When I tried to get away from him, I made the mistake of “talking it through” for several months. All that accomplished was hours and hours of work and free time being taken from me, and me feeling emotionally flayed, to the point where I would throw up. Blocking his email and phone with no explanation was the only thing that worked. Even then, he took a long time to catch on.

Too bad he’s now a consultant for the business I work for.

18

I’m not saying this is the best way, but it is the way I did it.

After the last straw, I dropped a very direct letter in his mailbox. The letter explained that I did not want to see him anymore and that I did not feel we were good influences in each others’ lives. However I wasn’t willing at the time (I was only 22) to cut him off without recourse, so I said I would consider seeing him again if he would go to family therapy to work to resolve the deep and ongoing issues. If he did not want to, I asked he simply not contact me again.

He did contact me and agreed to therapy. One of my sisters also attended. However, he was a complete goon during the entire process. It exemplified the entire problem - anything I would bring up, he would simply claim did not happen, or that he did not remember it, or that we were misremembering.

After a few sessions, we broke it off. I don’t remember who did it, but it was probably me. We all agreed that it wasn’t getting anywhere, there wasn’t anyone who wanted to keep going.

He tried to talk to me a few times after that, some months later – in his typical fashion, he just wanted to ignore everything that happened. I avoided him and told him I didn’t want any contact. This was difficult for awhile until I got my own place (I was cohabiting with my mom and two sisters during the break, and my sisters were still speaking with him at that time). After that, I ran into him precisely once (at an event for my sister), he cornered me and I tried to keep the conversation as brief as possible. I have not spoken to him since.

My father never really believed that was the end, at least that’s what he told my sisters, he just pretended that none of it ever happened. Eventually, my sister who attended the therapy cut him off (within a few years). A few years after that, his wife told my other sister to go screw, basically. None of us have contact with him.

It was not an easy decision and maybe it was not even the right one, but I have never once regretted it. We simply could not get along and there were no positive aspects to our relationship. My childhood memories of him are nearly uniformly negative. I despised him as a child and had no bond with him as an adult. I’m glad he is out of my life. My best advice is if you find no positive aspect to the relationship that you should not continue it.

19

Avarie, honey, I went through almost the same thing not long ago, plus I’m about your age. My mother is … well, I don’t want to derail the thread with all that crap about her. But she is toxic, narcissistic, and all those other wonderful things, and I am amazed that anyone thought it would be a good idea for her to be in charge of a child (me).

Your father sounds like he cannot be left unsupervised with your son, and most likely shouldn’t be around him supervised, either. So, for the time being, he and your son should not be in direct contact.
That’s the simple part.

Your relationship with him, on the other hand, doesn’t sound so cut-and-dry.

Before I cut things off entirely with my mother, I was going through a last-ditch phase where I tried to set boundaries. Having never encountered such a thing with me, my mother reacted as if I’d started speaking in Swahili to her. But I learned a few coping mechanisms, and maybe they’ll work better for you:

  • Phone calls are great, better than in-person stuff, because you can (gasp!) actually get off the phone. You can try to re-train your father when he gets nasty with this handy phrase: “If we can’t have a pleasant conversation, then we’re not going to have one at all.” Then say good bye and hang up. It’s possible that if he realizes that this is what you’re going to do every single time he gets nasty on the phone, he’ll modify his behavior somewhat.

  • Consistency is key. It’s like training a puppy. When you have decided on a boundary, then you hold that up. Every single time. Even on weekends and holidays. Even Christmas!

  • Your expectations may need to be modified somewhat. You have to learn to expect that this asshole behavior is, well, to be expected. For me, I kept thinking that if only I phrased something in some certain magical way, if I only did this or that or the other, then I could get through to her, could change her. I finally got it through my thick skull that this was how she was always going to treat me. Expect reality, not what you’d like to have happen.

  • There’s no etiquette here. Miss Manners never wrote a guide. You’re simply doing what’s right by YOU. You’re doing what you feel is best. There’s no right answer. There’s not even a best answer. Just you handling the circumstances you’ve been handed as best you can at the moment.

You’re in charge here. You can make this as abrupt or as gradual as you like. But keep in mind: you are in charge of your own happiness and your own mental health. You’re also in charge of your son’s happiness and mental health. You are not, however, in charge of your father’s happiness nor his mental health; that’s his business.

I’ll post back if I have more thoughts. Good luck. Like the other Dopers said, there’ll be guilt no matter what you do. Mother’s Day - or Father’s Day, for you - become a bit difficult. There’s so much fake saccharine going around then. But then, Mother’s Day was always fraught - nothing I got her was ever good enough! (sigh)

20

It seems that the straw that broke the camel’s back is entirely fixable: he yelled at your kid. The other stuff is odd, but what the hell, that isn’t as immediately important.

Tell your Dad this: “This is my child and you will not ever yell at my child, or hit, or threaten or be sarcastic. I acknowledge that is, for you, the wrong way to raise a child, but I choose to be wrong. If you ever do anything like that again, I will beat the shit out of you then and there old man. I will rip off your head and shit down your neck. I will feed you your fucking genitals. This is the way it is going to be and there will be no questions about it. Now, are you stupid enough to have any questions or confusion about these procedures?” Do this with your hands on him and at the top of your voice. Spit in his face while screaming this at him.

When he is somewhat silent after this treatment, ask calmly and sweetly: “We both understand that you are right and I am wrong, but we are going to do this my way with my child, don’t we?” If he answers “yes”, say “good” and move on.

He is just a narcissist and a bully. But narcissists and bullies recognize the big dog when they encounter one. Even an idiot knows never to screw with a bear and its cubs, even a cuddly bear.