The ARG220 Thread, Part 2

Adam & Poly: I was just wondering what Poly meant. As the statement was worded, it could be construed in two different ways. I’d like to think that Adam finally hit a right answer and that the “they” Poly referred to was the “generic they.”

Adam: Maybe the LDS are set after all. Do you recall “by their fruits shall ye know them” or “whosoever comforts the afflicted comforts me?” (That last one may be a paraphrase.) “Silly six percent,” huh? Gee, I guess you don’t feel compelled “to feast upon every word of the Scriptures.” At least not the ones that are too hard to read. Also, I’m starting to think you’re getting lessons in the English language from Ben Abbatte and Clay. Nobody said anything about memorizing the Bible; just reading it. Finally, there’s no way I’d accept your description of the contents of something you’ve admitted to not reading. Or don’t you recall telling us the Book of Abraham was in the Book of Mormon? And that you will never read the Book of Mormon?

Uh…I’ll try to respond, verbatim, to the posts directed at my point. This may be a bit long, so, apologies in advance to anyone who doesn’t want to wade through it.

LDS: Adam had it right. All the active latter day saints I have ever met have been very decent people who appeared to be acting out of sincere caring for their fellow man. I understand that in Utah, some of them have succumbed to the great sin of a religionist: to impose by compulsion the ethical behavior prescribed by one’s beliefs on the populace at large. So they have “blue laws” oriented towards LDS belief on what is proper/improper. But in upstate New York and eastern North Carolina they don’t have that sort of political power, and they as individuals are head and shoulders above some bigoted “orthodox” Christians in ethical behavior. That’s all I meant by what I said about “they don’t make nicer people.” (And it was the generic “they” – read it as Elohim if you like!) :slight_smile:

Adam, during World War II the Combined Chiefs of Staff (British and American) got into a massive argument about what to do with a proposed strategic plan. It turned out they all meant the same thing, but had used the verb “to table” in two different meanings (British, to lay on the table for immediate consideration; American, to lay on the table as something to be put off; the British and Americans both wanted to move forward on this plan, but the Americans misunderstood the British saying that they wanted to postpone discussion of it.

My intent was to defend to you the universality of salvation. “For God so loved the world…” I.e., there is nobody who is not a recipient of God’s love. He loves you, He loves me, He loves pagans, He loves Muslims, He loves atheists, He loved Jeffrey Dahmer and Hitler. (Past tense only because they are now deceased and we’re talking from a human perspective.)

Certainly the sinful things we do grieve Him. And certainly we can turn away from Him and reject the love He offers. And He doesn’t force anybody into Heaven.

But my point, which is shared by Paul and theologians from Augustine on down, is that it is His action which “saves us” – brings us into that relationship with Him where we reciprocate His love and find our way to Him. We are all His beloved children (with the distinction of Who Jesus was as opposed to the rest of us; don’t drag that red herring into this).

A certain man had two sons… you know the parable. But have you ever looked at it in its full context? Jesus is not so much preaching the need of the prodigal younger brother to repent and come home, as he is condemning the attitude of the older brother. And the story is told to the Pharisees, who believed that they could be saved by keeping the Law, as opposed to those other slobs who didn’t keep the Law and whom God was obviously going to condemn. Adam, my brother, the sound of your posts comes dangerously close to echoing the attitude of that older brother to many ears, including mine. I hope and want to believe that you do not mean what it sounds like you do. That is why I reacted so strongly against what you had to say about who is God’s child. What I am saying is that the prodigal never ceased being his Father’s beloved son, even when he was off living large on his inheritance. I think you can draw the proper parallel, and would agree with it.

Would you kindly explain what else I have said that “goes against God’s word” in your estimation? I ask with a touch of asperity, but with a sincere desire to know where we are at odds. I believe I can learn from you, and hope that you feel you can learn from me. And that is what I believe my Lord and Savior and yours would want us to do.

Supplied without editorial comment
THE PIOUS AND THE ATHEIST
A very religious man lived right next door to an atheist. While the religious one prayed day in, day out, and was constantly on his knees in communion with his Lord, the atheist never even looked twice at a church. However, the atheist’s life was good, he had a well-paying job and a beautiful wife, and his children were healthy and good-natured, whereas the pious man’s job was strenuous and his wages were low, his wife was cheating on him and his kids wouldn’t give him the time of the day.

So one day, deep in prayer as usual, he raised his eyes towards heaven and asked: “Oh God, I honor you every day, I ask your advice for every problem and confess to you my every sin. Yet my neighbour, who doesn’t even believe in you and certainly never prays, seems blessed with every happiness, while I go poor and suffer many an indignity. Why is this?”

And a great voice was heard from above … “BECAUSE HE DOESN’T BOTHER ME ALL THE TIME!”


The reason gentlemen prefer blondes is that there are not enough redheads to go around.

Sounds like the best reason of all to be an atheist: Barney is God!

Rich

sassy, ROTFL! ha ha.Personally,I have supported arg all over the place,but does he even say thanks or hi,no…I think he just likes to argue with folks who disagree with him.Forget your little supporter over here(myself)arg(sniff,sniff…)

Rich, that was hilarious! :slight_smile:

{{making note to re-re-reread all posts before hitting “submit” button}}}

Rich, that was hilarious! :slight_smile:

{{making note to re-re-reread all posts before hitting “submit” button}}}