The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands

[ivylass]

This is Dr. Laura’s new book. I know she’s not everyone’s cup of tea, but I admire her for her stance on what is best for children, and thinking before making important decisions.

Anyway, I picked this book up at the library and read it in about a day. It really gave me a new perspective on how Ivylad thinks and feels.

Basically, according to the book, men are really very simple creatures. They want to be loved and appreciated and not nagged. If you do that, he will swim through shark-infested waters for you.

There was one horrible story in the book about a man who worked 13 hours a day and came home and tried to help his wife with the housework. No matter what he did, it was wrong and she screeched at him for it. This is a man who loves his wife and only wants to help. If a wife tried to help her husband and he belittled her the way this man’s wife did, she’d be looking for a divorce attorney.

I’ve been guilty of stuff like that, I’m ashamed to admit. Ivylad paid his sister to come over and clean the house after his surgery, so I wouldn’t have to do it. I’d come home and do nothing but complain because nothing was done the way I wanted it done. Gradually, his sister stopped coming over. I realized after I read the book that although I was complaining about his sister, Ivylad took it that I was bitching about his choice of cleaning.

When did it become fashionable to Man Bash and dismiss men’s feelings? I took the time yesterday (Ivylad has been at his parents, since his father is dying, so this was the first time we’d been together in nearly a week) to be a little more attentive, to hug him and let him know I was glad he was home. Just because men don’t share their feelings doesn’t mean they don’t have them.

Another thing was about sex. I’ve believed the maxim, “A woman must feel love in order to have sex, and a man must have sex in order to feel love.” I was waiting for Ivylad to show me love to get me in the mood. I realized after the book that if I’m a little bit more aggressive, he will give me all the love I need.

I found this book very enlightening. Men seek approval from the women in their lives, starting with their mothers, then moving to girlfriends and wives. If we let them know we are aware of their efforts, they will bend over backwards.

Such a simple concept. Love and appreciate your husband. Huh.

(The caveat of the book is, if one of three A’s is present, Addiction, Affairs, or Abuse, the book Does Not Apply. The assumption is you are in a good marriage and want to make it better.)

[don_t_ask]

Sounds like a sensible book to me. I know my marriage hit the skids after my wife and I started marriage counselling (at her insistence). Basically the counsellor told us the same things - I wasn’t doing enough, she was too critical of my efforts to do what she wanted. After a while it became obvious to me that no matter how hard I tried my efforts would never be appreciated so I stopped wasting my time trying. As soon as I started acting the way my wife said I was acting she became even angrier than she had been and separation was a relieve. Even now that we are divorced she harangues me about how hard life is for her now that I’m not around and she can’t see the irony.

[ivylass]

I think a lot therapists have bought into the “Man Bad Woman Good” philosophy. I always have a giggle when some wife calls into Dr. Laura to complain about her husband, and when Dr. Laura points out how much her husband does do for her, and how she doesn’t appreciate it, there’s always a dead silence on the line, as the light bulb goes on.

I hope you find a good woman, don’t ask, who appreciates you. Did you have children with your ex?

[gex_gex]

I haven’t read the book, but it sounds like the sort of thing I hate (though perhaps not as bad as that Men Are From Mars… shit).

Actually, I’ll revise that sentence. From your description, the book seems have the right basic idea - men have feelings. I don’t see that as revolutionary, though (perhaps because I am a man).

But this sort of thing really annoys me:

Basically, according to the book, men are really very simple creatures. They want to be loved and appreciated and not nagged. If you do that, he will swim through shark-infested waters for you.

Men are not uniform creatures whose motives and desires can be summed up in a few sentences. For that matter, nor are women. We are both the same species. If men are “simple,” we are no more so than women. Sure, there are gender differences created by environment, upbringing and (though a lot less than people think) genetics. But it’s a trap to start thinking “men are like this” or “men want this,” just like it’s a trap to start thinking “women are like this” or “women want this.” We’re all people, we’re all individuals, and the best way to treat people is to treat them as individuals who desire the things that people desire, and think the things that people do.

Bah, and don’t even get me started on those theories that tell me that just cause I’m a man I can’t be empathic and am always trying to fix everything. Why can’t I just be a person?

[rackensack]

Caitlin Flanagan has a review of the book in the current issue of The Atlantic that gets it more or less right – Dr. Laura’s pretty unlikeable at times, and in my opinion she’s dead wrong about some important issues, but she’s dead right (if often insufferable) about a lot of others. A whole lot of problems in this world stem from people putting their own selfish wants ahead of the commitments they’ve made to others, and people get a free pass on that way too often – as a society, we’ve almost stopped expecting people to live up to a certain standard of behavior. Specifically on the issue of husbands and wives, while I’m not sure I appreciate her portrayal of men as essentially domestic animals with extremely simple needs, I do think that a lot of marriages would be stronger if people behaved as if they are committed to the marriage and had a stronger sense of the obligations that go with it. Act as if you’re deeply in love with your husband or wife, perform your obligations as if it wouldn’t occur to you to do otherwise, and it’s likely that the behavior will become your reality. Which gets to another thing I think she’s right about – it matters a whole lot less what you think than what you do. This is the essentially Jewish aspect of Dr. Laura’s message – the emphasis on performance rather than attitude or “feelings”. Whereas most people these days would argue that you shouldn’t do something if you don’t “feel it in your soul”, Dr. Laura, and most rabbis, would argue that if it’s something you’ve made a committment to do or that you are obligated to do, you do it, whether you feel like it or not. They would argue, and I also believe, that this is not simply a matter of fulfilling external obligations; that the process of fulfilling these obligations, even if you’re simply going through the motions, is itself ennobling, and tends to give one a sense of pride and purpose, and that after a while of behaving as if you deeply love and are committed to your spouse, you eventually find that your feelings have aligned themselves with your behavior.

[tiny_ham]

The title of the book reminds me of stupid plays like Defending the Caveman (Men, gosh why do they love the remote so much? hahahahaha, hilarious! :rolleyes: ).

You say it instructs women to love and appreciate your husbands, (which,shouldn’t that be friggin second nature if you are MARRIED to someone?), but then the title sort of implies that you OWN your husband and he’s a thing like a pet or a plant to take care of. I’m heartily against man bashing, but that title really puts me off. I know it’s probably supposed to be cutesy and fun, but it really irks me.

Like Gex Gex said, as complicated and diverse as women are, so are men.

[Avalonian]

@jarbabyj

You say it instructs women to love and appreciate your husbands, (which,shouldn’t that be friggin second nature if you are MARRIED to someone?), but then the title sort of implies that you OWN your husband and he’s a thing like a pet or a plant to take care of. I’m heartily against man bashing, but that title really puts me off. I know it’s probably supposed to be cutesy and fun, but it really irks me.

I was thinking the exact same thing… the title alone makes me want to throw the book as far as possible away from me. It’s the same sort of belittling crap that she is supposedly against. A similar book about women with a title like that would be derided mercilessly, and justifiably so.

@jarbabyj

Like Gex Gex said, as complicated and diverse as women are, so are men.

Enthusiastically thirded. I dislike any book which tries to pigeonhole “men” or “women” as all wanting the same things just because they all share the same sexual organs. :rolleyes:

[Avalonian]

@jarbabyj

You say it instructs women to love and appreciate your husbands, (which,shouldn’t that be friggin second nature if you are MARRIED to someone?), but then the title sort of implies that you OWN your husband and he’s a thing like a pet or a plant to take care of. I’m heartily against man bashing, but that title really puts me off. I know it’s probably supposed to be cutesy and fun, but it really irks me.

I was thinking the exact same thing… the title alone makes me want to throw the book as far as possible away from me. It’s the same sort of belittling crap that she is supposedly against. A similar book about women with a title like that would be derided mercilessly, and justifiably so.

@jarbabyj

Like Gex Gex said, as complicated and diverse as women are, so are men.

Enthusiastically thirded. I dislike any book which tries to pigeonhole “men” or “women” as all wanting the same things just because they all share the same sexual organs. :rolleyes:

[rackensack]

@gex gex

Men are not uniform creatures whose motives and desires can be summed up in a few sentences. For that matter, nor are women. We are both the same species. If men are “simple,” we are no more so than women. Sure, there are gender differences created by environment, upbringing and (though a lot less than people think) genetics. But it’s a trap to start thinking “men are like this” or “men want this,” just like it’s a trap to start thinking “women are like this” or “women want this.” We’re all people, we’re all individuals, and the best way to treat people is to treat them as individuals who desire the things that people desire, and think the things that people do.

Haven’t read the book either, but from the reviews I’ve seen, I think the point Dr. Laura’s trying to make in her typical ham-fisted way is that the things that go into making a successful marriage aren’t really that complicated – that keeping a few simply principles in mind and acting on them will go a long way toward making almost any marriage a happier and healthier one. Among these principles are that people don’t like being nagged and harangued; that both partners have duties and obligtions to the marriage, but that that doesn’t mean that those are the same on both sides, or that either party is responsible for all of their obligations and all of the other party’s as well; that regular sexual relations are important to the health of most marriages, etc.

Unfortunately Schlessinger typically couches those important points in a combination of patronizing cutesiness (the whole “men are basically simple creatures” bit) and shrewish contempt for anyone who doesn’t agree with her. The book sounds like more of the same. I’m constantly conflicted about her – I’m glad someone’s out there saying some of the things she says (and she does seem to be the only one at times), but I wish it were someone else saying them.

[jellytoes]

Whereas most people these days would argue that you shouldn’t do something if you don’t “feel it in your soul”, Dr. Laura, and most rabbis, would argue that if it’s something you’ve made a committment to do or that you are obligated to do, you do it, whether you feel like it or not. They would argue, and I also believe, that this is not simply a matter of fulfilling external obligations; that the process of fulfilling these obligations, even if you’re simply going through the motions, is itself ennobling, and tends to give one a sense of pride and purpose, and that after a while of behaving as if you deeply love and are committed to your spouse, you eventually find that your feelings have aligned themselves with your behavior.

rackensack ,
Thanks for putting into words the same thing I have been thinking for years. In fact I was trying to explain this to Mr. Toes yesterday as he bitched and moaned his way through an obligation he had happily agreed to do weeks ago.

[ivylass]

I don’t mean to make the book sound condescending, because it isn’t. It was a real eye-opener to me. It made me realize that I can change some of the things I do. I know she’s not for everyone, but I think it can make a real difference to how some women treat their husbands.

[CrazyMonkey]

@Avalonian

I was thinking the exact same thing… the title alone makes me want to throw the book as far as possible away from me.

That was my first thought upone seeing the thread title. However, once I read Ivylass’s description of the book, I think the title is appropriate. Those most in need of the message contained within the book are those who would respond to that title.

FWIW, I have an ex-girlfriend that I lived with for about a year. There was a lot going on in that relationship that just wasn’t working, and when I finally ended it, my friends and family kept asking why it took so long for me to decide this wasn’t the girl for me when it was so obvious to everyone else that it wasn’t working. My only answer was that every day when I came home from work, she greeted me with a smile and was genuinely happy to see me, and it was the same every night when she got home from classes. Just a little appreciation has a very powerful effect.

[beajerry]

I agree with rackensack that some of the things Physiologist Laura (she’s NOT a psychologist OR a psychiatrist as she tries to market herself) says are good, but I wish it were someone else not so condescending, fundamentalist, black-and-white, and oblivious to the life of lower incomes.
When her naked pictures hit the internet and the truth about her marriage (she stole her husband from another woman and doesn’t publicly acknowledge his children from then), the hypocrite factor went up 100 Bill Bennett points.
That’s always more enjoyable than the sensationalistic stuff people do to get attention in the first place.

[Avalonian]

@CrazyMonkey

Just a little appreciation has a very powerful effect.

True… this is a fact which just seems so painfully obvious to me, I’m having a hard time figuring out why a whole book needs to be devoted to it. But different strokes, an’ all.

[Gala_Matrix_Fire]

Gosh, it must be nice to live in a world where men will be helpful and considerate if you just show them you appreciate them. In my world, I treat them like kings, and they shower me with reasons why they can’t fulfill even the most basic obligations. If you’re lucky enough to find one of the men Dr Laura describes, more power to you! I’m nearly forty, and I have never had a relationship with one.

[cher3]

You know, I was just thinking that what women really need—particularly married women with kids and perhaps jobs as well— is another book telling them all about what they are doing wrong.

[ivylass]

It’s not about what they’re doing wrong.

It’s about realizing that hubby is also working hard to help the family, and realizing that and appreciating his efforts can go a long way towards making a happy marriage.

Like I said…I know she’s a buzz word around here, and I just wanted to share that I found some useful information when I read the book.

[Priam]

File me with Avalonian in the “No shit, Sherlock!” section. I mean really…

You mean if I acknowledge what hard work a person is doing they’ll appreciate it and be more likely to continue doing that hard work? Where has this information been all my life?

You mean if I make a commitment, I should see it through with the minimum of whine? Oh my God! The light of revelation has smacked me right between the eyes! Where does Missus Schlessinger get such wisdom from? And wait! If I continue to do said commitments with the minimum of whine, I will be likely to adjust to them and stop seeing them as painful burdens? HOLY SHIT! You don’t say?!

Christ. If Americans need such self-evident points made to them, I am gonna be one seriously depressed man.

[tiny_ham]

I was glad to come back to the thread and realize I wasn’t alone.

The title of this book and its purpose makes me wonder if we DO need a program to teach people how to be married.

No wonder the state of American Marriage is in trouble if women need a book to say “don’t scream at your husband when he gets home from work.”

My husband and I have been married for nearly 10 years and I can’t even REMEMBER the last time I screamed at him in genuine anger. I can’t remember the last time I said “If you don’t know why I’m mad I’m not going to tell you”.

How in the world do you forget that your husband works hard? I see my husband for about four waking hours a week total what with all of his working hard. I can’t believe someone would need to be reminded to appreciate that.

I stood at an altar in church and promised that for the rest of MY LIFE I would do my best to love and cherish and bring joy to my husband’s life. And he promised the same to me. That was a promise we made to each other. And we carry it through to the best of our abilities. Simple as that.

[Shodan]

Thanks for the link to the Atlantic review, rackensack.

I found the following to be particularly interesting -

Almost any marriage not marred by what Laura calls the Three A’s—affairs, addictions, and abuse, any of which she deems grounds for divorce—can be quickly improved by a wife’s simple decision to stop nagging her husband, make sure he has a hot dinner at the end of the day, and increase the amount of hanky-panky she’s willing to offer. That a married woman has sexual obligations to her husband once went without saying; now the very notion is radical in the extreme. Our culture is quick to point out the responsibilities husbands have to wives—they should help out with the housework, be better listeners, understand that a woman wants to be more than somebody’s mother and somebody’s wife—but very reluctant to suggest that a wife has responsibilities to her husband.

I would say that not all problems in a marriage have simple solutions - but some do.

Regards,
Shodan