Yes, but here it isn’t rude, its part of good manners and good breeding.
Some cultures find it rude when you look someone in the eye when talking to them. Some cultures find it rude when you don’t. Neither is right - it depends on context. Manners are completely culturally relevant - and its also rude as a guest in the culture not to adapt to the cultural norms.
What would be rude here is for you to show that you find the second or third offer rude. No thank you is not rude, even if you have to say it three times.
I don’t think it’s rude of you to say no. I do think it’s rude for people to constantly offer after you’ve said no three times. But I also think that it’s just food, offered with the best intentions. I suppose in principle it is the same as someone pressing drugs on you. :: shrug :: Hosts like that annoy me too, but they mean well, so for me it doesn’t take a lot of effort to grin and bear it. YMMV.
Anyway, “rude” is a social concept. In the US, it’s considered rude to not look someone in the eye when you’re talking to them; in Korea, it’s incredibly rude to look directly at someone during conversation, particularly if that person is older than you. There is no absolute measure when it comes to rudeness.
You say “no thank you.” As often as required. Or, alternatively, you accept something small and nibble at it for as long as the conversation lasts. If the visit is too onerous for you to maintain, you make your excuses as soon as its civil and you simply drop the acquaintance, or at least maintain the friendship in a mutually comfortable setting - maybe going for a walk instead of visiting over coffee in their home. There are, of course, situations where this cannot be done - you may need to have dinner at your mother in laws a few times a year. In which case, you are a good guest, putting enough food on your plate not to stand out, moving it around, complimenting it, even if you barely eat it. You assume your host is “pushing” food on you out of a duty to be a good host (food being a fairly central idea to that) and KINDNESS and not out of some evil plan to torpedo your diet.
BTW, in Minnesota it is fairly common on the second or third offer to accept “a glass of water if it isn’t inconvenient” - which disposes of the social obligation to offer and accept. And isn’t going to hurt anyone’s diet. Don’t be surprised if its followed by “I can make a pot of coffee” (or put the water on for tea) - which you can accept or decline.
My husband and I have been married over 40 years, but came from exact opposite sides of this question. In my white-bread Anglo-Saxon Protestant upbringing, no one automatically offered food and drink. If we wanted to invite someone to a meal that was o.k., but we had to give Mom advance notice, because she cooked exactly what she expected four people would eat so that there would not be any wasted food. If a dinner guest had been offered something and declined, he/she would not have the item offered a second, let alone a third time. That would have been rude. One “No, thank you,” was quite sufficient.
His eastern European culture is the opposite, and is exactly what’s been described here by many. I found it distressing and annoying. OTOH, he found my relatives cold and inhospitable. “They didn’t even offer us a cup of coffee!” We’ve worked it out and have grown to understand, and have both moderated our behavior.
I still find it incredibly rude and annoying when some people push food and especially alcohol aggressively. One of my friends has celiac disease, and watching her cope with offers of cookies and snacks she would dearly love to have but cannot has been a real education in classiness. The alcohol pushing is really bad, though. I cannot have more than a sip because it interacts with several of my medications. Thing is, it’s not an immediate response – if I have a glass of wine today, then tomorrow I am likely to not feel well.
My friend doesn’t like to explain to everyone that she can’t have wheat products, and is also a vegetarian. Also does not drink alcohol. She just declines politely, as many times as are necessary. It kills me when people who know I used to enjoy wine, scotch, gin, and good beer offer it and I have to decline, even though I would LOVE to have some. I don’t like to have to explain the medical reason. “It would conflict with a medicine I’m taking,” raises eyebrows and sometimes intrusive questions I’d rather not answer.
Or if someone’s got a drinking problem. They may feel self-conscious enough to be turning down alcohol, but it’s probably bad enough to have to keep saying, “No, no, no.”
Well, yeah. Any time you say anything about United States culture, it’s going to conflict with the practices of a couple states along the way. Just because people don’t ice skate in California doesn’t mean that “Ice skating is a popular American pastime” would be wrong.*
I wouldn’t know, though. Just pulled that example out of my ass.
Like I said before, maybe your situation is different, but in cultures that do do this, I do not consider it badgering, haranguing, harassing, insisting, etc. It’s a matter of perspective here. You are allowed to say no. You can say no. You just have to say it a few times. I know it’s annoying to you, and you seem to take it personally, but it’s not personal in the situations I have described. In a perfect world, yes, I suppose they should consider your cultural perspective, too, but it’s easier for me to understand theirs and just go along with the song and dance. Old dogs new tricks and all that. (I find this habit more common among older people). Of all the things to get pissed off about, somebody trying to ply me with food and drink is not anywhere on my list. Frankly, I find it cute and endearing.
Sure, but the thing about manners is that its recognizing the you and your issues are not the center of the universe. Don’t want a drink, say “no thanks, but I’ll take a glass of water.” Can’t have that cookie, “no thanks.” Vegetarian that shows up for dinner at a meal with a meat entree. “These green beans are delicious.”
If the “food pusher” is pushing because of their own issues, yes. If someone is being polite and offering you food a second or third time because that is good manners in their cultural context - no, because they aren’t offering you food to fill their own need, they are offering because they are trying to meet yours - unsuccessfully if you have your own issues you don’t communicate, because they don’t read minds, they merely follow their cultural script for good manners.
Why is their failure to recognize bad manners “cultural” when pushing after repeated declines, but my failure to accept after 3 times is “personal issues”?
Pushing can be rude. Pushing food, when you are pushing food past the point of your own cultural good manners and meeting your own needs IS rude. But it is not rude within a cultural context if its being done to be polite.
Not accepting food is not rude - if its offered once or three times or forty times (though its easier to accept something when faced with someone who insists - even if its a glass of water). Accepting token food and not eating it is not rude. Saying no thank you is not rude. What is rude is to act offended when someone offers you food or beverage or to assume they are doing it out of anything other than good manners.
But it is their insistence, however the motive (good intentions, or controlling issues) is rude. Three times is really pushing it however you slice it. We all the know the politeness game in accepting food. But it is the failure of the pusher to recognize a true decline. Someone who really does want the food, but is bashful or trying to be polite will accept on the 2nd attempt. Past that, I really mean it and leave me alone.
But it isn’t pushing it - not in the Minnesota. No matter how you slice it - that IS the cultural norm here - it is what people believe is and are taught is polite behavior. You don’t get to apply your cultural etiquette standards on my culture. Their MOTIVATION is to be polite - just like when Koreans don’t look you in the eye when they talk to you - they are being polite (yet, to us, it comes across as rude).
(By the way, I’m a lousy host by these standards - we are more ‘the cooler is in the garage’ hosts - and most people I know now are - these are get together for coffee, Lutheran church lady manners - not friends manners or party manners. But I do have more than one Emily Post reading but Lutheran church raised friend who has “offer three times” manners.)
(We also almost never take the “last bite” - its rude - someone else may want it. So you’ll watch a group tackle a cheese platter, and no one will take that last slice of cheese. Its very strange to clean up after a party and find bowls with one chip in it, platters with one cookie left, and veggie trays containing a single carrot. And don’t get me started on a “Minnesota Goodbye.” God, the one is annoying. I don’t know if that one has anything to do with manners however, or is just that we want to avoid a cold wind as long as possible.)
Heh. I never take the first or last of anything, ever. It’s irrational, but I just can’t do it unless I know them really well.
What’s a “Minnesota Goodbye?” Is it that thing my friends here do when they say they’re leaving but then end up talking for another three hours slowly inching towards the door? Because I hate that. If you don’t want to leave I’m in no hurry to get rid of you, I think, and would drop anvil like hints if I were, and if you do want to leave just do it already. I was comfortable sitting instead of standing around the door for hours!
