Since this is about the clustefuck of the administration, let’s note for the record that when the Dotard released his statement about Barbara Bush, it was dated “April 17th, 2017.”
Then it was revised, but holy hell guys.
Almost as many people in Blue New Jersey voted for the Shitgibbon as voted against him in Red Oklahoma+Kansas+Nebraska+South Dakota+North Dakota (a half-percentage point difference). Over 1.5 million flyoverians voted for Hillary or someone else in those states, and 1.5 million New Jersians voted for him.
That is the problem we need to fix. Those people do not live somewhere else, they live right here. One of them might have been the person whose pushed past you at the grocery store yesterday, or the person who slowed down so that you could merge onto the packed freeway.
Lumping over a million decent flatlanders in with the TFMs that live there makes you a shithead. Some of the ATFMs are completely unreachable, but others are not. I suggest you start at home and try to fix the shitstains in your own back yard before casually tossing “flyover country” into the Dumpster Fire.
He seems to think he can get Mexico to give him money (see: for the wall). I don’t see how California no longer being a state would be viewed by him as an impediment.
(you misspelled “tweeted”…)
The Jordan quote was the Moment of Zen at the end of The Daily Show the other night. Interestingly, on that same episode, Eric Holder implored people to not vote for [America-hating fuckstick] in 2020. Trevor Noah pointed out that his show was the wrong venue for getting that message out where it would do any good.
It’s even worse when it comes from Dopers who are at least nominally on the right site of the “[America-hating fuckstick] is an America-hating fuckstick” argument.
There is no out. There is no reaching them.
Theirs is the last, dying gasp of an outdated way of thinking. This new world where all people are actually equals frightens and enrages them. Yes, blacks are as good as whites. No, having money is not the end all, be all determination of a person’s worth. No, homosexuals do not need to stay hidden and ashamed.
It doesn’t much matter how we treat them–everything they thought they knew about how the world works is crumbling around them, and they are going to howl and gnash and latch onto anything that affirms their unsustainable beliefs.
Ignore them, and they’ll scream louder. Offer them an olive branch, and they’ll scream louder. Attack them, and they’ll scream louder.
They’re out, one way or another. The only question is whether we let them die off on their own over the next couple of generations or show them the door early by making their entire mindset legally and socially unacceptable.
With a robot arm. It’s full of lasers and stuff, right ?
In my opinion, Trumpism and the radicalization of the Republicans comes from the fact that overall the world is changing and the liberals are winning. We had a black president, gays are marrying, there is a general consensus that transgenders shouldn’t be treated like deviant freaks, women are empowered, and people are beginning to question Christianity, and multiculturalism is thriving, as Japanese MANGA, and Sushi, and Tapas bars are no longer weirdly exotic, but just part of every day life. Meanwhile the economy is changing to more tech oriented leaving those without a college education in the dust. Basically their world view and way of life is being diluted and displaced. When your very existence is at stake you fight back hard with everything you can. This is war fair play and high-minded principals are luxuries you can’t afford. If that means supporting a scoundrel, or voter suppression, or relying on fear and hate rather than hope and compassion, then so be it.
Meanwhile on the Democratic side in 2016 have a mixture of complacency, and dissatisfaction. We had come so far so fast, nothing could stand against us. Why should be be satisfied with a candidate who seemed satisfied with the current rate of progress, when the wind is at our back and we have a chance to start a revolution and truly change this country from the ground up? We can afford to be picky and stay home rather than accept someone we weren’t completely satisfied with.
So from that point of view it was Liberals that led to Trump. But the only way to placate the Trump voters would be to become them. In order to make Trump supporters comfortable again we would have to turn back the progress we have made and return the country to a white, christian, mono cultural pre-information age society. We couldn’t do this even if we wanted to, and to make attempts to do so would more than erase any advantage we hoped to gain by placating them.
So for now we will just have to accept that these people aren’t going away and stand vigilant against them, until they are eventually forced to accept by the weight reality pounding down on them that the halcyon days of their youth are not returning.
On the good side, once we get through the Anger phase, the next stage of grief is bargaining, so maybe at some point we can make a deal.
There are a lot of people, on every side, who are just going to do and believe what the people around them do and believe. Those people are not ideologues at all, and it’s important not to make them into ideologues for the right.
I would suggest that people like that, those who never have an original ideology of their own, cannot become ideologues. It’s just not in their nature. They’ll conform to whatever the majority around them believes, even if it’s 180 degrees from what they believed five years ago.
I think they can if they are forced to embrace their vote too much. I think this is one of those places where we need to have some selective short memories to allow people to distance themselves from something that becomes unpalatable rather than to rub their noses in it. Let people hide a little and we may prevent them deciding they have to fight to the (political) death in defense of their actions.
Or maybe we don’t. Maybe we let them experience the consequences of their actions.
When farmers talk in shaky voices about how they can no longer sell their crops for enough to support themselves (given that the consequences of the tariffs have lost them their overseas markets), we remind them that, as Spanky Bonespurs said, they are great patriots. If religious, we tell them that our thoughts and prayers are with them. If not, we express sympathy for their circumstances. We tell them that it must suck to be them. What we don’t do is increase farm subsidies so that they can stay in business.
When people in small towns in the rust belt complain that those good-paying manufacturing/steel industry/coal industry jobs that barely required a high school diploma haven’t come back as Spanky promised, we express sympathy for their circumstances. We tell them there are many low-paying jobs picking produce available since we no longer have those scary brown people coming in to do those jobs; maybe they should relocate. We tell them it must suck to be them. We don’t put in programs that don’t make economic sense to try to magically give them well-paying jobs.
When they look up and shout “save us!” I look down and whisper “covfefe”.
If their memory is short enough that they forget that they voted for trump, then I can forget that as well.
Even better if they are able to realize that they made a mistake.
As long as they continue to be proud of their vote, though, as long as they cling to the unpalatable, as long as they rub our noses in the fact that they made the electoral choices, then we need to stop being the ones doing the placating.
Today’s “Word of the Day” on dictionary.com is:
omnishambles (noun): Chiefly British Informal. a situation, especially in politics, in which poor judgment results in disorder or chaos with potentially disastrous consequences.
It’s a good word to know if you ever want to talk about the clusterfuck in polite company.
I can give a pass to some. People who are desperate and who can’t see any way up or out, like much of Coal Country, can be forgiven for latching onto any small hope offered. But that pass isn’t perennial, and it’s not for everybody.
Take Spencer and his alt-righters. Or Jones and his nutjob pack of Sandy Hook deniers. Repudiate and denounce, and we can talk about forgiveness. Otherwise, no, they don’t get a place to hide.
I don’t see it. Not at all. Not gonna happen no matter how much WE grovel to THEM.
Just sometimes, ANGRY gets shit done.
Yup. There is no reaching these people.
The only thing to do is to outvote them.
I always have a choice in how I act toward other people.
I don’t know if I’d go that far. But if the targets of (generic) your anger are so oblivious to it, the only person it’s hurting is you.
No, just a range-finder and a whisk.