There are not enough off-color words for this sort of thing:
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/africa/10/12/stoning.reut/
:mad: :mad: :mad:
Fascinating how, once again, the case against the female half of a fornicating pair is strong enough to merit the stoning to death penalty, but the prosecution just couldn’t show enough evidence to convict the male partner.
If I didn’t have, ya know, respect for the rich cultural diversity of all my fellow passengers here on Spaceship Earth, and a deep understanding that no culture is innately better than any other culture, I might begin to suspect that the Islamic courts in Nigeria are just the teensiest biased against women when hearing these cases.
I haven’t read the article, but in most of these situations the womens’ ‘guilt’ is easily proven: she is/was pregnant (and therefore had sex) and isn’t married. No witnesses needed.
For a man to be convicted of having been that particular sex partner you’d need dna tests (not exactly commonly available in Nigeria) and/or eyewitnesses. I believe three are required, and not just any three, it must be three upright Islamic males.
Given the nature of either voluntary or forced sex, it’s vanishingly unlikely that any male can be convicted.
So, yes, the deck is stacked against the women, but to a large degree that’s because God/evolution has stuck women with the most obvious consequence of sex.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe the courts would require the same three eyewitness standard to convict a woman of sex outside marriage, assuming she hadn’t become pregnant.
(I say court, because I’m well aware husband/family members can ‘avenge’ their honor based on nothing more than suspicion. But that’s a different OP.)
How does the law go? I was reading about this practice a few months ago. They bury a man to below his shoulders and if he escapes, he is free. The same applies to a woman, the difference being that they bury her to her neck.
Women are evil I tell ya. They cause men to have bad thoughts.
Even Aldeberan will not man the barricades for these people. If there WERE someone around to defend these Sharia laws, they’d mounta defense that goes like this:
1.) These events are isolated incidents and don’t really represent Islamic law
(A quick Google search indicates that women have recently (within the last couple of years) died in similar ways under Sharia law in Sudan, UAE, Iran and Saudi Arabia as well).
2) Most Muslims don’t go for this stoning stuff and would just as soon it never happened to anyone
(Possibly true, but it requires mind-reading abilities to validate, and in the meantime, it’s reasonable to ask how all these Sharia laws got in place when everybody hates them. Also, what is the rise of Islamic fundamentalism all about if not the institution of Sharia law? If Muslims hate this stuff so much, why is Islamic fundamentalism so successful?)
3) Stuff that’s just as bad happens in Western countries
(Not as part of their legal systems, buddy. In Western countries we call people who do stuff like this psychopaths, and deal with them accordingly. We don’t call 'em “judge”)
4) Islam teaches men to respect and honor women
(On the evidence, it teaches respect so long as women act as Islamic law proscribes, otherwise Islam teaches men to be incredibly brutal toward women.
5) Lots of women love Islam and will tell you it’s not sexist
I’m betting they’re not the ones buried in a pit up to their necks with rocks being thrown at their heads. Sounds like they’re kinda, y’know, INDIFFERENT to the fate of their sisters.
6. More men are killed by stoning than women under Islamic law
True. And this is a good thing because … ?
Hey, Islam walks like a duck and quacks like a duck. It’s a duck.
I have nothing good to say about the barbarity of treating adultery as a capital crime, much less the barbarism of execution by stoning.
However, I have to say that attempts to tar all Islamic cultures with the “barbarism” brush because of a few such sentences don’t make sense. Does anyone seriously believe that adultery among Muslims is typically punished by stoning?
Perhaps a few such sentences are carried out every year worldwide. And how many Muslims commit adultery every year? Gotta be millions. Obviously, although these medieval sentencing laws are still part of the Islamic legal systems in many countries following the Sharia, most Muslims don’t consider them binding.
Stoning in the Muslim world: sanctioned by Sharia but rarely applied (2003):
(And by the way, let’s not forget that in many Christian societies homosexual acts were capital crimes until well into the 19th century. Let’s also not forget that even today, groups such as the Christian Reconstructionists formally advocate returning to a theocratic legal system including execution by stoning for various crimes including adultery. Obviously, this ain’t some uniquely Islamic thing.)
(bolding, italics and STUNNED exclamation points mine…)
A 29 y.o. woman needs a gaurdian in an Islamic country???
The deck is stacked against women because the slime who run these kangeroo courts are sexist pigs. God and evolution have nothing to do with it.
Even one is too many. We’re not talking about a minor quirk of another countries’ legal system. We’re talking about the institutionalized violation of human rights.
But it will never actually be applied in Real Life. We have the Bill of Rights and the Canadian Charter of Rights And Freedoms 'round these parts, which forbid such callousness from ever becoming law and/or practice.
When atrocities happen in the Western world, we denounce them roundly, from our scholars to our politicians and in our schools. I have yet to see such a widespread and unanimous denunciation from the Muslim world when their atrocities come to light. Until they choose to do so, they will have to accept that those of us who believe in and live out the principles of equality, will tar them with the brush of their most dastardly members. It’s up to them.
[QUOTE=Kimstu]
I have nothing good to say about the barbarity of treating adultery as a capital crime, much less the barbarism of execution by stoning.
However, I have to say that attempts to tar all Islamic cultures with the “barbarism” brush because of a few such sentences don’t make sense. Does anyone seriously believe that adultery among Muslims is typically punished by stoning?
[quote]
Your response fails to address point 2 in my post. If Muslims don’t go for this brutal stuff, why is fundamentalist Islam, which embraces Sharia laws which are the source of the brutality, on the rise? ISTM that the fact that adultery isn’t punished by stoning more often is a disappointment to a lot of Muslims, given the appeal fundamentalist Islam has.
I have no idea. Any stats avaialable?
Moot point. Try to keep your points in this century. And so far as I know, Christian Reconstructionists are way on the fringe in all Western countries. They don’t have their hands on the levers of power, as the fundie Muslims do in several Muslim countries. Not apples and oranges my friend.
And I think the stoning is just the bloody tip of a huge iceberg of brutality and sexism that’s implicit in Islam as it’s practiced in many countries.
This should teach those dirty bitches. :rolleyes:
Oh, well, that’s good. Instead of being stoned to death, she got a year in prison for having sex.
One can only hope that these sentences are overturned on appeal. With regards to Sharia law, it seems as ridiculous as any law that is based on religious doctrine. Of the many consequences that resulted from the fall of the Taliban, some of which were undesirable, the excision of religious law was one of the most welcome.
No one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistle…
Maybe you should read what is the maxium punishment the US military has for Adultery. While you’re reading don’t forget to check out some of the other laws they have for: Bigamy, or (here’s an interesting one) “Wrongful Cohabitation”
Ah. I guess Indonesian housemaids have to sign a “no-sex” clause before they start dusting.
How about Cuban poolboys? (Quickly reedits my Cuban poolboy contract)
What, we’re anticipating, creating, numbering and knocking down our straw men, all in the same post now?
Least we get carried away; we don’t have to look too far for a country with controversial death sentences. Or laws that are unpopular, or laws that prohibite what you’d think would be a private matter between two adults, or men who don’t follow their religion’s guidance towards women, or religions with their fair share of sexist pronouncements and women who never-the-less follow them, or countires where more men than women are killed by state execution.
This is a shameful and barbaric aspect of Nigeria’s excuse for a legal system. But your extrapolation is bollocks. Those sweeping generalisation could cover more than you’d think.
Could someone please, please point out to me to how I can take action against these stonings? Has Amnesty International started an e-mail campaign like they did last time, for Amina Lawal ?
It’s funny (“funny” as in strange not humorous) that whenever someone brings out one of the latest atrocities committed in a Muslim country there are many people coming out to bang their self righteous drum like they are Fucking Amnesty International. Yes, Christian nuts are on the fringe in most western countries, but then again it’s that way for Islamic nuts in western counties too. However, if you go to some Non-Western, non-developed counties you will find some very Christian (Muslim, Hindu, atheist) nuts who are as every bit as brutal, cruel, and unjust as some Muslims are.
In this world Christians (and other non-Muslims): still burn witches at the stake, they kill and arrest Homosexuals, they buy human organs for good luck charms, they practice FGM, they oppress women, they commit ethnic cleansing, they start bloody wars, they own slaves, they commit genocide, and watch tele-tubbies.
Muslims didn’t invent cruelty, they haven’t perfected a new kind of human suffering, and injustice isn’t anything unique to the Muslims hordes. That kind of shit has been going on for as long as humans been alive. Muslims have no copy write on it, to say so is incorrect.
The fact is lavenderlemon had it right about this case.
However, when someone digs up a story about Muslims it’s always “clit cutters!”, “Savages!”, or “Animals!”