UK football, season 2008/09, forecasts

I’m actually not worried in the slightest. Obviously I’d like him to come to City but that said I still disagree with the silly money being bandied about.

You have to remember that Kaka is 26 years old, he has a fair number of playing years left in him (barring any serious injuries) he has the chance to secure his and his families future until the year dot :slight_smile:

Who knows, one day he may buy…erm… Accrington Stanley or even Wigan (at a pinch)

Well sure, but as Beckham proves, you can cash in when you’re reaching your twilight years. Why waste your prime on a project club whose sole driving factor is money? No offence to City, but honestly, it’s pretty easy to see them being a basketcase for at least another season or two, until Hughes is shuffled off in favour of someone who’s really on board with ADUG’s galactico policy.

On the other hand, Meeeelan themselves aren’t any great shakes at the moment, and could probably really use the money, in addition to getting two highly-paid but injured or out of favour players off the books. I imagine they’re secretly really hoping he’ll move; they just have to get an astronomical transfer fee to sell it to the fans.

The Guardian’s headlines are absolutely schizo this morning; when I got up it was “Kaka nears deal with City,” then when I left for work it was “Kaka deal definitely off, says City source.” Now it’s “Hughes rubbishes Kaka reports and insists deal is still alive.” That’s in the space of about two hours.

I hate the silly season.

Ah yes the dear old Gruniad;)

Always first with the nesw

£500,000 per week is a precedent too far for ANY single player. Please convince me that this wont lead to the downward spiral of football, if it occurs.

Well, in their defence they were reporting genuine statements from involved parties; I just wish said parties would shut the fuck up until they’ve either concluded a deal or are definitely away from the table. Not really the Graun’s fault, and at least they don’t simply make shit up like the News of the Screws. :slight_smile:

Half-a-mill-a-week is clearly unsustainable by any club that has to deal with financial reality, so I don’t think this’ll be the start of a trend. Rather, if it happens, I think it’ll be seen as the culmination of a particularly stupid period of club ownership, to be looked back on with a “tsk” and a roll of the eyes. Owning English football clubs will go out of fashion, as all things do, and the money fairies will depart, leaving the financial equivalent of several large craters surrounded by some very expensive pie stands.

There’ll be no downward spiral because it simply isn’t financially sustainable, as mentioned. One of two things would happen.

  1. Manchester City buys the league and the CL and whatnot. If it lasts, probable result is wage caps or something.
  2. They fail miserably, and everyone laughs at what a stupid waste of money that was.

With Kaka being a devout Christian and all, I’m surprised (OK not really) that he doesn’t take the crazy money and donate it to charity. It would be good for Meelan too, presuming he cares about them. They could buy a whole team with that!

I’ve been in arguments regarding wage caps with Americans, who, despite their apparent belief in free market economics, seem to be very quick to endorse said restrictions on the market when it comes to sports.

I can’t see how one could work for football these days. The European aspect of the game has become so dominant that unless every country in Europe agreed to the same cap, presumably expressed in Euros, it could not occur - were it to be imposed in England only, you could kiss goodbye to any Champions League success for English teams. And I don’t see all UEFA countries agreeing to the same cap structure.

Not to hijack. As an American, I actually share your perspective on caps in sports. I think the reason so many other Americans view it differently is because a) they don’t really look at sports as big business (which has led to American owners fleecing the hell out of the gullible public with cries of “We need you to build us a stadiums so we can be competitive.”), and b) because they think that it is unsporting to be able to win loads of titles simply because you have the biggest check book.

That aside, I think English clubs are running a very real danger of financial ruin. Absent an uber-rich owner like Abromavich or the Middle Eastlanders who can absorb massive losses, I can’t see how the current amount of spending is sustainable. I fear its only a matter of time until the house of cards comes crashing down for one of the big clubs like United or Liverpool.

Hmmm…how successful would you have to be to get a return on paying £26 million per annum to a player*? I suppose if you won all the major trophies each year he was playing, it would be money well spent. But what is the likelihood that one player can be that influential?

  • They do get paid when they are not playing, don’t they?

True, there are many problems with it. It was just the first possibility that came to mind. I suppose it is possible that nothing would be done, after all Manchester United have been buying the league for near 20 years and no one’s stopped them. The great English people would probably object when it’s an Arab’s money buying the league though.

As for the wage cap issue, we don’t want sports to be perfectly competitive. Competitiveness tends to result in a) standards improving overall (a good thing anywhere) and b) one “product (aka sports team)” becoming dominant, because it’s the best. The latter is something that isn’t so great in sport, it can be rather boring. So restrictions preventing dominance in sport make sense. It’s all voluntary anyway, someone could make a rival league to the NFL without wage caps/draft system etc and try compete, if people don’t like the system.

ivan, very hard to say. ADUG have said they primarily want Citeh to be an advertisement for Abu Dhabi. I doubt they expect Citeh to be revenue neutral, they’ll be taking losses for the purposes of promoting Abu Dhabi. What doing that is worth to them I haven’t the foggiest. And yes, they’d paid when injured/not selected etc. Usually these sums we hear actually include many incentives though, goals scored, matches won, clean sheets, which presumably are not available if you aren’t playing.

MichaelQReilly, yes, many clubs are well and truly fucked. United are not among them*, but Liverpool are a worry, and Chelsea are solely dependent on Abramovich not calling in his loans he gave them (600m pounds roughly). If he called them in, they’d probably have to sell all their players and Stamford Bridge, i.e. completely disintegrate. The only top club in England with a sane financial policy is Arsenal.

*currently they earn enough (by far the richest club in England), but to what degree that will be affected by the economic problems is to be determined. If it’s bad…well they have a shitload of debt. They’ll never go out of business or anything, they’d just sell some players and carry on, far too much income and support to become a Leeds.

Discordia :

Manure are no longer the richest club in English football, that honour belongs to City.

Matter of fact I believe they are the richest sports club on the planet.

As you say, players do get paid when not playing but this this reduced from that which they get when playing, not only do they forfeit win bonuses/attendance figures/meat pies sold/etc, etc but I think they also have their contract structured so that they receive 2/3rds of their wage.

Should Kaka sign for City his yearly wage will be £15M not £26M.

Don’t ask me how this is arrived at, I have not the foggiest

I would assume that the Red Scum are still (by far) the most valuable club in England though, which is a better measurement of richness to the extent it does not depend on some Sugar Daddy who may get bored at any time and decide instead that gold plated racehorses are a better way to waste money.

Don’t Arsenal have to pay off their (rather large) debt on their new stadium? I think Villa are probably in the best position atm where league position and debt are concerned. Their turn-over is probably paltry compared to the ‘top 4’ though.

But they still have a shitload of debt unlike City.

I’d go so far as to say that Aston Villa are in less debt than the red shite.

FWIW I have soft spot for Villa (the team, not the poster :wink: )

INteresting how 3 of the top 4 clubs have American ownership and the other team has a Russian blood money billionaire.

Wait til the Chinese get involved. Then we’ll have fun! :smiley:

Mere paupers compared to our noble leaders :smiley:

To turn this into a love fest, I have already said that I have a certain place in my heart for Manchester Shitty. The first top flight game I went to was, I believe, them playing at the Arse, and we stood in the away section. I always thought their fans travelled well. And Charlie Nicholas got injured too, which made the trip well worth while.

I think a lot of fans would like to see Villa finish in the top 4 this year, if only to see some wanker of a manager’s head explode as he tried to claim that biased referring cost his blessed team a spot in the Champions League next year.

Unless he has an unusually large family, he’s done that already.

Kaká signed for AC in 2003 for £49m. He is currently being paid £10m per annum, rising to £15 million per annum in 2013. If the player is unhappy where he is, which he isn’t, he should be looking for a club where he will become the last piece in the jigsaw rather than the first. Or second.

Also, when you are earning that kind of money I think you can promote lifestyle considerations to the top of the agenda. Exchanging the sophisticated delights of Milan for the gloriously dubious landscape of Greater Manchester for a mere 50 percent increase in salary wouldn’t be my choice of move. For a start, I bet it’s impossible to get a decent pancake cannelloni with spinach in Manchester but please tell me if I’m wrong (recipe available at deliaonline if anybody’s interested).

Incidentally, I’ve seen it reported that Kaká has been offered £15m per season rather than £15m per annum. This gets closer to £0.5m per (playing) week but assumes a season of 30 weeks, so maybe the player will be allowed to knock off and go on holiday in March.

Or perhaps he won’t be asked to play on Saturdays.

Yet you neglect to mention the absence of black pudding, vimto and eccles cakes in Milan.