Anyone else have a problem with him finding multiple love notes? If this were a one night fling, would the ex-bf really be sending multiple notes? It seems to also imply the gf was responding. For a one night fling that doesn’t sound like someone that would be feeling remorseful. I dunno… I just find that suspicious.
I’m actually in the same boat as The Flying Dutchman. My wife would never cheat on me and sometimes I wonder if it would be better that she might.
Hey, another example of a Doper pretending like they know something they don’t. The timeline goes something like this: Cheat in November. Buddy impregnates wife in late January. wasson finds out about it mid-March. Wife finds out shortly after. 9 months pregnant? I have a little more tact than that. Not much, but a little.
Also, I’d like to address the issue of my girlfriend being a “hoe”. Yes, she played “the other woman” when she was 19 or 20. But since I played “the other man” at 18, it’s really hard for me to condemn her for that. And yes, she played “other woman” to the same Buddy who she ended up cheating with so recently. Buddy ended up marrying the girl he cheated on the first time. This is like a friggin’ soap opera. Yeesh.
Yes, I’ve cut off contact with Buddy, but still talk to Mrs. Buddy occassionally when she needs to get things off her chest, since she’s very pregnant now, very hormonal, and needs to talk things out but can’t talk to anyone else. The logging software/checking phone bills was to make sure she was keeping her promise to me about not contacting Buddy. I’ve since stopped.
Also, the love notes… as I mentioned, Buddy and Girlfriend have a complicated past, which I thought was over. I guess as early as a few weeks after the wedding (which was the same day Girlfriend and I hooked up), he confessed he still had feelings for her and was worried it would drive he and I apart. So they tried to “deal with it”, by Girlfriend consoling him on his marriage. Horrible idea, I realize, and so does she in retrospect. This went on for months as Girlfriend and I were still establishing our bounds. He wrote her love notes all this time, cutesy text messages and emails and all sorts of crazy shit.
Of course I checked her “Sent” folder, and her replies to him were always very distant and almost cold. I think for her, it was a one-night, alcohol inspired mistake of epic proportions. She did a lot wrong, from not telling me about Buddy’s twisted confessions and love stories, to getting drunk alone with him, to sleeping with him. But I don’t think she’d have done any of it if not for their crazy and complex past and months of his bullshit “I married the wrong girl” craziness.
And as for losing friends, I think it’s mostly because I’m entering my late 20’s and mine (and all my friends) priorities are changing. I used to have a huge group, but now I’m down to like 7 or 8 really good friends. I still have many people I’m close to, but significantly fewer than I used to have. People assure me this is normal for people my age. It has little to do with my life being a train wreck/soap opera at the moment.
Jesus, this is a long post.
Anyway, thanks for the reassurance and advice and all that. It’s certainly heeded. Keep your cheater/cheatee stories coming. They’re fascinating.
If it’ll help your street cred, I could mention how the building containing the furniture you removed from the apartment myseriously burned down the next day… you really burning my turtle.
Yet another doper who knows enough about my life to comment on what I do and don’t know.
I have been cheated on, and had a friend tell me that my bf was a dog. I’ve also been the friend doing the telling. And y’know what? In both cases, the teller wasn’t believed. It’s weird, but most people don’t want to know that hard truth. It hurts too much. People would much rather take the out that their spouses/SO’s offer when they deny it. Because if you love that person, you don’t want to lose the trust you have.
I’m glad it came from your friend instead of you, because if he had denied it, I doubt she would’ve believed you. All of that is beside the point however; I just don’t think you did what you did out of any altruism. And I will repeat the question. Have you been tested for sexually transmitted diseases? And if not, why?
Oh, and before that last post gets viewed as a personal attack, let me state that ZipperJJ probably DIDN’T burn that building down.
The crazy homeless guy who was sleeping in it probably burned it down, either cooking in there, or … just being a crazy homeless guy.
I love you.
I was last tested when I broke up with the girlfriend previous to this one. I was clean.
Girlfriend lost her virginity to Buddy years ago and slept with one other guy before hooking up with me. Her grand total partners is 3(provided she’s telling me the truth, which I suspect she is since I knew this long before we dated) including me. Buddy is at 2, between his wife and my girlfriend. Again, this is provided everyone is telling the truth.
My number is… well… more than both combined. I’m probably the dirtiest of the bunch, except I never cheated on anyone.
Long story short, I haven’t been checked. Girlfriend and Mrs. Buddy are in the medical profession, and nowadays lines of communication are VERY open between me, Girlfriend, and Mrs. Buddy. I think they’d tell me if they suspected anything (think, again. Maybe I’m trusting TOO much already?).
I should get checked, I know. Advice taken.
::chortle::
…and the wire tap. Don’t forget to take down the wire tap! LOL!
I realize that my comments were a bit dry and quiet direct. I stand by them but realize I might have been more tactful.
It’s really hard for me to judge your state of mind then (and now) so I won’t. I do understand well the temptation for wanting to know *everything * the second you sensed things were not on the level with your g.f.
But I do think that trust, once broken, is a very difficult thing to re-establish and being under scrutiny (even knowingly and willingly) can often lead to a self fulfilling prophecy where the accused eventually gets fed up with the mistrust (Haven’t they been good for the past X months?!) and will act to rebel. Then try to turn the tables and say… “it’s because you didn’t trust me!”
Really, it takes some pretty impressive give and take of trust here. The cheater has to voluntarily disclose every aspect of their life very deliberately by constantly re-assuring and providing easily confirmed proof of their coming and going. On the other hand, the cheatee must give sufficient space and trust to show that they are willing to believe and trust again. It’s a very tricky dynamic. Most couples fail under the pressure. I have seen it succeed on one occasion and it’s lead to a successful and happy marriage.
Good luck wasson.
Why do you feel she needs to know?
I’ll yell ya why. Because you’re vindictive.
You’re not an excellent guy. You WERE threatening him. You are acting on revenge – that’s all this is. I bet if he had cheated on his wife with someone except your girlfriend, you wouldn’t be telling the wife.
Instead of just letting the wife continue in ignorance while you stewed in your own juices, you had to spread your misery around. Blech. You sure have some sort of rationalization where you think you’re protecting her or something, but you’re just being miserable because you got cheated on.
logging keystrokes? looking at email?
You deserved it.
Such harshness from people who don’t know me a bit.
Listen. I knew Buddy for 12 years. I knew Buddy’s Wife for 10. I was, and still am, good friends with her. We’d been on vacation together, thrown barbeques, Christmas parties… we worked together to plan surprise birthday parties for Buddy. We were very close.
I felt she needed to know because I knew her well. I knew she’d figure it out on her own, and I knew it would hurt more when she did. I knew she’d prefer to hear it from her husband’s mouth than anyone else’s, so I pulled some strings to make it happen.
Would I have done the same if Buddy cheated with anyone else? Yes. In a heartbeat. A split fucking second.
Of course, this is referring to Buddy’s wife, whom I’ve known for a decade. An acquaintance or someone I felt would prefer to live in ignorance, I would have kept it to myself.
As I mentioned before, Buddy’s wife still is comfortable enough with me to call me when she needs someone to talk to and she is so thankful to me for the way I handled the situation. There’s not the least bit of resentment from her to me. She assures me I did the right thing and handled it correctly, so why are you guys arguing with her? Jesus.
I logged keystrokes AFTER the incident. I checked her email because “I had a feeling”, and she wasn’t being open with me after I tried and failed at discussing it with her. Hey, I did what I had to do, and ya know what… No regrets. Okay, I regret the keylogging software. I don’t regret for a second checking her email to find out she’d been lying to me for basically the duration of our relationship and had cheated on me.
These things don’t make me a bad person. I always do what I think is the right thing, not acting on jealousy or revenge. Checking her email was the best way for me to either confirm something was happening or completely put my mind at ease. Logging was the same deal.
The only reason I regret key logging is because I found out she’d kept her promise. If I found out she was still in touch with him, I’d have no regrets about this whole situation. People who say I was acting unreasonably have never been what I went through, so stop trying to be so self-important and judgemental. I can’t imagine many people handling things much better than I did.
You came in here and asked for it under the guise of “so anybody else been cheated on?”
You just want to be able to argue your rationalizations against someone with a “voice”. What you should be saying “thank you very much, Trunk, for letting me assuage my guilt a little bit” and go on your way.
Try to imagine the way a man would have handled it instead of a child. That’s a start.
So the only reason you regret acting badly is because she wasn’t acting badly? WTF, I say again. You snooped. You may have broken **laws **- privacy laws, at the very least. You were watching another adult’s actions without their knowledge and consent, when that person had a reasonable expectation of privacy.
Yeah, yeah, I know. She cheated on you. She broke the trust. Wah. Big fucking deal. I don’t care if what she did was wrong (and it was). What you did was wrong, too. Two wrongs don’t make a right. (Hey, that’s kind of catchy. I think I’ve heard it somewhere before - like in Kindergarten, perhaps!)
**You have no right to violate someone else’s rights to put your mind at ease. **None. Now, if you had gone to her in the beginning and said, “Honey, this is driving me crazy. I need to know and monitor all your computer habits - not just your emails, but every single word you type on the computer - to put my mind at ease. Would it be OK with you if I enabled monitoring software on the computer?” And if, for some crazy reason, she’d given you permission (which you claim she retroactively did), then I’d be fine with your moral actions. I’d still think the two of you odd, but hey, whatever works for the two of you.
Bull. Shit. More than half the people posting in this thread have been through exactly what you’ve been through. Did we all handle it well, or even better than you? Of course not. Did some of us? Yeah, a lot better than you. Does this give us moral superiority? No, not really. We’re probably assholes in some other part of life. But it does mean that you might want to put the breaks on the defensiveness, acknowledge your mistakes, and explore advice on how to act differently in the future.
Building trust through communication, love and time = good.
Building “trust” through violation of civil rights = bad.
Now you’re telling me what I want? And my motives for posting? You’ve got me all wrong, guy.
I said in my first post I intend to stay, so people saying I should leave will be ignored. I was very open and honest about both the things I’m proud of doing (very, very proud of how I handled Buddy’s wife, despite the naysayers), and things I’m not proud of doing (keylogging, email checking, etc.). If I wanted nothing but support and “woe is me”, then, well, I woulda left that “bad stuff” off the original post.
I’ve come to terms with the bad shit I’ve done. I’ve apologized to her for it, although I’ll be damned if I apologize to you.
Act like a man would have acted? Okay, let me set the stage and see what you would have done.
You’ve known one of your best friends for over a decade. You were just best man in his wedding, where he married one of your other good friends. You hook up with another one of your good friends who you’ve known for longer than either of them, figuring that her past with Buddy is in the past and you can now handle it responsibly. Things go great for months until you start sensing that something is “off”. After trying and failing to talk it out with Buddy and Girlfriend, you take matters into your own hands to figure out what they’re so unwilling to talk about.
You find the worst possible thing you can imagine has happened. You’ve been betrayed and lied to by 2 of the most important people in your life. Buddy just shit on over a decade of friendship. Girlfriend shit on even more friendship than that, as well as months of a relationship where we’d discussed marriage and you were ring shopping on weekends.
How would a “man” have handled it? I threw no temper tantrums. I didn’t yell at her, or even Buddy during the last conversation we’ll ever have. I didn’t punch her, him, or walls. I didn’t kick furniture or cry or yell “WHY ME, GOD!?!”. I accepted it and attempted to move on.
Sure, I shouldn’t have installed key logging software. I admit that. I admitted it to her, even. But I’ll be damned if that one bad move made ME the bad guy, over Buddy and even Girlfriend. Now all of the sudden I “deserve” this? Please.
I’ve come to terms with what she did, what Buddy did, and even what I did. I don’t need to rationalize my motives and actions to anyone but myself, and guess what… I’ve done that. It’s been 4 months since this happened and things are better every day. I wasn’t coming here for sympathy or understanding… I woulda done that 4 months ago if that was my goal.
I came here for stories about what you guys have been through. I find most people here fascinating, if not a bit judgemental and quick to kick someone when they’re down. I enjoy most stories that people here tell. I told mine.
It sounds weird when you say it like that, but yes. If I found out she was still talking to Buddy, I would have up and left in a heartbeat with no regrets about how I handled the situation. After she was loyal and kept her word, I felt shitty for having distrusted her. So yes, even if it sounds a bit backwards, that’s how it is.
Right. After everything came to light, I was in survival mode. I was looking out for myself. Not Girlfriend. Certainly not Buddy. I was doing what it took to get to the bottom of things, figure them out, and decide if I wanted to stay or go. Sure, in retrospect I did the wrong thing. I don’t know how many times in this thread I’ve said it wasn’t the right thing to do. Enough, though.
She didn’t necessarily give me “permission”. She did understand why I did what I did (and I can’t understand why no one else reading this understands why I did what I did), and she forgave me for it. I offered to uninstall it, but she told me it didn’t matter to her if I did some checking up, because she planned on being true to me from now on. So I left it, and I haven’t even checked the damn thing in months now.
We ARE adults. And we both acted irresponsibly and irrationally for brief amounts of time. We’ve both apologized to each other, and I feel no need to apologize to anyone else about it. But saying I deserved being cheated on because I installed logging software after being cheated on? I don’t buy it. You’re just being self righteous and judgmental if you’re saying it.
Also, saying anyone handled it “a lot” better than me is a statement that… well… no one can really make. I think I handle it damn well, considering.
This is just nuts. You seem to be suggesting that for Mrs. Buddy not getting AIDS from her cheating husband is the same as knowing she got AIDS from her cheating husband. How about not getting the bug at all? Wouldn’t some people pick that as the ideal situation? :rolleyes:
:eek: Holy shit! That guy who said that Dopers can be sanctimonious prigs when it comes to analyzing romantic relationships was a fucking genius, You should all buy him a beer.
–Cliffy
No, I have never cheated on a spouse/gf, nor am I aware of same having cheated on me.
Can’t say I would have reacted any better or worse than you in a similar situation.
The one thing I do want to observe is that it doesn’t strike me as tho your current social circle is optimally suited for longterm happiness and peace of mind.
Of the 4 or 5 people you mentioned, how many have slept with how many else - while in relationships with others in or out of the group? And you are a sounding board for the pregnant wife of an ex-buddy with whom you no longer speak.
I’m just seeing potential fireworks everywhere you turn.
I know it is hard, but you might do well to try to expand your circle of friends and aquaintances. I may have read portions of this thread somewhat quickly, but I hope there is more to your relationship than the fact that she says she is sorry and you don’t currently have many other friends.
You do come across (to me) as reasonably intelligent and well-intentioned, if perhaps a little naive. You and your friends essentially sound very young, and maybe not entirely realistic. You will probably do well to wait a while before marrying this woman and/or having kids with her. You may not (yet) have the desireable foundation for a more permanent, longer term relationship. But folks have gone thru worse and remained boyfriends/girlfriends or more. Hope you don’t get too hurt and/or jaded by your experiences.
And when thinking about posting something personal on the SDMB or any other forum, realize that you may well get responses you don’t really want to hear.
Well, I was about to come right back at you about this, but I think I’ll relax it a little based upon his repeated assertions that he agrees that the keylogging behavior was indeed wrong. Before that, though, from my point of view, someone who would do this is as low as the “buddy” is. I have HAD someone spy on me through my keystrokes. It. Is. Humiliating. Especially if you’ve done nothing wrong, but they’re looking to control you by knowing everything you think, even if they aren’t entitled to. MAKING someone back up a promise to you by spying to make sure they do is controlling and condescending. It is a breach of trust and just as damaging to someone as it is to cheat.
I think it’s great that she’s going out of her way to prove that she belongs with him. Sometimes these things happen, and people who should be together find a way to work it out, and get square with each other so that they don’t have to relive the pain over and over ad infinitum. Best of luck, wasson.
Hmmm…don’t see too many posts about being cheated on, so it’s time for the noob to get things back on track:
I was married for 13 years. My ex had a son from her first marriage, and we had a second son after I got out of the military.
Son from the ex’s first marriage had turned 18, and we all sat down and had a long talk about responsibilities, helping out with the bills, being an adult, yadda yadda yadda.
Ex’s first son interpreted this to mean that laying on the couch playing video games 14 hours a day was acceptible behavior. I tried to be tolerant, but finally told the no-load to shape up or ship out. He moved out.
Fast forward to a buddy of mine getting married. We attended the wedding, then went home and got in a fight. Ex decides to leave, taking our youngest son. I went fishing the next day, and the ex cleaned out the house while I was gone.
I come back to an empty house.
Great.
Where’s the cheating part, you ask? My son came over for visitation one weekend. The ex and I were separated; the divorce wasn’t final yet.
“Dad?”
“Yes, son.”
“What’re birth control pills?”
“Women use them when they want to have sex without having kids. Why?”
“I found some in mom’s purse.”
Turns out my ex was seeing a younger guy before she left me.
And in case you’re wondering what day the wedding was on, it was Valentine’s Day.
Perhaps if you spent just a wee more time in that reading comprehension skills class you wouldn’t have to guess at what people are suggesting. But I’ll give you an explanation, anyway.
I was suggesting that the people who are giving wasson an out for telling the wife based on “he might have given her a disease!” have forgotten that she would have found out from her physician if she did, and in all likelihood signs and symptoms of said “disease” would have exhibited themselves far earlier than the four intervening months between the one night stand and hubby coming clean. Are we up to date now? Good.