Nope. Critiquing an argument is not the same thing as critiquing its conclusion.
For example, I have a friend whose sister hates anything associated with Egypt because as a child she was scared by a Tutankhamun documentary. So, she dislikes, for example, hummous, because it’s Egyptian. There’s no arguing with disliking hummous. But if the reason is that it is Egyptian (and King Tut and so on), then that’s a flawed and weak reason.
Acsenray is right. You seem to have fallen for the fallacy fallacy.
~Max
Huh. That actually helps me understand some of the push-back I was getting in that Wonder-Woman thread. I was a little bewildered why people were so upset with me saying some of their reasons were weak. Maybe they were thinking like you, that by saying their reasons were weak, I was saying their whole response to the movie was invalid. That wasn’t, of course, remotely what I was saying; but if they had the same understanding as you have, that might explain some of the reactions.
My circles a mess of nerdery is a good thing!
FWIW I agree that @TriPolar was fine in the WandaVision thread and felt bad as my question asking if he ended up liking Watchmen seemed to get the response that crossed into being noted.
Now posters since then have been annoying as fuck. Expressing a view, giving a negative review and explaining why you think that … that’s fine. Arguing why those who have a different take have wrong opinions, yes, LOHD, inclusive of telling them the why of their opinions are “wrong”? That is just obnoxious. These aren’t right/wrong things. I like chopped liver. You might not. It doesn’t matter in terms of right/wrong if you don’t like it because of the flavor, the texture, the smell, because it reminds you of a certain time in your life or person … you don’t like it Sam-I-Am.
Those who cannot let be that others do not share their dislikes, because they like wrong for wrong reasons, at some point they need to be shut up.
I’m fascinated that there are people who have such a strong interest in things they vociferously dislike. It’s like that SNL skit where everybody wants to taste how bad the sour milk is.
Take a look at the Howard Stern reddit. Howard ‘evolved’ a few years ago and turned his back on his core fanbase. They have taken to Reddit with a kind of hatred usually associated with Trump.
@What_Exit I humbly request you reconsider the decision to shut the WandaVision thread down.
Really there was ONE poster making jerky posts and not letting it go. That poster perhaps deserved a warning and a thread ban. In retrospect maybe others of us should have flagged it from the first “too stupid” to the continued unflagging assholery.
But the rest of us still want a place to discuss this show when new episodes drop. Which may include negative reviews and complaints about how it disappoints, or told ya sos about how the pay off was worth it!
Opening a new thread seems silly as opposed to kicking out those who make jerky posts with their beefs.
Thank you in advance for at least thinking about the request.
Meh. If someone in a thread on Victorian novels says, “I hate Oliver Twist, because everything Shakespeare wrote is terrible,” I won’t argue with them about whether all Shakespeare’s works are terrible, but I’ll tell them that’s a bad reason to hate Oliver Twist.
I knew someone who disliked ST:TNG because of that silly holodeck stuff with Vic Fontaine. He much preferred DS:9
First, there is a big difference, one I suspect you are aware of, between pointing out an incorrect fact, and “correcting” a “wrong” opinion.
In the WW thread your opinion of what is and is not standard and acceptable tropes in super hero movie is an opinion, an uncommon one to me sense of it, that you imposed as undeniable incontrovertible fact, which you could not believe that so many of us did not “know”.
Second, even in your example, you would be being a bit of an ass to make that comment, and I’d expect likely missing something of the comment made. If it was a simple factual error then just pointing that out, politely, is fine. Your comment not. If OTOH, the poster was indeed saying that Twist had too many Shakespearean themes or allusions, was, in their opinion, too derivative, and not in a good way, well it might be an uncommon opinion but still an opinion. A valid explanation for why they did not like the work. Personally I’d be wondering why they thought that and might learn something.
You are entitled to your level of suspension of disbelief within a genre and how much it takes to get in the way of doing that. You are not entitled to arrogantly and dismissively impose your opinion as fact upon those of us who disagree.
In this case, the thread went so far off the rails, I think it is best to “reboot” the thread.
I was in that thread from the beginning and it just seems broken beyond repair. Maybe we can keep the sniping and jerkish behavior out of the next one.
I’m not gonna relitigate the details, except that to say I think you’re incorrect here, and that discussion of such matters is the meat of discussion. If you think that makes me an ass, I can live with that!
I was visiting the Wandavision thread because I was interested in hearing theories about the mysteries presented in it. I can handle a negative review, but I don’t understand this need to convince everybody else in the thread that they should hate it too.
I think you should maybe reread the thread from the top. It wasn’t the shows critics who began the personal attacks, criticizing the poster instead of the show.
I find it offensive that the mods ignored those comments, likely because they agreed with their opinion of the show, while stepping in to censor the victims of those comments.
I had. And I honestly think you took a huge amount of offense where I personally saw none intended. And then kept it going and going. No @GuanoLad’s comment that maybe you came in with a certain expectation and were upset that it was other than that, that maybe you misunderstood what they saw as the point, may not have been on the mark, but it was not calling you stupid. Your continued subtle expressions from there? Way out of line. Should have been modded and my bad for not doing my part to flag them.
I am hoping moderation allows our reboot to stay open with all sorts of reviews allowed.