What's all this "true love" crap? He's a sperm donor!

[Krisfer_the_Cat]

*Originally posted by Bricker *
**
This response was off base; Shayna’s comment was on the OP’s rant, which she DID read, and only tangentially on the event that she, Shayna, did not attend. For Krisfer to suggest that Shayna’s comment was misplaced because she didn’t attend the event was to miss Shayna’s point completely. **

One last comment before I bow out of this nut house.
This comment had NOTHING to do with Shayna attending the wedding. Jesus how fucking stupid do you think I am? Don’t bother answering because I wont be listening. My comment was in response to Shayna’s bitching about Twickster going to the wedding and then have the** UTTER GALL** to dare complain about it.

The comment about kicking Twickster in the crotch was because Shayna said her bit… then came back for another shot. Wasn’t once to tell Twickster she was an ungrateful bitch not enough?

Spend a fucking 50k on your wedding. I dont give a damn. Or spend 50$ but for hells sake make it worth your time. That’s all.

[CanvasShoes]

*Originally posted by avabeth *
**I still don’t get it. So what if she made it a point to find a husband? Does that make her marriage any less valid? I still fail to see any sort of proof or indication that this is going to be a loveless marriage.

Mr. Avabeth and I sort of fell into each other. Neither of us knew it was coming. One of my friends was actively looking for someone to share her life with and to have children with. She’s getting married next year. I have no doubt that she loves her guy - the fact that she was actively seeking him out makes no difference.
Ava **

Yes, I realize that. Who knows whether their marriage is a “no, or a go”

The thing is, why isn’t Twickster allowed to rant on what she sees and feels regarding this woman’s actions.

Someone said “what business is it of yours”? Well, it’s no more the gripers of the OP’s business if Twickster

[Elza_B]

*Originally posted by CanvasShoes *
**Yes, I realize that. Who knows whether their marriage is a “no, or a go”

The thing is, why isn’t Twickster allowed to rant on what she sees and feels regarding this woman’s actions.

Someone said “what business is it of yours”? Well, it’s no more the gripers of the OP’s business if Twickster **

It’s posted on a public board, as Bricker pointed out. That gives the rest of us the perfect right to question what’s been said by Twickster. As Bricker also said, why post it if you don’t want comments? And some people are going to see things differently.

Where did I say Twickster didn’t have the right to rant? Both you and she seem to have come to that conclusion and I’ve said that NOWHERE in any of my posts. I’ve just asked what made her jump to the conclusion that it’s a loveless marriage, aside from the fact that this friend went online to find a husband TWO years ago and the best man’s toast (because, ya know, we should take EVERYTHING a best man says in his post at face value - no best man has ever been known to kid around or anything like that). So far, she hasn’t seen fit to respond to that.

Ava

[CanvasShoes]

Arrgh, hit submit by accident.

Anyway, I was saying, it’s no more those griping about the OP’s OP business, than vice versa.

If she finds something annoying about this, as long as she’s not hurting anyone else, and she wasn’t, as she is ranting HERE, and not at the subjects of the OP, then what’s it to you?

I agree with her, whether their marriage turns out to be a good one or not, I find it sneaky, bordering on dishonest to hunt down a guy to make sure you can have kids before the biological clock runs out.

The OP doesn’t say, but I find it even WORSE if the guy wasn’t even “in on” the fact that that’s why she was in such a hurry to find a guy and marry.

IMHO? The only reason to marry, is if you love each other so much that you can’t bear life without the other.

Mercenary reasons for marriage (despite the fact that, YES, I know they can “work out”) make me feel a little cynical too.

Anyway, so WHAT if someone wants to rant about this? How is she hurting anyone, to turn tables on you naysayers?

[CanvasShoes]

*Originally posted by avabeth *
**It’s posted on a public board, as Bricker pointed out. That gives the rest of us the perfect right to question what’s been said by Twickster. As Bricker also said, why post it if you don’t want comments? And some people are going to see things differently.

Where did I say Twickster didn’t have the right to rant? Both you and she seem to have come to that conclusion and I’ve said that NOWHERE in any of my posts. I’ve just asked what made her jump to the conclusion that it’s a loveless marriage, aside from the fact that this friend went online to find a husband TWO years ago and the best man’s toast (because, ya know, we should take EVERYTHING a best man says in his post at face value - no best man has ever been known to kid around or anything like that). So far, she hasn’t seen fit to respond to that.

Ava **

No, it wasn’t you, I think it was shayna. Sorry, it wasn’t necessarily directed at you. But at the “it’s none of your business” posters.

I clicked on submit before I was ready, that’s what I get for working in different applications!

[FordPrefect]

*Originally posted by jarbabyj *
**What’s pissing me off is this thread turning into a … **

What’s pissing me off is that the open bar has been completely overlooked. God’s answer to a bad wedding invite is to get smashed out of your gourd and hit on one of the wedding party, bride groom, whatever. When will anybody think of the childish behaviour?

[wring]

*Originally posted by CanvasShoes *
**Anyway, so WHAT if someone wants to rant about this? How is she hurting anyone, to turn tables on you naysayers? **

as one of the nay sayers, wasn’t ‘hurting’ me in the slightest. I was interested enough to respond. and I still haven’t heard any justification from them to the characterization in the thread title/op.

[CanvasShoes]

quote:

Originally posted by CanvasShoes
BOLDING MINE

I’m curious as to why you and others like you in this thread feel so strongly about a private rant of the OP’s

I missed this earlier. That’s just rich. Would you care to explain to me exactly how this post on a public message board qualifies as a “private” rant, please?

Sorry, private as in, the bride, groom and wedding party attendees know nothing about it. Bad choice of words.

quote:

Originally posted by yosemitebabe
I doubt twickster was ungracious at the party and I am surprised that any of you would suggest or assume that she was.

I don’t see where anyone in this thread has either stated or implied that twickster was ungracious at the party. I think she’s being ungracious here, behind the back of her “former underling.” After having enjoyed the graciousness of her host, she comes here and badmouths her for the opulence of the affair. She implies that the bride is a liar (“What’s all this “true love” crap?”) and calls the groom a “sperm donor.” I think that’s tacky.

On the first page, someone posted to the effect of “if you’re going to be that way, hopefully they won’t invite you to anything anymore” (paraphrased).

I was responding to that statement, and believe that Yosimete was as well.

However, though I’d never presume twickster to have been outwardly ungracious publicly, I strongly suspect that she was rather a frump at the reception, making it obvious that she wasn’t enjoying herself, if the bride was paying any attention. She didn’t make an effort to converse with her tablemates, as the music was too loud, she apparently didn’t dance or leave her seat for much of anything else, as she was able to chart the comings and goings back and forth to the table of the gentleman sitting next to her, and she outright admits to not making any attempt to socialize because she only spent 5 minutes fantasizing about getting up and introducing herself to anyone. I sure wouldn’t have wanted her at my wedding if that’s how she was going to behave.

On the contrary, it sounds as if she tried to talk to someone she knew, only to be rebuffed.

Her being too uncomfortable to converse with people she didn’t know is a separate issue from her feelings about the choice of groom, and wedding costs.
quote:

Originally posted by CanvasShoes
Sounds to me as if Twickster has a right to be a bit cynical about “true love” and the “sperm donor” comment.

She used to work with this person, and the person obviously made her plans known to those around her.

If that’s what’s important to the bride, hurry up and have kids, and if the groom was a Poindexter who feels lucky to have a steady lay. Heck, more power to 'em.

But personally, I feel sorry for the guy. IMHO? That’s kinda sneaky. I wonder if HE knows why he was hunted down and chosen?

Let me get this straight, you aren’t either of these people and you don’t know either of these people personally, yet you feel sorry for the guy? You characterize her behavior as hunting him down and call this completely unknown person “sneaky”? How on earth could you possibly know what is in this woman’s heart or what went on between them in private conversations? For all you know she stated clearly in her online profile that she was seeking a long-term, committed relationship and had a strong desire to have children and a family. And maybe he felt exactly the same way and that’s what attracted him to her in her profile and prompted him to contact her. Why on earth would you automatically assume she was dishonest with this man? That is just bizarre.

Apparently you missed the part where I said “if that’s what’s so important to the bride”. If that’s NOT what happened, so be it.

[Shayna]

CanvasShoes, I’d rather assume you’re just young and inexperienced in having a coherent dialog than to assume you’re being deliberately obtuse, so I’ll try this one more time.

I didn’t miss the “if/then” qualifier in your 2nd to last sentence. However, the last sentence, namely:

**But personally, I feel sorry for the guy. IMHO? That’s kinda sneaky. I wonder if HE knows why he was hunted down and chosen? **

stands alone without any qualifiers at all. So again I ask, since you don’t know these people, why on earth would you characterize this woman as having “hunted him down”? And why would you call her “sneaky”? And what exactly causes you to feel sorry for the groom?

If you’d like to retract your absolutes and replace them with qualifiers, such as, “IF she hunted down some schmoe who unwittingly married her thinking she was in love with him, when in fact she only wants to use his penis for its sperm production, THEN I feel sorry for the guy,” fine. But that isn’t what you said. And you have no way of knowing whether that’s even remotely true in this case, and neither does twickster, so your empathy for this particular guy in this particular scenario is misplaced, as is that portion of her rant.

The bride may very well have expressed the desire to marry and have children and took steps to find someone who shares those same goals. The fact that she’s now marrying two years after having said that doesn’t prove in any way, shape or form that she doesn’t love this man or that she hunted him down or that he wasn’t just as interested in settling down with a nice girl and starting a family as soon as possible. And I still fail to see what’s so bloody wrong with that!!

And once again (but for the very last time, as this is fast becoming tiresome), I never said that twickster didn’t have a “right” to rant all she wants. But I reserve the right to tell her that this particular rant is snotty, petty and uncalled-for. How much a host spends on a party to which you’ve been invited is none of anyone’s business. It is also not hurting me in any way if she wants to present herself as a snotty, petty, judgemental and ungrateful person. But I have as much “right” to say so as she does to be that way if she so chooses.

So there you have it. I hope that was finally clear.

[CanvasShoes]

CanvasShoes, I’d rather assume you’re just young and inexperienced in having a coherent dialog than to assume you’re being deliberately obtuse, so I’ll try this one more time.

{pooh bear}Oh Bother{/pooh bear}
Boy Shayna, you get up in arms and snitty at the least provocation (not just this thread, I’ve seen you in action before).

No, my entire statment was based on that the OP knew the person. That’s why the present tense of the “I feel sorry for him”. And IF that person did in fact search out a husband for just that purpose. If my sentence structure didn’t express that well enough for you, oh well. It’s not as if this is that big a deal. As it seems to be for you.

No, I’m not “young” unless you consider knocking at the door of 45 yo “young”.

I didn’t miss the “if/then” qualifier in your 2nd to last sentence. However, the last sentence, namely:

quote:

But personally, I feel sorry for the guy. IMHO? That’s kinda sneaky. I wonder if HE knows why he was hunted down and chosen?

stands alone without any qualifiers at all. So again I ask, since you don’t know these people, why on earth would you characterize this woman as having “hunted him down”? And why would you call her “sneaky”? And what exactly causes you to feel sorry for the groom?

I don’t know these people, but the OP does. If she’s not cognizant of this person’s reasons, then I misread her. And if that is the case, then you can rant/rave and throw fits all you want!

But IF as she was saying, this woman went on a two year hunt to find a potential father, then THAT is the reason I feel sorry for him.

If the OP doesn’t “really” know these people as you seem to be implying, then I don’t feel anything one way or the other. So what if they spent money? I addressed that in an earlier post (in favor in case you missed it).

If you’d like to retract your absolutes and replace them with qualifiers, such as, “IF she hunted down some schmoe who unwittingly married her thinking she was in love with him, when in fact she only wants to use his penis for its sperm production, THEN I feel sorry for the guy,” fine. But that isn’t what you said. And you have no way of knowing whether that’s even remotely true in this case, and neither does twickster, so your empathy for this particular guy in this particular scenario is misplaced, as is that portion of her rant.

No, that IS what I said, despite the fact that you misunderstood. If you’d note, I quoted the part of the OP where she said she knew of this woman’s motives.

But, sorry I didn’t Oh so carefully spell it out. I feel sorry for him now (present tense) BASED on what I believe the OP to know. And THAT I did state in the first post on this that I made.

The bride may very well have expressed the desire to marry and have children and took steps to find someone who shares those same goals. The fact that she’s now marrying two years after having said that doesn’t prove in any way, shape or form that she doesn’t love this man or that she hunted him down or that he wasn’t just as interested in settling down with a nice girl and starting a family as soon as possible. And I still fail to see what’s so bloody wrong with that!!

Good GOD woman, calm down, you act as if this is personal.

At any rate, as I said earlier, two different issues here. One is, as you are venomously defending, that of DOES the OP know this about the woman in question?

You don’t happen to believe she does. Fine.

I do. Easy enough?

And once again (but for the very last time, as this is fast becoming tiresome),

Laughing, My goodness… Well then why are you letting yourself get all worked up? Maybe you’re not, but based on this and many other posts of yours I’ve seen in different threads, you tend to get highly excitable (as is evidenced in the many swear words, boldings, exclamation points and so on that pepper your posts), about THE simplists rants.

It would lead one to believe that you are the one that is “young”.

I never said that twickster didn’t have a “right” to rant all she wants. But I reserve the right to tell her that this particular rant is snotty, petty and uncalled-for. How much a host spends on a party to which you’ve been invited is none of anyone’s business. It is also not hurting me in any way if she wants to present herself as a snotty, petty, judgemental and ungrateful person. But I have as much “right” to say so as she does to be that way if she so chooses.

Actually you did. You are the one who said “what business is it of yours …”. In other words, “don’t stick your nose in, you don’t have a right to complain about this”.

And yes, you have a right to complain about her complaints. But as Krisfer pointed out, it’s kindof funny/ironic that you’re getting in someone else’s business to complain about what she has done/said, regarding THEIR having “put their nose in someone else’s business”. I’m not saying you don’t have a right to comment on her comments, I just think it’s funny!

So there you have it. I hope that was finally clear.

You were “clear” all along. I just don’t happen to agree with your assessment.

I didn’t reply to help “make it clear” I replied because you asked questions of me. You want to continue to be “forced” into a “tiresome” (what’re you 90? :)) discussion?? That’s your deal, it’s not that big a deal to me.

[Shayna]

CanvasShoes, you’re about as thick as a 4x4. The OP appears to “know” these individuals so little that she refers to the bride as a “former underling,” not a friend (either close or otherwise) and had absolutely no first-hand knowledge of the groom whatsoever, save, apparently, for the speach given by the best man. She has been asked repeatedly by several posters here to explain exactly what makes her believe this woman was disingenuous in her vows of marriage and has yet to offer any sort of reply. All we have to go on is some off-hand remark made two years ago, which, for all we know could have been made in passing or in jest.

But it seems you’re clarevoyant and can not only see into complete strangers’ lives, but mine as well. I assure you, dear, I’m quite calm. I’m merely trying to get through your rather thick skull that you are not reading what you think you are reading, and emphasis seemed like it might help. Clearly I was mistaken, as you’re attributing words to me that I never said and making up interpretations out of whole cloth.

Yes, I find you exasperating and tiresome because you don’t listen and you don’t read for comprehension. I’ll now know better than to engage in discourse with you in the future.

Ta.

[kiz]

*Originally posted by kung fu lola *
**Oh god stop scaring me jeevmon! My honey and I are planning a wedding similar to yours, and we both make minimum wage and have curdled credit.
sniff We’ll never be able to afford a wedding, will we. NEVER! **

Oh, Lola, sweetie…SO and I got married this past spring. Granted it was just immediate family and close friends, but we spent $1000 tops, I kid you not. And I live in the Boston area.

It can be done with careful planning ;0

[CanvasShoes]

CanvasShoes, you’re about as thick as a 4x4. The OP appears to “know” these individuals so little that she refers to the bride as a “former underling,” not a friend (either close or otherwise) and had absolutely no first-hand knowledge of the groom whatsoever, save, apparently, for the speach given by the best man.

Would that be the “speech” given by the best man? Again, as I said, IF the OP doesn’t in fact know this then, yes, of course I have no way of knowing this man, or whether to feel sorry for him (which I stated in my last post, talk about lack of reading comprehension).

She has been asked repeatedly by several posters here to explain exactly what makes her believe this woman was disingenuous in her vows of marriage and has yet to offer any sort of reply. All we have to go on is some off-hand remark made two years ago, which, for all we know could have been made in passing or in jest.

And her lack of explanation is “proof” of this? Please. I’ve seen this sort of thing before. If she should come in and say, to the effect of “yes, I knew her enough to know this…and so on” the detractors would just up the ante.

But it seems you’re clarevoyant and can not only see into complete strangers’ lives, but mine as well. I assure you, dear, I’m quite calm. I’m merely trying to get through your rather thick skull that you are not reading what you think you are reading, and emphasis seemed like it might help. Clearly I was mistaken, as you’re attributing words to me that I never said and making up interpretations out of whole cloth.

Again, (and I DID state this in my last post) if she didn’t in fact know this then yay for them. My stating that I felt the way I did was based on the OP’s post, and that if she in fact didn’t know her then I couldn’t care less about the couple is in NO way claiming to be clairvoyant.

I also stated “maybe you’re not” when commenting on your bolds, profanity etc. That sort of thing seems to be the mark of someone getting all sorts of upset. If you’re not, you’re not. Oh well. But then, I said that in the post to which you just replied. (hmmm, lack of reading comprehension? kettle?).

How you DO like to run on and jump to conclusions.

Yes, I find you exasperating and tiresome because you don’t listen and you don’t read for comprehension. I’ll now know better than to engage in discourse with you in the future.

Oh, sigh, and I’ll miss you sorely too!

[twickster]

Sorry to leave you alone here to argue with these blockheads, CanvasShoes – I had things to do this evening. Actually, I pretty much checked out of this thread this afternoon, because it became clear to me that there wasn’t a fucking thing I could say to Shayna and avabeth that would penetrate their minds. I choose not to keep on with arguments when it’s clear that there’s no winning them, or even resolving them.

Yes, I’ve known the bride fairly well for several years. Yes, I’ve heard from her numerous times the urgency she’s felt about having kids. I have never discussed the matter with the groom, since although I’ve met him several times (including having the two of them to a dinner party in my home), my primary relationship is with the bride. From what I’ve seen myself and been told by the bride, he’s aware of the depth of her feeling of urgency.

I was attempting to express – and obviously failing completely – my reaction to 1) people marrying because of their feeling of urgency about having kids, and 2) people spending a lot of money on fancy parties. I probably should have stayed in MPSIMS, the forum where I originally planned to post.

Re: My behavior at the wedding: I attempted to talk to the only person there I recognized and was rebuffed. I talked with everyone at my table except the person directly across from me, who was too far away to talk comfortably. I had fairly long conversations with the people on either side of me (two on one side and one on the other) where we did the small-talk-of-strangers thing (where are you from, what do you do, friend of the bride or friend of the groom). Although the guy next to me asked me to dance, I said “no,” since it was a slow dance and this was about five minutes after we introduced ourselves. When the bride and groom came by, I gave the bride a hug, told her she looked beautiful, and said mazel tov. I gave the groom a kiss on the cheek and told him he was a lucky man.

And with that I’m outta here.

[SanguineSpider]

I’m PITTING Love!

DOWN WITH LOVE/LUST/FANCY/FONDESS/CRUSH/ADORATION!

You’ve hurt me so many times, Love, I hate you… and so I must pit thee here and now to teach you, Love, a lesson!

I pit thee, Love… may you burn in flames.

(not really)

[yosemite]

*Originally posted by twickster *
I choose not to keep on with arguments when it’s clear that there’s no winning them, or even resolving them.

Yeah. I’ve been wondering what all that was about. Sheesh.

Yes, I’ve known the bride fairly well for several years. Yes, I’ve heard from her numerous times the urgency she’s felt about having kids.

I thought you gave this impression (that you knew very well that the bride was feeling deep urgency to have kids soon) in the OP.

From what I’ve seen myself and been told by the bride, he’s aware of the depth of her feeling of urgency.

I am glad to hear this. I am glad that he knows. I wish this couple all the best.

I was attempting to express – and obviously failing completely – my reaction to 1) people marrying because of their feeling of urgency about having kids, and 2) people spending a lot of money on fancy parties.

I also find it a odd to become almost frantic to marry (which is seemed like your friend was) but I hope that, in the long run, she’s happy, her hubby is happy, and that this is a love match. And I am sure you feel the same way–that you wish her the best and you wish her every happiness.

As far as big parties go–I am of the feeling that people can spend money in any way they wish and it is not my place to say anything to them or rain on their parade. (But all that money! Oy! ;)) Hey–we all have our own internal gut reactions, okay?

I hope that the whoever paid for this party could well afford it. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread–that’s somewhat troubling to see–big splashy wedding that is way over the budget of those involved. But once again–that’s no one’s business, and certainly it would be very distasteful to say anything negative or critical and spoil the enjoyment of the big splashy party that they can’t afford.

But, still. Oy. All that money! Oy!

When the bride and groom came by, I gave the bride a hug, told her she looked beautiful, and said mazel tov. I gave the groom a kiss on the cheek and told him he was a lucky man.

Oh, you bitch. What inappropriate behavor! I hope nobody ever invites you to a big party again!

[Nightime]

Getting married to a guy in order to have children who you wouldn’t marry otherwise is only slightly less appalling than getting pregnant by your boyfriend so he will marry you.

I disagree.

Getting married because you want to have kids, assuming you are open about your desire to reproduce, can work out. Presumably you would choose a partner you liked, and who you thought would be good with children, even if you would not have married them otherwise.

Getting pregnant on purpose so your boyfriend will marry you is a recipe for disaster.

They aren’t in the same ballpark, or even the same league of appallingness (is that a word?).

[Elza_B]

*Originally posted by twickster *
**Sorry to leave you alone here to argue with these blockheads, CanvasShoes – I had things to do this evening. Actually, I pretty much checked out of this thread this afternoon, because it became clear to me that there wasn’t a fucking thing I could say to Shayna and avabeth that would penetrate their minds. I choose not to keep on with arguments when it’s clear that there’s no winning them, or even resolving them.
**

That’s lovely, twickster. I asked you for the exact same information you just provided SEVERAL times in this thread and instead of providing it, you bitch and whine about how we’re not listening to you.

:wally

Ava

[twickster]

That’s lovely, avabeth, I answer your questions and you call me a putz.

[Shayna]

*Originally posted by twickster *

I have never discussed the matter with the groom, since although I’ve met him several times (including having the two of them to a dinner party in my home), my primary relationship is with the bride. From what I’ve seen myself and been told by the bride, he’s aware of the depth of her feeling of urgency.

Proving what I’ve said from the start – that your characterization of him as merely a sperm donor unwittingly duped into marriage by a woman who couldn’t possibly love him was at best mistaken and at worst an outright hateful lie.

I was attempting to express – and obviously failing completely – my reaction to 1) people marrying because of their feeling of urgency about having kids, and 2) people spending a lot of money on fancy parties.

You have still utterly failed to answer why it’s such a big fucking deal (especially to you, since it doesn’t even affect you in the least) that people have a strong desire to have children and seek life partners who share the same desire. What. exactly. is so bad about that? And why do you care so much about how much money people spend on entertaining you? These people obviously went to a great deal of effort to ensure that you (and their other guests) had delicious food, free and plentiful booze and fun music to dance to. What difference does it make how much it cost – be that $100 or $20,000?

When the bride and groom came by, I gave the bride a hug, told her she looked beautiful, and said mazel tov. I gave the groom a kiss on the cheek and told him he was a lucky man.

…and then came behind his back and disparaged him with name-calling (sperm donor) and innuendo about his motivation for marrying your friend (he only went on his first date when he was in his 30s, so he must be some kind of loser – or something) and implied that his new wife (your supposed friend) was a liar who went before g-d, family and friends under false pretenses, seeing as how the “true love” part of their ceremony was nothing more than “crap.”

Nice.

And you expected to win me over to this line of thinking because…