I debated on whether responses to this would be IMHO opinion or GQ fact. Going GQ for now; Mods do your thing if the posts start suggesting otherwise.
For work, I am about to be given a company car with little choice in the matter. As in I’m being forced to take the car, but have a choice between 4 particular vehicles (all Chryslergroup): Sebring, 4x2 Liberty, 4x4 Liberty, and Caravan. I’ve pretty well decided on one of the two Libertys (Liberties?), and am now trying to figure out what would make choosing the 4x4 worth an additional $65/mo out of my paycheck to fund the car. Sebring is out because it has a larger footprint than the Liberty, pretty important for tight parallel parking. Caravan is out because it’s the most expensive of the four and, oh yeah, a Caravan.
It’s a company car, meant (primarily) for work driving. Work is going to various government buildings in and around DC, potentially driving to four or five sites in a day, depending on my workload. As deteriorated as some bits of the beltway are, it’s certainly not off-roading. And since this is a work vehicle, I can’t imagine much pleasure off-roading in my free time. Snow around DC is pretty hit-or-miss through the winter. You might get two or three really bad days most years. Sometimes much more, sometimes nothing. Gasoline will be paid by the company via a company debit card meant specifically for gas. Irrelevant as far as I can figure, but insurance/roadside/maintenance are all fully covered by the company.
So what would justify the extra $65/mo to take the 4x4 over the 4x2? The best I or my friends can come up with is that driving a 4x2 Jeep is akin to driving a highly tuned sportscar with an automatic transmission, an insult to the particular brand of driving that could occur. But for this car, being my company’s and not mine, I almost certainly won’t need the 4x4 traction for the 9 temperate-to-warm months of the year, and might not all that often in the 3 heck-it-COULD-snow months that the weathermen so loves to hype up.
I’d get the 4x2 and bank the extra $65/month and use it to buy a good set of snow tires if the winter looks bad. But all-season tires will do fine in average DC winters.
Heck, I made it through last winter in DC on summer-only high-performance tires.
You shouldn’t. It’ll just reduce your milage and is one more thing to break. If you don’t plan on going off road or drive in snow (and DC doesn’t count even if occasionally gets snow) then there really isn’t much point.
Rather than the 2x4 vs 4x4 making you feel like your not getting the most out of your purchase, I think driving the Sebring would be much more enjoyable than driving the Liberty. It’ll be more comfortable, safer, and has more inside room.
I’d definitely want some reasons to forego the Liberty altogether and take the Sebring (especially becase it’s the cheapest of the four, at only $130/mo). What’s steering me away, despite the cost of an extra $85/mo for the 4x2 Liberty, is the Sebring is just a bit over 16 inches longer. That’s an extra foot-and-change I need to squeeze into a metered spot downtown, or tiny residential streets in NW, or just in a parking garage space. Fuel Efficiency is basically picked up by the difference in the cars’ monthly costs, and I do admit that $85 is a useful little bit of pocket change that I’d love to not have to give up.
I’m not really seeing your argument about inside room without a test drive, Telemark. For the front, the only dimension the Jeep doesn’t beat the Sebring is legroom, and for that we’re talking 40.8" to the Sebring’s 42.3". Is that inch and a half really making things much more spacious? I’m the only one in the car. On weekends, Only Mostly Missus may be in the front passenger seat. The relative spaciousness of the Sebring’s backseat doesn’t mean much to me.
And one dimension that I, a lifelong sedan/coupe driver, am really starting to long for is ground clearance/height. I’m sick of being stuck behind the large trucks and SUVs and not being able to see around them. I hate that the solution is for me to join their odious ranks, but banning SUVs doesn’t seem to be coming along too well.
To expand a bit, it’s the sheer low cost of the Sebring ($130/mo) vs the smaller footprint and higher ground clearance of the Liberty 4x2 (@$215/mo) vs the benefits of the 4x2 plus the potential but seriously unlikely adaptability and foul-weather usefulness of the Liberty 4x4 (@$270/mo). I can’t see any argument for the $270/mo Caravan when I’m typically the only one in the car.
I agree with what has been posted so far. There are a gajillion threads about 2WD, 4WD, AWD, and the various permutations- most of which quickly devolves into GD territory.
One thing to keep in mind with a Jeep is that the 2WD model of the vehicle, unlike most other “cute-utes” is rear drive. If you are not accustomed to the handling of rear drive, you should get some practice under controlled conditions before handling the slushy stuff.
I don’t understand how you’re “given a company car with little choice in the matter” and that you only have four choices, and especially if you have to pay for it yourself. But, that’s just my own curiosity and not relevant to the OP.
What is, though, is the choice between a Sebring and a Liberty. A Sebring is only classified as an EPA midsized sedan. That’s hardly a big car. Granted I’m not familiar with driving in Washington, DC, but I have driven in many, many, many big cities, and never had problems with larger cars. Parking spaces are all standardized, including on city streets. Sometimes parking structures have individual spots that indicate “subcompact only” or “no trucks” and the like. I can’t imagine a small, mid-size car would have any size problems anywhere in the United States.
Ride height: a Liberty won’t do a lot for you behind an Expedition, for example. Still it’s better than nothing. I can’t stand being behind those things myself when I’m in a car or minivan, and I feel sorry for people behind me when I’m in an Expedition.
Everybody who does fieldwork will take a company car. And the cost of that car to lease from Chrysler and upkeep will be subsidized through automatic deduction from employee pay (I’ve contemplated Pit threads on being required to take SOME car for this policy, and being required to donate $130-$270 per month for the honor when I already have a perfectly good car, but it’s only been weak grumpiness at worst since I heard the plan). The company made a deal with Chrysler, and narrowed themselves down to four choices that they figured would work for all employees, whether they drove a little, or a lot, needing little or a lot of storage space, in urban and rural areas alike. It’s pretty safe to say that the cost of any of the cars including monthly lease, insurance, gas, roadside assistance, and eventual repairs, is going to cost more than the $270 they’re taking for the most expensive two. But by subsidizing a bit from the salary (which they just raised across the board much more than the car deduction will cost. I got a 24% raise, but that’s probably an upcoming MPSIMS thread), it makes the idea of company cars not so expensive for the company themselves. Not that I entirely agree with the executives’ policy, but I have little recourse to complain, and I really do make out with a pretty decent deal.
Granted, parking spaces downtown are roughly standardized. At the very least, they are demarcated to match with parking meters. On residential sidestreets in NW, it’s a free for all, and can be very tight when residents typically can fight for enough space to cover the width of their property, maybe as wide as two cars are long. 16 inches might as well be 16 feet in parking up there. I wouldn’t necessarily suffer with the Sebring, but would do so more than the Liberty. (And as of right now, I don’t know the company’s/Chrysler’s policy with dings and other cosmetic damage).
Don’t get me wrong. I want to be convinced that the much cheaper Sebring would work well, but in DC, smaller is better.
Better check for other differences between the two Liberties. The 4 X 4 may also have a bigger engine, different transmission, different options, etc.
If you’re going to haul stuff a lot, go for the Liberty. If you’re just driving yourself around, the Sebring sounds good. Do you have to pay for your own gas?
Pretty sure both Libertys are going to be automatic (curse bulk buying and lazy people not knowing how to drive stick!), and are going to be the same engine package. I’m guessing one of the Sport packages that allows for auto as an option. Gas is included via a debit card handled directly by the company. I use the card, they get the bill, I assume there’s a limit to their generosity. I assume one of the reasons for the pricing of the cars to be compensating for different gas needs. Hauling stuff is not a part of the job, but I am allowed to use the car for personal travel as well, and I wouldn’t mind the cargo space.
Neither vehicle is very big, I can’t really imagine parking to be a significant issue. Having driven much larger cars in the city, I really don’t think that with cars of this class the difference is very noticable. The visibility in the Sebring is probably much better than the Liberty (I haven’t driven either, so check it out in person) and would be easier to manoever
Drive the two of them before making a decision. While SUVs have gotten better at comfort and ride, in this case you are really comparing a car to a truck. IMO, that would be the biggest decision for me, I find cars much more comfortable to drive.
Are you going to be hauling things? That might be a factor, but I have found the space in many smaller SUVs to be not very useful. If the Sebring has fold down rear seats you can end up with some very usable space there. The space in the Liberty is much taller and you can tow about twice as much.
The smallest engine available in the two cars appears to be the same 2.4 l, and the Liberty weighs 500lbs more. But the Liberty appears to come with a 6 speed manual by default, the Sebring somes only with an auto. Gas milage still favors the car 30 to 26 highway, not a huge difference but one that I bet is bigger in real life.
But your original question was 2wd vs 4wd. Based on your needs, I can’t think of one reason to get the 4wd version.
FWIW, the Jeep Liberty is one of the most jittery vehicles I have ever driven. I hate driving it. I’ve spun the car out doing a mere 15 miles per hour on a right-hand turn in light snow, and my brother has done the same. I loathe that vehicle.
The high center-of-gravity and narrow wheelbase are huge turn-offs for me. We had to pack the trunk with several hundred pounds of sand before the vehicle felt stable. I also got into the only fender bender of my life (~15 years of driving experience) with the Liberty. Once again, light rain, slow speeds (under 25 miles per hour), fairly gentle turn and the Jeep skidded off sideways. Somehow, I managed not to be at fault in the accident, but it really should have been “too fast for conditions,” even though any normal car would have easily pulled through that curve without a slip.
When I needed to haul my equipment I bought a Cherokee. It has a solid rear axel, which makes it rather ‘truck-like’. I figured if I’m going to get a truck, I want it to drive like a truck. The Liberty has independent rear suspension, which is said to give it a car-like ride. I haven’t driven a Liberty, but I don’t find the Cherokee particularly uncomfortable to drive. I don’t even notice the handling, and I’m an agressive driver. The two things I don’t like about it is the lack of legroom (my MGB had more legroom!) and the automatic transmission.
I’ve driven my Cherokee for six years and have not had any handling issues. Again, I have not driven it’s replacement the Liberty. That said, I think most loss-of-control problems involve people driving a high-CG vehicle like a car – which they are not designed to do. I do become more cautious in the rain, and I do use 4WD in the snow and on mud roads.
Personally, for city driving, I’d shoose the smallest, lightest, most efficient, front-wheel-drive car I could find. Given a choice between the Sebring and the Liberty, I’d choose whichever got the best mileage. Since the company is buying your fuel, that’s not really an issue. Since I am an aggressive driver (not that I’m a dick, but that I learn what my vehicle can do and make use of its capabilities where appropriate), I’d choose the one with the better handling – I’m guessing the Sebring. Having lived in L.A. (and going back eventually) I understand the parking issue. That’s one of the reasons I have a motorcycle! Is the better handling, a little more legroom, etc. more important than being able to park in a smaller space? How often will you park in a ‘free for all’ area vs. a car park or marked street parking?
The Liberty ain’t too good on highways. It catches wind like a sail, and that high ground clearance combined with its light weight just throws you into other lanes.
Car and Driver once concluded the difference was about 150 yards before you got hopelessly stuck and had to ask a farmer to pull you out with his tractor.
The ability to use the company car for personal use is nice, especially if the company is picking up gas, repairs and insurance. I’d be inclined to go with the cheapest car available, but I’m a cheap guy.
All of my vehicles are 4 wheel drive, but I go out in the desert and off road for hunting fairly often. I use the 4 wheel drive enough to know that I need it, and even then I could probably do without it (I’d just have to walk a little farther than I do now). In your case, I’d recommend doing without the 4 wheel drive. Save the money.
I’ve lived in the DC area all my life until recently, and I own both a small/compact car, a Caravan and a 4x4 SUV. I would go with the Sebring. Technically the Sebring is also a 4x2, and paying extra for the aforementioned “truck feel” wouldn’t sit right with me. If you need and can use a truck type vehicle, get the 4x2 Liberty to save cash. It doesn’t sound to me like you would have any need for the 4x4. Otherwise save your cash and get the Sebring. The Sebring also shouldn’t be that bad in a DC winter as it is front wheel drive.
Are you going to be allowed to use this for personal use? If so, do you envisage taking the family skiing? For long drives? Are you going to be doing any long drives? What proportion of your day do you expect to be driving? Are you going to be carrying significant loads?
This is my other problem. As far as 4WDs, I’m used to driving heavier late-70s model Mercedes G-Wagens, and Toyota Landrcuisers. Those stick much better to the road in rain (I’ve never spun out those cars) and don’t fly around the road on the highway. I guess I just like real off-road vehicles primarily for crawling around at low rates of speed, climbing over rocks, and managing off-road terrain. I just don’t think they’re fun to drive in an urban or highway environment.
It will effectively be my only car. The car I have right now (2000 Sentra) is going to go up to my parents’ place in my father’s name. It will be there if I quit or am fired or something horrific happens that requires me to abandon the job and with it the company car. It won’t be gone-gone, but it won’t be around and I won’t be insured to drive it.
At the end of the two-year lease the company has worked out with Chrysler, I will either have the option to buy the car I’ve been driving for two years for some as-of-yet-unknown discounted price, or I will simply trade it in for a new lease car through my company with roughly the same cost scheme.
Personal use is allowed. I do occasionally have need to haul musical gear around for fun or the rare gig, and I’m guessing that within the two-year span, I might be looking into buying a first house, which will mean plenty of trips to Home Depot. Admittedly at the moment, hauling any loads is pretty low on the frequency list, but it very reasonably could change in the next two years.
Driving for work is pretty variable based on where my appointments are. If everything I have is within a 3 block walking distance from a metro stop, I’m gonna take the metro, and the only work mileage the car will see that day is the 20 miles roundtrip to the station. If I have residences outside of Metrorail service in NW, appointments with certain relatively inaccessible government locations (Bolling AFB is the big one for me), or have to go into northern VA, I can expect 100 miles in the workday without breaking a sweat. The ratio is typically about 4 metro days to one driving day, though. Other investigators are 4 driving to 1 metro, because they’d rather have the flexibility a car can provide. Typically as one stays longer at the position, one gets more accustomed to driving in DC.
Maybe I’m missing something, but a bare bones Liberty 4x2 can be leased for $260, according to http://www.jeep.com/. And your company wants to charge you $215 for the privilege of having them force you to take it? WTF?
Is the better handling, a little more legroom, etc. more important than being able to park in a smaller space? How often will you park in a ‘free for all’ area vs. a car park or marked street parking?