Don’t lose your daughter and granddaughter over a perceived teachable moment.
His crimes and failings are many:
As a person:
He is a rapist;
He is a career conman;
He is a racist;
He bragged about entering dressing rooms at beauty pageants, including teen pageants
As a politician:
He espoused the racist lie that Obama was a Kenyan;
He fomented an attempted coup on January 6;
He has repeatedly called for his followers to commit violence;
He promoted the lie that he won in 2020, undermining the public’s trust in our democracy;
He has used his office to suppress a free press;
He has used his office to enrich himself through breathtaking corruption;
He staged a successful coup by allowing Musk, an unelected oligarch, to dismantle the federal government and install a shadow state;
He is actively trying to dismantle NATO.
And on and on, but it won’t matter to them. Cut them out of your will and your life, but tell the granddaughter that if she ever needs to flee her betrothed, you will help her.
Also, get her a subscription to The Atlantic and Foreign Policy as wedding gifts.
You got to speak their language.
Saying that Trump is an asshole or a bully or an authoritarian or a or a racist or a fascist won’t help; they’ll just shrug or worse, say “good”. You have to attack him where they think he’s strong. Try, “I don’t like Trump because Trump hates America. Oh sure, he says he loves it, but I don’t believe him. The man’s a liar. I can tell.”
I don’t know what they’ll do. It probably won’t work, but it has a better chance than anything else. Best case scenario, they’ll challenge you, and try to prove that Trump does, in fact, love America - at which case you can argue the facts, which are on your side. What you have to remember is never concede anything. No matter what they say, either contradict them, or say, “I don’t believe that. It’s not true.” That’s what they do, and it’s the only way to beat them. Just remember: you can’t win by following the rules, because they won’t be. You have to go scorched earth. If you can get irrationally angry and foaming at the lips, do it.
You won’t convince them, because people generally can’t be convinced. Your job is to frustrate them, scare them, drive them crazy. Let them be afraid to discuss politics with you.
And a more recent example is “Sharpiegate,” when he just kept bizarrely doubling down on an incorrect statement as to which states a hurricane would hit:
What have you taught your daughter?
She’s an adult. My supreme power to influence her has past.
All I can do is show her the way by living it.
She is an adult, and you are an adult…as are those currently influencing her, so how are they different from you?
To someone tuned out of politics there is nothing obviously wrong with that executive order, on the face of it.
Per the ACLU,
President Trump’s executive order attempting to require documentary proof of citizenship for voter registration and restrict the acceptance of mail-in ballots received after Election Day, among other measures, is a blatant overreach that threatens to disenfranchise tens of millions of eligible voters. This measure will no doubt disproportionately impact historically-excluded communities, including voters of color, naturalized citizens, people with disabilities, and the elderly, by pushing unnecessary barriers to the fundamental right to vote.
But you can’t expect someone not into politics to glean this (let alone agree) just by looking at the order itself.
~Max
Do good people find themselves on the ass-end of 34 criminal fraud convictions, adjudicated sexual abuse, charged under the Espionage Act, sued for criminal fraud and racial discrimination? Do they brag on a hot mic about getting away with sexual assault?
I would agree with @Beckdawrek, though, You’re not gonna change anyone’s mind. I made plenty of unwise decisions because I was in love. I would only try and meddle in a relationship if dude was a substance abuser or a physical abuser. Other than that, people sleep in the beds they make.
Articles about the Order:
But I pretty much got all that just by reading the order itself.
The OP uses “why” as in “in what manner”, but I read it as an exestential question:
Why is trump a bad president? He could be a bad president like Nixon, or (god help me for using him as an example) Bush II. A president that is bad, but within normal parameters. Nixon was corrupt, and had an enemies list, but he, as the Vulcans say, “went to China”, and he started the EPA. I think mostly he wanted this country to be good, but the devil was in the details. And, watergate.
Bush II should be in prison for life, but I sincerely believe he thought he was doing the right thing. He started the gulf war, but he also started a program to combat HIV/AIDS. MAGATs would NEVER do that.
But trump! He seems hell bent on destroying this country in the worst ways. Is there anything, anything at all, comparable to the good things mentioned above? One? If there’s a good way to do…whatever it is he wants to do, he’ll chose the most destructive way instead.
“Sticking it to the libs” only goes so far to explain gutting the post office, the NTSB, FAA, NOAA…MAGAts use their services, too!
But they don’t know the use those services. Red state America is much more dependent on the federal government than blue state America, but they don’t know it.
She has the basic understanding of how to be a good person. I raised her to care about others less fortunate than herself. And care about social programs that are useful to most people.
She’s a nurse.
She loves all animals.
I think she’ll wake up in the nearish future and dump this dweeb.
We have our fingers crossed.
Not to mention what her siblings put her through on the down low.
That’s a tough crowd. They don’t suffer fools.
OP: Ask yourself a few questions before embarking on this path.
- What do you think you will gain from this?
- How likely are these people going to change their minds?
- How far can “they are ignorant” go in today’s world as the reason for their stance?
These people are magaflatearthers for a reason. And the base reason is that Trump says out loud the hateful thing they believe. Trump still believes the Central Park Five committed that crime and should be executed for it now even though capital punishment has been outlawed in New York sate and so do his supporters.
His supporters believe President Obama is a Muslim who was born in Kenya.
Trump believes Ilhan Omar praised al-Queda and married her brother and so do his supporters.
None of this matters to his supporters.
So, I ask again, what do you hope to happen if you pursue the course you outlined in the OP? You said you want them to understand why you hold the opinion of Trump you do. Guess what. They’re not interested in what you say. They already believe they know the reason. You hate America.
And that’s the way it will always be until they unconvince themselves out of it.
Someone upthread said some family are worth alienating. There’s a way to go about that without creating drama. Just stop communicating with them.
That’s just my humble opinion.
I so agree with this.
The drama will be on the OP.
I can’t believe someone would set up their child and grandchild just so they can disavow them of their Trumpism when he said they are not even much aware of the political noise.
It’s gonna drive a wedge in their relationship.
It’s gonna make it difficult to have one in the future.
Right. Let me be clear here. Trumpism (what I call magaflateartherism) is intentional.
My basic answer would be this: “I’m opposed to Donald Trump and those who support him because I’m a patriot who loves and respects her country and is indebted to those who devoted or gave their lives for the principles this country was founded on.” It’s what I truly believe, and I’m not going to let these traitors claim they’re patriotic or try to cast the rest of us as unpatriotic.
It’s BECAUSE I care about my kids and what happens to them that I’d speak to them about it if either had been inclined to marry a Trumpster. For that reason, I’d focus on my daughter and her future so it comes off as personal rather than merely political.
I’d caution you not to specifically put down this guy, which might cause her to feel defensive. Let her see that you’re not only angry but genuinely and deeply worried about her future and that of the country. And I wouldn’t do this over the phone if I could help it. It’s much better to do it in person, or at the very least, through FaceTime.
The “drama” was brought to the forefront by the boyfriend.
I’m a Democrat. That means I believe in law and order. Trump is a felon, who stiffed small businesses during the 1980s and 1990s, ripped off stockholders during the 1990s, and gained his fortune by committing inheritance tax fraud during the 1990s. I admit he’s a talented reality show actor.
He also fired a bunch of veterans for no good reason and without cutting the deficit. He’s a fraud. You need to question your information sources.
IOW tune your criticism for normie traditionalists.
You don’t know that.
Seems like the OP is looking for script to bring the drama to them.
I don’t know that, tho’.
I’m presuming, since he asked for the high points to relay back to them.
If he wanted to help his daughter and grandchild understand, how about a quiet, private talk? Then drop it. Either they’ll get it or not.