And yet, mathematical analysis of The Stable Marriage Problem has shown that the opposite is true; the initiators end up with maximal happiness while the ones being initiated to end up with minimal happiness. Either there’s a logical reason why the mathematical model doesn’t quite match reality or we are basically kidding ourselves with a conveniently soothing myth. “Oh sure, men play the dominant role, but really the women like it that way.” uh huh.
As far as human interaction goes, that’s a game theory problem not math, imho. I doubt it ends up with “maximal happiness” for initiators in real life. Unless you think every man out there is in the best relationship he could hope for.
I don’t see conflicting views, but an example of how to do it, and how not to do it, with a further Expansion on which non-grocery-store places are not okay.
I watched a YouTube commentary from one US woman comparing experiences in America and Germany, and she said that in US, Singles go to bars expecting to find Partners, esp. one-night stands, whereas in Germany, friends go together to talk with each other. This means that a single woman in US bar is seen as “she wants to find a Partner” and thus likely chatted up by many (single) men, when she might just be there to Chat with her friend she hasn’t seen in weeks, and the bar is the only place open at this hour.
Because it bothers many women to be constantly chatted up in bars when they don’t want to, many avoid bars.
There’s the additional Problem that women in bars might not go alone, but with friends, because they are afraid somebody will slip something in their drink and take Advantage.
In Addition, if you don’t want a one-night stand, why don’t you try to get to know the woman first - as friend - before moving onto “lets have sex”?
Is that a TV Show? (Percolate? Are you a gas, or a human? 
)
Do you mean “single women”? Do you personally know all the women you interact with are in a relationship? Because looking for rings is not a sure way…
She should; but many don’t dare in case the guy turns out to be a jerk.
There’s a difference between what’s fair/ right, and reality.
As said above, I would not recommend a bar.
I would guess because of the perception that single men go to bars only to pick up one-night stands, and a high Ratio of These types are jerks?
If I were looking for a relationship with a guy, I would not frequent places where men looking for one-night stands are cruising. The usual recommendation is joining a Club (sports, Hobby)… then you meet many People, get to know them, you know you have at least one Thing in common…
That would be good. As has been said: try to imagine Orcs, and what place/ what Approach would make you feel safe.
What do you want: a sociological poll? Youtube stories from People who moved from America to here?
It’s been my experience that men assume a woman asking them out entails a presumption of sex in the first or second encounter. If she does the asking, it’s a “hot date” so to speak. And that was back in the 80’s and 90’s, when sex in the first three dates was unheard of. Now I’m given to understand that it’s the norm.
I’ve often thought that Bujold’s concept of the Betan Earrings was an excellent one.
From the link:
Germany.
I’m kind of curious myself. You said in your culture, it is no longer acceptable for men to hit on women. Perhaps you can explain what this means?
Hitting on = making an unwanted (often crass) advance towards a stranger
I thought that was the AE usage?
If she’s a classmate which you know, you’re not hitting on her, you’re asking her out.
I mean the Situation so many US women have described (here and elsewhere): they’re in bar, a grocery store, or just Walking down the street, and a stranger tells them “you look hot” “want to come with me” or any similar.
It means that generally, a guy who walks up to a woman he doesn’t know and starts flirting with her/ saying Pick-up lines - whether at a bar or a grocery store - is seen as creep and socially not acceptable.
It doesn’t mean that there aren’t men who still do that -there are always some segments who behave like trash.
It may also be a General cultural difference - the whole idea of one-night-stand didn’t really gain traction even after the 60s sexual Revolution. Before the 60s, men followed the patriarchal Standard of dating a Girl, and then marrying her. After condoms, the pill and women being recognized as People, marriage started dropping away, and couples living “just together” slowly rose.
But the experiences told by US women on the Internet are completly Alien to me - Walking on the street and being whistled at by construction workers? Strangers telling women to smile? Strangers talking to women at a bar? I’m not saying it will never ever happen here - but People will consider that low behaviour. Whistling construction workers might have been acceptable as a sign “she’s hot, so it’s a compliment” in the 50s, maybe, but not today. Strangers talking to us is generally rude, but wanting a one-night-stand? No, we want relationships. It’s similar to how in my culture, we don’t call People “friends” after talking to them for 2 hours. That’s acquaintance. Friends are deep Lasting relationships which take time to cultivate. (Apparently the dislike of German Girls to want one-night-stand is some disappointment to Young male US students going to night-clubs…)
Yet to me, it sounds like unneccessary complication. Why do you Need markers, if women are equal and free and safe enough to just drink a coffee with a guy, and over months and months and months, getting to know each other, and either stopping at friendship, or going further towards partnership?
It only makes sense if you Need a Signal right away, instead of getting to know People first, and once you know that you can talk with each other, and there’s enough trust, you can discuss things.
How does a guy ask a girl out for coffee?
Like I used to have to tell the Firebug, “use your words!” Words can be a very effective means of communication, with the flexibility to transmit a wide variety of messages. Positioning of rings, not so much. 
“I’m going over to Starbucks. Wanna come with?”
But we have learned that in Germany that would be considered too rude, unless you already know her. Viscious circle / Catch 22… Think about people who don’t meet singles in their daily life, and there aren’t really any activites they can join in their area.
As **Jim **stated, apparently I have to already know the girl in order to ask her to go to Starbucks.
I don’t remember it being like that in the early 90s. Has it changed that much?
Yes and then young men will get sexually frustrated and join fringe political movements and get thrown in jail and write manifestos blaming someone else for all their problems, and…
What do you mean by…
:eek::eek:
I don’t think it necessarily means “unwanted.” It just means you make your interest in someone clear.
Depends on the circumstance. You went to a rock concert / poetry reading and noticed a Girl sitting there. After the Event, you ask her “Want to discuss the band/ Poem in the coffeehouse next street?” - okay.
Looking at a woman in the subway and asking “Want to drink a coffee with me?” - not okay.
I’m hardpressed to think of that: These People don’t go to work (or work at the bottom of a mine-shaft without colleauges). They don’t do volunteer work, either. They are not part of a sports Club, pigeon fancier Club or anything.
It is more difficult if you are poor, but the bigger cities have meetups that are free of Charge, too: Senior Dance on wednesday afternoon in the Senior centre; free sports in the City park in summer; etc.
And it’s not just cities - in rural Areas, it’s much more important to be part of the “traditional clothes / old-fashioned Shooting Club” (Trachten/ Schützenverein), the volunteer fire Brigade, or whatever, because there’s Little else.