My wife and I have had a couple of instances lately, when folk of the conservative persuasion with whom we are somewhat friendly totally went off on Hillary. One woman repeatedly called her a cunt, and the guy called her a lying bitch. These were not folk we would have thought if as terribly “political”, or extreme.
Why the venom? She didn’t even win! I know on TDS, she attributed it to sexism. Is that it? Or has the level of acceptable discourse just sunk so low?
It’s complicated.
Remind me to post more in the morning.
25 year nonstop GOP-lead smear campaign. Nowadays, the Hillary-hate is recognizable as the beginnings of the slide into fake news, irrational hatred, and the constant lying (especially to themselves) for the GOP and its supporters.
People are scared of the Clintons. And there is no reason to. Their day has passed, these peeps need to move on. It is such a waste of time to spew hate and bigotry all day, every day! We have big probs in this country and it needs to be addressed.
The Clintons have been the subject of almost constant negative views from Republicans and their allies for decades. Those views have included numerous allegations of illegal or quasi-illegal behavior on the part of Hillary Clinton (Whitewater, Travelgate, Filegate, Troopergate, Vince Foster, etc. all were allegations brought during her time as First Lady, in the '90s). This has created at least the imprimatur that she is a person who doesn’t always color within the lines, yet escapes any punishment. That narrative was pushed extremely hard during her time as Secretary of State, and then later during the run-up to the 2016 election.
I, personally, don’t think it’s a result of sexism. I think it’s a result of the fact that Hillary Clinton hasn’t always been scrupulous in her behavior, combined with the virtual meltdown the Republicans suffered after the Clintons won in 1992 by appropriating certain Republican campaign themes. But, yes, the level of accepted discourse has sunk that low, and even lower. <sigh>
Look at how people refer to those they disagree with on this board. It’s not a sickness confined to Hillary haters. Discourse is that low and actively promoted as such nowadays.
Attacks on her began when Bill was elected and, after a while, it became a sport among those on the Far Right to try to drag her down. With enough time and enough stories put out (over the course of 25 years), many of the themes of the attacks have been accepted into the popular lore as “fact.” The attitude that she has demonstrated on numerous occasions that the Oval Office is her due has not helped her cause.
It has not helped that she presents as having nearly as much hubris as Trump, himself. She has been caught on several occasions making self-aggrandizing claims about her life that have ranged from mild exaggeration to outright lie. Most of them would go down as typical political self-promotion, except that Fox and crew have consistently and persistently blown them out of proportion. Part of that may have been inspired by a Right Wing fear that she could actually acquire actual power with the resulting need to keep any power away from her. (How much of that is due to a fear that a woman (shudder) might be powerful, or even president, is hard to say. I have certainly known a number of people who have expressed that fear over the years, but I do not know how seriously prevalent such attitudes may be.)
She has not helped her cause by portraying herself as a staunch progressive while periodically taking positions in the Senate and as Secretary of State that put her at odds with the progressive ideals, thus adding many on the Left to join those on the Right in their antipathy toward her.
I think a lot of it is defensive rationalization at this point. Some people who voted for Trump have become aware of what a terrible choice he was. So to justify their mistake, they have to tell themselves that Hillary Clinton would have been worse.
Oh , Arkansans hated Hillary while Bill was governor. She has always had problems with likeability. But they have been investigated to the nth degree, there can’t be anymore skeleton left interred.
I want to hear from people on the right why they hate her so much, but I have no idea how much of their explanations will be valid, honest discussions about the real reasons they hate her.
They may say ‘she is a crook’, but they voted for a far bigger crook by voting for Trump. So it is hard to take that seriously. If they mention her emails, that doesn’t change the fact that both Pence and Trump have used insecure communication methods (Mar A lago is insecure, Trumps android phone is insecure, Pence used a private email server and private email account)
So I don’t know why they hate her, but even if you find answers, how many of those answers are the real reasons they hate her vs. superficial justifications that are contradictory and hypocritical?
if I had to guess why they hate her (and this is a guess) I’d say because she has always been an ambitious, independent woman (she was never a submissive trophy wife) combined with 30 years of right wing propaganda portraying her as a super-criminal who never gets caught. Also she never had her husband’s social skills, she has always come across as wooden to a lot of people and I guess that adds to it. But that is my guess.
I liked Bill Clinton when I was younger. I voted for Gore, Obama blah, blah, blah. I loathe Hillary Clinton with the passion of a thousand burning LED light bulbs. She reminds me of every narrow minded financially well off person who thinks they are vastly superior to the unwashed uneducated masses beneath them. She reminds me of the worst things in the people I grew up with. And what I find the most nauseating thing is this belief that exists among certain classes of people that they have enlightened views that are so superior to anyone who disagrees with them. I could go on, part of me wants to go on, but I’m really tired of typing.
Just for the record, I do think the press did as bad a job on reporting about her as they do with any candidate - e.g. the “putting coal miners out of work” phrase is one of the most taken out of context things I’ve ever seen. I also don’t believe the whitewhater allegations or any of the other unproven allegations (email scandal, Vince Foster etc.).
Just something about her reeks of upper middle class condesention which triggers me.
They have the same info you have on Trump and Clinton, you are never gonna convince them that she is better than Trump. They have all drank the koolaide.
I first started disliking H. Clinton when she was on point for health care reform in the mid 90s. Since I think that overstepped the bounds of the proper role of government, that was a negative. When she came out against violent video games in violation of the 1st amendment that made it worse. When she pushed more gun control that clinched it.
Hillary came from less than ‘highclass’ circumstances. She propped ole’ Bill up til he achieved the POTUS. She is probably ahelluva lot smarter than him. And on top of that had to put up with his philandering! I love the Clintons, I have met them several times. You would not believe how down to earth they both are. She likes dirty jokes, and laughs like a bar maid. Of course we all know of Bills personality. They are actually funny toghether, you can tell they just get each other.
[whine] But it’s so much easier to blame someone we don’t like! [/whine]
The one does not necessarily follow from the other.
Thinking Candidate A is unacceptable does not mean Candidate B is acceptable. Not by a long shot.
My concerns regarding Hillary Clinton related to the activities of the Clinton Giustra Enterprise Partnership and the Clinton Foundation in Colombia and Haiti. Not acceptable from reports on the ground.
I don’t understand it, either. Hillary is about as centrist or hawkish a Democrat as Republicans could hope for.
There’s a good chance that this will lead to a liberal version of what Republicans did after the Mitt Romney treatment in 2012. The political left will say, “Well, if this is how you treat one of ours who is centrist and reasonable, then we’ll offer up someone who is much less palatable to you; see how you like that.” And that candidate will probably win in 2020.
I would say your guess has a lot of truth to it. I would add that the way she was portrayed in 2008 and again in 2016 as being pretty much entitled to the nomination didn’t do her many favors among a lot of people on the left.
Offer away. If they think the “centrist and reasonable” candidate couldn’t beat Trump but a looney toons leftist will, well … good luck with that.
FWIW, she was a good bit TOO hawkish regarding Russia for my tastes (threatening a no-fly-zone in Syria and playing coy about whether she’d order the USAF to shoot down Russian jets).
Her gun control positions have always rubbed me wrong too.
She’s a woman who’s more competent than likable, and that scares a lot of Americans.