Y'know what Dad? Fuck you. (longish)

I love you, you know I do. And I appreciate you trying to help me find a job and get on my feet… but keeping tabs on me constantly and then calling to bitch me out on the phone doesn’t help.

Yes, I was late for work last night. But let me tell you a couple of things. 1) I have just started the night shift. My body is adjusting. I’m doing my damndest to get up and get there on time and be a good little drone. So far I have managed well. It’s only the second week and only once I have overslept. Last night. Which leads to 2) One of my very good friends lost his Grandmother. This guy isn’t very likely to cry, but he showed up at my place looking totally wasted from lack of sleep and on the verge of tears. So I stayed up an extra hour to snuggle with him and let him know that it’s okay.

Now you may think that helping friends is not important. But know what? I’m the caregiver type. He needed snuggling and comfort so I gave that to him. I wasn’t really tired anyway, so when I went to bed I stayed up another hour trying to get to sleep! Which pisses me off. I then slept through my alarm clock waking when I should have left the house. I called them immediately to let them know I had missed my bus, and was on my way. I arrived 30 minutes late.

You called me up today while I was sound asleep to bitch me out, while I was trying to sleep for work. To tell me that if I lose my job over this that you will not give me any money. Know what? You have given me pretty much nothing for the past 8/9 years anyway so why think I would expect you to now? I never expected you to buy me groceries like you have been sometimes. The only time I ever asked you for any money I paid back most of it and you told me not to worry about the rest. I still plan to pay you back though. I have never asked for help with my bills. Never asked for help with rent. I have not been freeloading like you seem to think I have.

Yes I’ve run into snags but I’m 20 and on my own for the first time. I couldn’t live with Grandma anymore, though I tried. I don’t want to move back in with Mom because I like the city I am in. But why the fuck do you think I will come crawling to you for help? Since the divorce my brother has been your little baby. You’ve given him everything, and he seems well able to meet up to your standards. Well I can’t. I’m doing my best here to go to school and pay my bills… which is not fun on a graveyard shift but I have been managing as best I can so far.

I’m glad you seem to have finally taken an interest in my life but know what? It’s too little too late. I know we lived far apart. I know that I remind you of Mom. I also know I pushed you away, but you didn’t help matters by always being this assholish man who insisted I grow up and be the proper older sister. It was hard on my brother, but it was hard on me too trying to protect him from the ravages of the divorce.

I am starting to get my life together and you are not helping by bitching me out. I am not getting back to sleep today. Meaning I have slept only 8 hours in the past 24. Meaning I am damn glad it’s Saturday tomorrow because I can sleep all fucking day once I get off work. Oh right… if I’m not fired as you so nicely told me. The day manager who hired me saw my time card. She saw I was half an hour late. She only asked if I was adjusting okay. I have been so far, but switching to graveyards is going to be a little tough on the body.

So just… just fuck off. Leave me to my life. If I have to I’ll call you up to have you put my stuff in your basement and I’ll hop a bus back to Mom’s. Just stop acting all high and mighty asshole on me and let me do what I need to do. If that is fall… well so be it. I’ll fall. I’ve done it before it won’t hurt me again.

Now I am going to attempt to relax in the 4.5 hours before I have to be at work so I don’t shake so much I drop coffee all over myself or someone else. Thank you so much for the added stress.

So tell him this. Or, is there a problem with that? :dubious:

Sometimes all fathers have to hear is “this guy stopped by” and then they get a little cranky…I was someone’s 20-year-old daughter once. :slight_smile:

How much sleep do you normally get? I would love to be able to get 8 hours of sleep every 24.

How the hell did your dad know you were late in the first place?

The problem with telling him this is that I can’t. It’s impossible to talk to him, unless I catch him at a time when he’s not pissed off at me. There are a few things that have bothered me over the past but about the only thing I’ve managed to get him to do is to shut up about the divorce (for the most part at least).

I didn’t tell him it was a guy. All I said is a friend came by because their Grandma had just passed away and needed comforting. My Dad proceeded to tell me that work and school is more important then friends. I will agree with that point, there is a time when you have to say no. But I hadn’t seen this friend in a few weeks and he just needed to have a shoulder to cry on.

Scooby I usually get around actually 8 hours every 24… I meant about 48 hours. I’d slept about 3/4 hours the night I was late and Dad called and woke me up from a nice deep sleep that I was about 4 hours into yesterday.

Dad knew I was late because Grandma was supposed to come by and drop off my mail at work, when I was there. I’d talked to her the day before and let her know I’d be there at that time. I wasn’t that late (30 minutes because I had to wait for the next bus, even if I’d walked in the cold and snow it would’ve taken me that long to get there so I figured I may as well not freeze half to death) so she must have gotten there right at 11 or so, or she may have wandered in, not seen me and walked out again. She then told Dad who called me.

I know he loves me, and I know he’s ticked that I apparently don’t have a future plan. But I’m not him, and I’m not my brother. It took me some time, but I’ve been working through a lot of things to get myself going. Like getting my high school diploma finally (which is one thing that pisses him off) and trying to settle on a career choice for uni/college that I can live with at least.

It just pisses me off that I’m an adult. I don’t live under his roof, I live under my own (I haven’t lived in the same house as him in 8/9 years. Only this past year it being my own.) and yet he expects me to live by his rules. He’s done his best with me, and I probably haven’t helped. But I’ve always had troubles following his rules. It’s like he had my life planned out for me and never let me know about it (graduate high school at 17, go immediately to college/uni, work my way through as he won’t pay for a cent of it (I’ve paid for my own high school upgrading and haven’t complained about it), go into a career, marry have 2.5 kids etc etc). And so far all I’ve done is disappoint. I got my diploma at 19, am still taking high school courses to get all my sciences. I want to be a paleontologist, which he sees as a waste of time.

I just want him to see me as not my Mom, not some rebellious teenager but as an adult who has made her own choices and is attempting to live with them and manage on her own without waiting for Daddy to come and save her. I have never asked him to help me and yet he seems to think I am sponging off of him. Every so often he buys me groceries and tosses me a 20 for spending money… but I never called him up and said “Dad, can you buy me groceries?” or give me money or whatever.

The most frustrating part of it is, I know he means well and that he loves me and worries about where my life is heading… but it’s my life. If I have to fall… well I will. I’ll manage somehow and I’ll get back on my feet somehow. I’ve done it before (see high school diploma) and I’ll do it again.

The only suggestion I can make is to quit taking the odd twenty/bag of groceries. He’s only giving them to you so that he can feel he has the right to control you, and refusing to take them is probably the fastest way to put him in his place. You don’t have to be confrontational about it: if he asks, just say, Thanks, but I’ve got it under control". If he puts money in your hand, refuse it once, nad if he starts to make an issue of it, drop the issue and just silently leave the money on the hall table on your way out the door. Don’t engage him directly, because that is what give him the chance to bully and bluster and make you feel like shit. There is a pattern here of him calling hte shots nad you responding, and they only way to change that pattern is to avoid the situations where you both fall into your traditional roles.

Oh, and quit worrying about what you should have done or if you were hard to have a relationship with over the years, didn’t reach out enough, whatever, You were a child, and he was an adult. When you were a child, it was his job to make a relationship possible. Now that you are an adult, it’s up to you whether or not you want to have a relationship. And just in case you don’t knoe it, it’s OK not to love him, not to have a relationship with him. You get to choose what you want, and you aren’t obligated to feel anything at all (this goes both ways, of course).

I have considered that Manda, but it’s awful hard to say no when you are standing in the middle of a restaurant/grocery store. I have said no, and he’s taken it at that. But I’ve also had him pretty much force the money on me when I say no I’m okay (ie when I paid him back most of the money I owed him he said not to worry about the rest. I said I wanted to pay him back because I wanted to feel like I can pay my bills but he started getting ticked off and we were in public so I dropped it). He’ll call me up, and bitch me out but I still haven’t changed my ways for his liking. I do what I see I need to do and work on doing what I have to do not because he wants me to but because I want me to. It’s always been like that, and it probably always will be.

I know I don’t have to love him, even if he is my father. But I love him despite of that. When he isn’t pissed off at something I’m doing/not doing and attempting to be a proper Dad (he always has been, but it was harder before because we lived in seperate cities. Now I live closer, which makes it easier for him to get involved) we have fun and a good relationship. As two adults who go out and talk about life, and can share memories of the past and discuss our relatives and whatnot.

It’s just when he gets the urge to be involved that things get rocky. It’s kind of a family tradition though he’s managed to get over it mostly. Him and Grandpa used to have huge rows up until the last year before Grandpa died, and even then Grandpa would try and tell him how to live his life.

You’re doing all right. Heck, I was in my mid-30’s before I could finally say, “Fuck you, Dad!” and I may have had better reason. If it’s any consolation, my father never understood why I majored in Japanese. I’ve also got a perfect younger brother who always has at least three plans, I swear, including a five-year plan which, unlike the old Soviet ones, is actually somewhat grounded in reality.

Hang in there. You already understand something important – he’s not hateful, just clueless. And now, if you’ll excuse me, I have to tackle one of the legacies I’ve got from my father. I have to do some rather large-scale cleaning before my apartment’s plumbing’s inspected on Monday, including stashing a bunch of boxes in the storage unit. Hmmm . . . surf the SDMB or clean . . . . maybe just a few more threads? :wink:


And he knows that, which is why he does it. Another alternitive is to pick up the check sometimes when you are at a resturant: not every other time, even, just occasinally: one in five, or so.

This really isn’t about the money: it’s about control. I get the feeling from your post that you, yourself, are a bit ambigous about whether or not he has the right to be disappointed in you/tell you what to do (which is normal at 20). It’s your own feeling that if he pays for you, then he has rights over you that you have to fight, and by far the simplest way to do it is to stop accepting money. You don’t have to be confrontational: like I said, if he isnsists on paying there in the grocery store, drop the matter, but as you get out of the car, toss the money for the groceries back in at him just as you close the door, or mail it to him.

Yeah that would work. Or I can just give it to his gf who will give it to him (he’s only here about half the month now as he works in the camps)

I’ve always found it hard to speak up to my family. So most of the time I just listen when they are talking, and then proceed to ignore them and do my own thing (it may or may not coincide with their ideas of what I should do) I just have to get it off my chest sometimes. Like yesterday… he woke me up when I was sleeping for work and I didn’t get back to bed at all. It would’ve been nice to have had that extra sleep time as Friday’s are our busiest nights.

I know everyone telling you to tell him to stuff it sideways means well but you may want to consider taking a slightly longer view of the way things might pan out.

I don’t know anything about your history, but reading on and between the lines of your OP it is evident that your dropping out of high school and your current contention with your dad is mainly based on your failure to keep pace with what he (and quite frankly most parents) would consider to be a normal achievement schedule for their kids. Personally, I have to admit I would be highly agitated if my daughter or son dropped out of high school and still had not fully completed their HS degree by age 20 which is when most kids in your peer group would be in their Junior year of college. Beyond that, a 20 year old now completing the final leg of her HS degree, and who to date has not evinced any great appetite for the academic grind, telling me she was going to be a “palentologist” would probably give me pause as well, as I would see them setting themselves up to fail though I might love them dearly.

Few things are more frightening or disheartening to a parent than watching a child fall behind or fail and it is evident that he considers you to be well behind the curve at this point and it’s evident that your attitude toward appropriate achievement and his are at odds. It’s not unheard of for a parent to be in a 20 year old’s business, especially if they are late to work and the parent perceives this to be the beginning of another slippery slope slide to yet another failure (in their view).

With respect to your dad giving your money you may want to cool your jets on imputing sinister “controlling bastard” motives. My parents gave me money (freely) when I was difficult spots in my post-college youth because they wanted to help and were concerned about my well being. I expect to do the same for my kids if they want or need it.

In the end your dad is who he is, and quite frankly his concern about your direction in life and your somewhat childish attitude (based on your OP details) is probably not altogether undeserved. He is unlikely to be able to “step back” unless you give him an ultimatum of some kind and you will have to craft this so he does not step entirely out of your life (unless that’s your goal) . His motives may seem sinister or controlling to you, but letting a struggling child fall (even a 20 year old) so that they can catch the wind to take flight is very difficult. You two need to have a very serious talk, but cutting him off at the knees to reach your goal of non-interference would not be the best way to proceed with respect to future relationships he and your potential grandkids might have.

Astro, I do have my diploma. I recieved it last year in fact, at 19. I decided I wanted to go back to get another few courses so I would be able to get into university/college. I’m too young to be considered a mature student in their eyes (by a year) and anything I wish to get into involves my having at least 1 or 2 sciences and social 30. I was not able to complete a second science until this past semester due to a teachers strike that took out almost 2 months of an accelerated course (Biology 20/30) which meant I missed out on the equivalent of 4 months school. So I returned this first semester to complete that course (I have yet to get the marks back, but I had 80% going into exams). Any courses I have been interested in taking do not start until September, so I decided I may as well return for this semester and do my third science (Chemistry) and just get it done and have it.

I want to be a paleontologist, but I am not applying for that. Instead I am applying for a 2 year technical course as a Medical Lab Technician/Cytotechnologist. This means I will get my school work, and I will get practical experience rather then going to university. This also means I have a pretty good chance at jobs. The school I am applying to has a high rate of students being hired straight out of school, which I know is true as I know a number of people who have attended it as well as my father.

It is not a usual thing that I am late to work. The job that I started recently is night shift, at present I am adjusting my body’s sleep schedule around working graveyards and going to morning classes. My supervisor was understanding, asking if I was handling it okay and if I needed to cut back some hours. At present I do not see a need to but if it interferes too much with school I will ask to cut off one more day a week. This will not hurt my ability to pay bills, and the supervisor says it will be alright if it is bothersome.

I am not putting ‘controlling bastard’ motives on my father. I realize that he worries about what I am doing, and how I am going about things. I am merely doing my best to live with my decisions, like any reasonable adult should. Which means I will face the real world consequences rather then my father’s wrath. I would rather not have to worry about both of these things at the same time. I wrote the rant because I was half asleep when I woke up to my roomie telling me my father was on the phone. He proceeded to tell me if I lose this job ‘don’t come crying to me for money, I won’t help you.’ After I got off the phone I was shaking so bad, I was unable to get back to sleep and had to vent.

He told me ages ago that he wouldn’t help me with a lot of things, money being the major one but others as well. My mother tried to help me deal with my problems involving their divorce, and my problems with other kids. But she had my brother to deal with who was more of a handful then I ever was. I essentially put my life on hold because my mother needed help to deal with a young boy who she could barely keep in line, while recovering herself from the results of the divorce and subsequently breaking her elbow (which still bothers her) and going through chemotherapy which caused reactions in her that had doctors scratching their heads saying ‘I’ve never seen that before’. My father’s solution? Dump all my problems in my life on my mother, and tell me to suck it up. Oh yes, and tell me every little detail about the divorce, everything that I did wrong up to that point and tell me that my little brother (who I had to sit on sometimes to keep him from running all over the neighborhood after midnight, because he was and is a strong s.o.b. and I can almost match him whereas my mother cannot come close) was a paragon of virtue and that the divorce was hard on him so be nice.

Yes, I am still a little bitter over stuff that happened. Yes, he tried to help in his own way but he was working through his own problems as well. But I don’t expect him to be the father now that I needed most a good 7 years ago. He seems to think that he can be that now. That’s why I said it’s too little too late. He expected me to be able to handle a lot more then I could then, without support and now when I wish to be independent enough to make my own mistakes and try to get on with my life he tries to be the father he was before the divorce. Making sure I get to school, and do stuff on time. It’s my problem now. Not his. If I mess it up, I have no one to blame but myself and I have never asked that he pay my bills. Which he seems to think I will do if I lose this job.

Perhaps I am a little immature yet. And perhaps I need to fall to gain that maturity. I do not plan to cut him off at the knees. I like having him in my life. I just don’t need the added stress of my messed up family relationships wrecking the precarious level I am on. That is why I moved out in the first place.

When we can meet as two adults, we have a great relationship. But when he starts to bring in the parent/child thing it stirs up a lot of resentment for what happened in the past, which I want to leave there, and anger in myself that he couldn’t have done this about 7 years ago when I quite literally drew into myself because unfortunately I had to be the pillar of strength that kept my mother and brother limping along.

Reading this over it’s probably more info than anyone needed to know, but it’s no wonder I’m ‘behind’. I’m moving at my own pace and managing decently, maybe not great, but decently. I’m not trying to whine either, but sometimes it can help just to get things out. And to be quite honest, I feel much better today. I will probably talk to Dad again in about a week (make that two, he’ll probably call and ask why I haven’t called in 2 weeks just to make sure I’m still alive) and he will act like nothing was ever said and we will just go on with our lives. That’s what usually happens.

I think your father is, too.
Shut up. You’re lucky to have him.

Jesus Christ, did you read a single other sentence in this entire thread? Shut up yourself.

Obsidian, you sound to me like someone who is doing good. Maybe some more boundaries with your dad who may well be dealing with some guilt issues of his own could be a good thing.

Pucky you’re behaving like a wanker. Piss off now would you?

Obsidian, you are a strong woman, and the difference in you in the past year and a half is astounding. You’re doing a great job managing school and work. Just remember, though, that Dad is probably trying to make up for lost time - my dad did the same thing.

Obsidian, your dad sounds a little like my mom, ie, trying to help but just being aggravating. Perhaps the next time he calls to bitch at you like that (especially when you are sleeping), you should say what I say (even if you have to speak over him): “I love you. I am not doing this right now. Talk to you later.” CLICK.

If you have the option, turn of the ringer to the phone after you hang up so that you don’t have to hear him trying to call back. Then call him at a time when it is good for you and say, “If now is good for you we can talk. But if you yell at me I will hang up again. Now, what did you want to talk to me about?”

I would make sure from now on that your roommate is told NOT to wake you up unless someone is in the hospital or dead. Your father must have known you were going to be sleeping and knew he was going to get ahold of you - the adult thing to do would have been to bring it up the next time you were out and resolve it THEN, face to face, not when you’re groggy and mumbling on the phone.

You sound like someone I would be very proud of. I’m glad that you’re paying your bills and going to school as well as working a difficult shift - which not everyone CAN do. I hope you keep it up - it seems you do have goals, and reasonable ones at that.

G’luck. Chin up, girlie :slight_smile:

Nope. I definately think she’s a snot-nose whiner.