advice sought. Suspect Brother-in-Law a child molester/ into child porn

The BBQ Pit
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The difference is that Frank commented on what you posted. You commented on Frank. He made an argument (a pretty compelling one IMO) that you have shown a tendency to leap to conclusions based on minimal evidence. That is a valid point of discussion.

You attacked the poster, not the post. Separate the two, deal with ideas, not people, and you’ll be fine.

As to the family situation, my neices sit on my BILs lap all the time, and they’re 12 and 14. I would never consider that a problem, at any age, in my family. It’s certainly an odd family, but as far as I can tell, that’s all you can conclude at this point. Make yourself available to talk to the children if they want. Until something else comes along, this is too damaging an accusation to throw out without something more concrete, IMO.

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[QUOTE=cazzle]
I believe Frank is justified in linking the two threads. In one, you observe that you don’t resemble your father as strongly as your brothers, that your mentally-ill mother was distant to you and that no one in your family speaks to you now and conclude that your mother had an affair, possibly with one of her patients at the mental health facility she worked for, and you are a product of that affair.

In the other, you observe that your brother-in-law is a private and secretive man who favors his eldest daughter and is affectionate towards her, and conclude that he is a child molestor and/or kiddie porn consumer/manufacturer.

These are very big conclusions to reach based only on gut feelings, flimsy evidence and speculation. It doesn’t mean you are automatically wrong, but it does show that you sometimes connect the dots differently to other people. When the other posters on this board read both threads, it might give more insight into your character and help them weigh the facts you present accordingly. The same story presented by two different people can produce wildly different conclusions from the same audience just by the manner in which it is told.

[QUOTE]

Frank didn’t need to link the threads. But if it says “kurahee’s crazy”, well, perhaps. This is a message board, not a community meeting place. We can’t see each other. We can’t determine “tone”.

The conclusions reached by my wife and I about my BIL are speculation only. We both know that. But my wife is concerned about her niece. She doesn’t post here. I do.

As far as the issue with **MY ** parents, well I can’t help but wonder. I can’t help that I’m here, but I’d like to know more history about myself. In reading the responses to that particular thread, I’ve decided not to pursue the paternity issue. It doesn’t really matter at this point (other than the issues I brought up with health history for my kids and me, if dad isn’t dad). And quite frankly, it will be more trouble than it’s worth. I have had suspicions for a long time, based on physical features and family gossip. I grew up with that. So I’ve always wondered. But at this point in my life, it really wouldn’t accomplish much except for me. But when you have blue eyes and both of your parents don’t, you have to wonder. When your family photo looks like one child is adopted, you have to wonder. People have.

Since I posted that thread, I have re-established contact with two of my brothers. That’s good enough for me.
For this thread, I’ll agree that the leap to kiddie porn is a stretch. But no one knows what’s going on in that room, and you’ve never *seen * my BIL with his oldest. And when a 12 year old girl grabs your package, come talk to me about what races through *your * head.

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I sat on my father’s knee at that age-one instance I can remember is when I was thirteen and we had Christmas at our house. Our house is pretty small and with all the relatives crammed into the living room, I just perched on the edge of his knee, because there was no where else to sit. And my father has NEVER touched me inappropriately.

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Careful, kurahee. You don’t want to piss off the mods.
The moderators always use stern language when warning someone, to make sure they get your attention. Ranting & raving, though, will only result in getting THEIR attention. And that’s unwise.

Now…

No offense, but that’s exactly what you did. From your OP [emphasis mine]:

I underlined the first part because it struck me that you’re actually accusing him of producing child porn. That’s just…out there. Did you see any cameras, any light stands? (Although I suppose, all you’d need these days is a webcam.) Wouldn’t it make more sense, if he were really a pedophile into kiddy porn, that he would be spending more money, instead of earning it? Pr0n of any kind can be an expensive habit, trust me on this. :smiley:

I will concede, his actions (regarding the room) are suspicious. But whatever’s on his computer, isn’t necessarily illegal. Could be something embarassing (gay porn, perhaps?) – but my point is, you jumped to a conclusion, and brought up as “evidence” his closeness with his oldest daughter and distance from his wife. Neither of which mean anything, as others pointed out. And then…

Ok, here’s where you brought up the crotch-grabbing incident. Again, you’re seeking evidence for a crime you’ve already made up in your head. And later…

Again, you’re focusing on the daughter, how she gets special treatment. This happens all the time in families; it’s not something I’d call appropriate, but it’s not necessarily abusive, either.

BTW, I noticed you said his father was a P.I. Perhaps his job is something along those lines? Maybe he works for the government? He does seem secretive & maybe a little paranoid. Who knows? There are many, many different scenarios that you just haven’t looked at.

To your credit, you’ve been open to debate, and willing to accept that some of your examples aren’t warning signs at all. Indeed, I’m rather upset that some of my fellow Dopers have been feeding your illogical conclusion, instead of helping to explain it away. (But that happens a lot around here!!!)

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Sorry, cazzle. I didn’t address this part. You ask some good questions. Well, as far as my BIL not liking me, I guess that’s a possibility. Although to be honest, I’m not sure why. We really haven’t interacted. The only thing he said to me when my wife and I were engaged was “We couldn’t be happier!” And it was the only positive exchange I’ve ever had with him. I don’t have an axe to grind with him. Truth is, I hardly know him.

According to my wife, no one knows him. That’s the way he’s always been. I’m not the only one he gets up and walks away from. He does it to my father-in-law. He does it to my wife. He’s done it to her other sister. I don’t take it personally. I find it odd.

If he indeed is doing what you are saying (concealing his dislike for someone he has to try to get along with), he’s been doing this long before I was around. This is, of course, according to my wife. But I’ve seen him leave a conversation with my FIL and just disappear. He’ll go down to the basement, or out to the “room”. The only person I’ve never seen him have this reaction to is his father.

If he’s jealous of me, I can’t for the life of me figure out why. The only thing I have that he doesn’t is my wife. Now, given his marital situation, perhaps that’s enough. But I’ve never thought about it until now. Good question.

My wife and my SIL’s relationship did not change when we got together. In fact, it got better for a time (again, based on my wife’s comments). But it really changed the day we got spotted in his “room”. Perhaps he felt it was a tremedous invasion of privacy, but we didn’t see anything, and never asked him any questions about it. He told me it was sound proof before I actually saw it. He told me about building the room. So, I didn’t think it odd that my wife wanted to show it to me or that I would be able to see it. Until we got the “stare.”

One thing I will say. His kids seemed to like me right away. I played games with them, and paid attention to them. They enjoyed my company. Maybe that irked him. I don’t know. But a game of wiffle ball or kick ball shouldn’t set anyone on edge.

Perhaps he doesn’t like me. But I’ve never said anything bad about him except for what my wife and I have discussed. And of course in this thread. So unless he’s reading about himself in here and recognizes me, that’s it.

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Actually, Frank specifically addressed the OP’s thought process, implying that there was a problem in his thinking which led to these conclusions. While that’s a few steps from saying he’s crazy, it’s not a lot of them. He really skirted quite close to making a personal attack; the basis for his comparison to the other thread was only that it proved, in Frank’s eyes, that the OP had a habit of making “wild ass guesses”. I think it’s a stretch to claim that that’s only an assertion about what the OP said. Further, Frank was inappropriate in threatening with banning - particularly since a moderator doesn’t have the power to do that on their own, unless things have radically changed without an alert to the users.

That said, I’m guessing it’s a matter of time till this thread gets closed, since kurahee persists in arguing over a moderation here rather than taking it to the pit.

I’d just like to reiterate my opinion that the situation kurahee describes gets my hackles up - controlling father, touch that’s at least unusual, semi-sexual behavior in the children that’s at least unusual, all the weird issues with crazy mom. It’s nothing that justifies locking Dad up, but collectively these things arouse my suspcions. Any of those things could be innocent (except for Dad’s weird behavior with money and the children not having shoes that fit - there’s no way to rationalize that stuff away into normal behavior) but collectively, I agree that they seem, well, a bit troublesome. It’s worth looking at the pattern here and not just the individual pieces.

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One cannot help but wonder if your Spouse has repeated those conversations to other relatives.

I have long been eagerly awaiting A to discuss B in derisive terms only to discover that B is a frequent poster on the board…perhaps a mod. :slight_smile:

I have been warned once; for calling a je…someone… a jerk in a heated discussion outside the pit. I have often wondered what would have happened if I’d been really ugly and called him or her a dukey butt.

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Got it. 'nuff said.

No offense taken. I appreciate the candor. I wasn’t accusing him of producing child porn, but rather perhaps trading/collecting/selling it. I don’t know. All I do know is that he has a digital camera and a digital camcorder that he uses. Now, that doesn’t make him a kiddie porn producer. I know that. And it may be a stretch from what has happened with his daughter and me, and our observations with him and her. So it’s a major wag. I agree. And I wouldn’t call CPS on a wag like that.

yes, I agree. I’m not pulling “evidence” out of my butt. I’m just relating the situaltion as I have seen/experienced it. Nothing I’ve seen would land him in court. I just wondered what would cause a 12 year old girl and a 7 year old son to grab a grown man’s genitalia. That is something I am not accustomed to. It does NOT mean, however, that she is being abused in any way. I know this.

If this man works for the government, it would explain ALOT. :smiley:

However, I know what company he works for. At least as far as anyone knows. I did a google search on him and it appears to be so. But like I said, when I asked him for a business card, he walked away from me.

Absolutely I’m open to debate. This is a big deal. I wouldn’t want to ruin his life. Suggesting something like this could do just that. I would also fear that anyone could judge me because I take my garbage out in the morning in my robe and find it offensive. So, if he’s just introverted, weird, and has decided to favor one child over the rest, that’s bad parenting, but it’s not criminal.

It’s also a big deal because of the implications of what if we are right? Child molesting is the lowest thing a parent can do to a child. And if this is going on in the house, it’s wrong. I just don’t know how to prove it. And with what we have, I’m not comfortable calling in the authorities.

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I may, as you should know, ban guest socks, trolls, and spammers without input from other mods/admins.

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Well, you and “people” need to learn more about basic genetics, then. It’s entirely possible for two brown-eyed people to have a blue-eyed child, so long as both parents carry the blue-eyed allele on one of the chromosomes that determine eye color, which they very well could, even if they have brown eyes. Do a little research on the subject before you jump to erroneous conclusions.

My first cousin is adopted. She’s got dark blonde hair. Her husband has very dark brown hair. Their daughter is a true redhead and looks nothing like either one of her parents. More than likely she looks like someone on my cousin’s side of the genetics tree, but we don’t have any family photos to compare against, seeing as how she was adopted. You can’t determine paternity with the naked eye, and your use of those criteria to harbor worry and fret over for years seems a bit absurd.

Congratulations – that’s a very good thing, indeed.

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So have I. Seriously. :smiley:

Ah, same warning; you might as well have blown your wad.

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He doesn’t appear to be any of these.

And per the ultra secure secret room, is it possible this BIL is Batman, or one of a multitude of Batmen?

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Just to clarify. I’m not trying to **prove ** it, as much as I’m trying to understand the pieces of the picture that I have, and asking for advice/insight from those of you that have any.

I’m sorry if anyone is doubting my concern or sincerity. Accusing someone of something like this doesn’t wash off easily, and I’m not interested in ruining someone’s name and reputation without cause or traumatizing the kids for no good reason. I wouldn’t want that.

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:rolleyes: (Since you said it’s allowed.)

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I know it’s possible. I’m not a complete moron (we can debate that later :smiley: ). It’s not just the eye color. It’s just one of many things that don’t fit. But, as I mentioned, I’m not going to pursue it so it will never fit. I grew up hearing some interesting conversations between my parents, relatives, etc. that added to my suspicion. Her behavior toward me could have been irrelavant and disconnected. Maybe she was just tired of having kids.

Yes, it is. Thanks!

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I’ve asked her. She said no. That’s all I have to go on.

But it’s possible. And that would certainly change the equation.
Again, we are back at divorce as the possible solution to this problem. At least for me.

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I felt that Frank questioned my veracity, thinking process, and sanity. He came out and said I was not a trustworthy source. If that’s not insulting directly, it certainly is implied. He’s calling me a liar, or at the very least an embellisher of events.

But you are right. I commented on Frank. Perhaps I should have questioned his character or motives behind his statement. I didn’t want to derail the thread. I also didn’t want to start a Pit thread about Frank. He’s entitled to his opinion like anyone else.

He also stated that he has the right to ban “guest socks, trolls, and spammers without input from other mods/admins”. I’ve seen many arguments about throwing these words around at people. Now, he never said I was any of those things directly, but considering he said I was lucky he didn’t ban me, he’s implying strongly that he feels I am either a guest sock, troll or spammer.

That’s a pretty fine line. (or is that another leap of mine?)

But I’m pretty sure a flame war in the Pit would accomplish little. I’m not interested in debating Frank. I’m sure he knows what I think of him. A back and forth in the pit is a waste of everyone’s time. Mods don’t “lose” and members don’t “win”. I’ve read enough pit threads against mods to know the general path. Unless I could get Frank’s moderator rights revoked, it’s pointless.

Therefore, it’s pointless.

End of discussion on Frank. Please, let’s move back to topic.

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If so, the trick is to catch him unprepared. Trust me on this.

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My mother in law married a guy that gives me the heeby jeebies. When you are standing there talking to him, he is nice, articulate, interesting and yet, when you walk away, you want to take a hot, hot shower.

His very endowed daughter sat on his lap all the time. Not just perched on the knees, but sprawling on Daddy. She was in her late teens. I would think she still does it.

He left his last wife after undergoing fertility treatments to have a child. The child was still a baby when he left the mother. He left her for a younger, blonder student.

After MIL and CD (creepy dude) got married, she got a boob job. A big one. She had been married to a doctor for 23 years, had a ton of money, divorced and broke, she buys the bazongas.

MIL says the reason he left his wife was because “she wasn’t taking care of things at home.” She asks for gift certificates to the local porn palaces for holidays.

MIL doesn’t let CD out of her sight.

What does this add up to? I dunno. I was sexually abused. NFW would I have felt comfortable with that kind of attention, I did everything I could to avoid it (from adult men). It creeps us all out to see a daughter who is built like a brick shit house loll around on daddy’s lap. Seriously creeps us out. I think mostly he is a garden variety creep. I think he is an insecure guy who is dumb enough to think younger, blonder, bustier=better. I think he’s opportunistic. I think his wife had better keep her eagle eyes on him because I absolutely think the next wife is just around the bend.

As for Kurahee’s situation. Hmm. Well, weirdos are everywhere. He may be a garden variety creep. I know how it is when everything adds up to something bad, but turns out to not be bad at all. He may just be looking at porn and wants to keep it from his wife/kids. Are there other computers in the house? Before the room was built, where did he use the computer?

All the freaks in the world have to be related to someone. They have to live next door to someone. They have to work with someone. Maybe there is just one really prolific freak. Could there really be that many weirdos out there?

FWIW, that Fortress sounds like something my husband would love to have, but instead, he has turned out house into one. He loves all sorts of gadgets.

You know the name of the company he works for. Does it strike you as an especially private industry? I had a dear friend in college. I knew who he worked for, I knew what his degree was in, and no freakin’ way did I, or was I allowed to have a clue what he did all day.

IMHO, he’s a garden variety perv who wanted a webcam and a private place to send out to the ether pictures of his penis. Keep watching Dateline. :slight_smile:

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How about inviting the niece over while Something About Amelia is on the TV? Maybe it’ll start a conversation.