Uh, I guess nothing if you see us as living in a respectful world. I see the world differently than you do I guess. Children and people in general are more disrespectful now than they were 20 years and further ago.
I won’t go into why I think that but it might be worth opening another thread to talk about.
See ^^^
Consequences don’t always involve a belt or any negative connotation to the word “consequence” but jump right on it!
OK, now our level of disagreement is down to basically IMHO.
You seem to see her as having been seduced into a job she hated but couldn’t get away from while I see her as jumping feet first into a job she loved, even though it meant carrying the water for someone she knew was incompetent.
However we both agree that her dropping it to deal with the implosion of her family life reflects well on her.
The only punishment she’s likely to receive is being grounded by her parents.
I’m not too concerned with “disrespectful” kids. It has always been this way, and society has muddled through.
My father (a pediatrician and expert on adolescent behavior) told me “the last thing you want is a well behaved kid.” Independent and strong-willed and more positive traits. I have no concerns about this young woman’s future, and no criticisms of her recent behavior.
What actions? Tweeting about her dysfunctional family life?
Note I’m not accusing you or doing this or the Conway’s of situation of being equivalent, but your attitude seems reminiscent of those who dismiss a child’s claims of abuse as “just acting out” because “as pillars of the community their parents would never do anything like that…”
Nothing she has tweeted seems beyond the range of plausibility, why not take her words at face value?
I made no judgement in either direction of the young lady in question. You father sounds like quite a scholar, psycho/socio AND a pediatrician!
I only have my anecdotal evidence of having lived through a few (5) decades and having 5 kids myself .
I can’t speak for anyone else, but I really, really object to the use of “attention-seeking” as a way to dismiss the actions of anyone, especially girls and women, especially teen girls. To me, it seems rooted in the idea that it’s inappropriate for a person, by virtue of their status, to draw attention to themselves, to speak out, to assert agency. It’s a double whammy of an ad hominim, because it suggests that it doesn’t matter what someone said, because their only motive was to “get attention”: this apparently makes their argument irrelevant while at the same time suggesting that their character is poor—that there is something wrong with them, that they would “seek attention”.
Even when applied to little kids, it bothers me. What’s wrong with a little kid wanting attention? There are good and bad ways to go about requesting it, of course, but the motive isn’t bad. But when that same term that’s used to dismiss a tween wearing dumb clothes is used to dismiss a girl trying to exert some control over a really fucked up life, I get defensive on her behalf.
This same charge is used against protesters everywhere: the core of the whole “outside agitator” thing is that the people protesting don’t actually care about the cause, they just want to be on the news. It’s a surprisingly effective way to discourage people from taking a stand for things they believe in, because it assigns the worst possible motive: protesters, people who try to change things, people who stand up are not just inauthentic, but selfish, and the worst sort of egocentric, petty selfishness.
I mean, if someone wants to say 'I don’t like Conway, but unless she beats her kids, they owe it to her as their mom to never to anything to publicly undermine her career", well, I disagree, but at least that’s an argument. “Pffff. Attention-seeking brat should shut the hell up,” is not.
I don’t have any more information than what’s been shared in this thread. All I’m operating under is a hunch, or gut feel. She has tweeted with impunity and without any restrictions to date. The video I saw of her and her mom does not lead me to think that she has any fear whatsoever of her mother or whatever potential discipline her parents might exercise over her. The fact that she continued to tweet, ‘Look what I did!’, after both parents have publicly announced that they were stepping down from their jobs tells me she does not appreciate or care about the impact she may have had in their decision. If their decision was made regardless of her rebellious tweeting, then she did not seem to care or be aware enough of the kind of important decision they both made, nor show any deference or respect of the gravity of the situation.
My agreement with her politics and my moral objection to her mother’s political career of the past four years does not blind me to the fact that this kid is acting spoiled, privileged and quite possibly lying about the abuse she alleged.
It’s possible I’m wrong. It’s possible she has suffered abuse. I’m prepare to post a full retraction if such information come to light. Until then, we’re all just speculating because we have the time and luxury to do so. I just happen to be more skeptical than most who have done so in this OP.
I had heard that she was publicly critical of her mother’s politics. I didn’t care or say anything about it.
She’s not a little kid. 15 year olds have different behavior standards than 5 year olds. How is her life fucked up? Because her mom is not well liked by half the country and her (Claudia’s) nearly 500K social media followers? Perhaps the remedy for that is to draw less attention to yourself, not exploit the attention at the expense of the people who put a roof over your head and food in your mouth and clothes on your back, etc.
Now that you mention it, it would be interesting to know if living in the DC area, she went to any protests.
I guess I’m old school. While my every comfort and privilege is afforded to me by what my parents provide for me, I am inclined to not publicly embarrass and insult my parents. At least until I can provide for myself. And I am very skeptical about any abuse taking place for reasons I’ve already mentioned.
I just spent a few minutes looking at her twitter feed. It’s full of politics, which doesn’t surprise me given what her parents do. I bet that entire household is pretty toxic with political talk.
She pretty obviously hates Trump. She expresses absolute mortification at the news headlines about her mom meeting with Trump who she calls racist and homophobic.
She did tweet that she was going to set up her moms ring tone for herself to be wap.
That made me laugh.
I think she is emotionally neglected.
Okay. That’s an argument, and it’s fine. Do you see the different between that and calling her an “attention-seeking spoiled brat”? The latter implies a particularly petty motive and character flaw that the argument does not.
…wap?
Consistent with the rest of her generation? Surely she interacts with some of those millions of other kids her age through the internet, even if she is home-schooled.
I mean, progressive politics is everywhere if you are young. It’s on your feed, it’s in your news, it’s the politics of your role models, it’s even on or between your cartoon shows. Nickelodeon, for example, regularly broadcasts supportive and forward-thinking - but to our great discredit as a society, political - messages during the commercial break.
~Max
Respectful musical taste for sure…
Not only progressive politics. My kids went to high school with kids of some fairly prominent conservatives in the DC Metro area. My daughter’s classmate was Scalia’s grandson. My son’s classmate was Sebastian Gorka’s son. Both were a-holes, I’m told, but not peerless. Each had a large group of conservative minded friends and their GOP activist parents.
You have a point, but not a direct counter. I am still confident in my conclusion that progressive politics are more pervasive among the kids.
~Max
Well, of course. In kindergarten, we are taught to share.
It’s not until we become adults that we are taught that selfishness is a virtue.
Actually, I am not sure you are not completely correct. Maybe she did jump in with unabashed enthusiasm.
I am just saying that before I condemn a total stranger I will try consider other options. I was raised … I had some possible role models who were narrow-minded, judgmental, unenlightened (racist, misogynistic, homophobic, etc.) and I try to not duplicate their mistakes. If I had the opportunity to be around the family in the leading up to this – I might have a different view. But having falsely accused others before, I try to reserve judgment when I lack information about the subject.
I completely understand your view and think it may well be true, but I understand the view I laid out and know it may also be true. To be honest, it might just boil down to judging myself as fair minded as much as having a strong view of any of the Conway’s. (You know, except that George has been doing good in America, and Kellyanne – perhaps not. Okay, surely not, but perhaps for a defensible reason.)