This is exactly how I explain my deconversion to those who ask. It’s also how I explain my total atheist materialism in discussions of ghosts, aliens, and the Loch Ness Monster. The precise phrase I use is “I apply a consistent standard of evidence.”
As someone who was also highly respected in her (at the time, his) church, taught Sunday School, and was widely expected to become a pastor or deacon, I have a great deal of empathy for the challenge of withdrawing - in my case, I had the additional factor of a realization that my Southern Baptist church was an active force for evil that was actively harming people, such that my withdrawal was a moral imperative. Whether or not that applies to you/your church is of course for you to decide.
I very sincerely hope that this proves to be a good thing for you, and I hope your disentanglement is as smooth and painless as can be.
She’s very devoted to Bible-reading, church-attendance, arguing apologetics on behalf of God. She knows that I’ve been deconstructing, but she thinks it’s just a phase and that I’ll come back after a while.
Ironically, she’s a new convert; having become a Christian only 1.5 years ago. Meanwhile I’ve spent my whole life in the church. Everyone at my church expected me to be some role model leader for this woman, shepherding her in her new faith, so to speak (that’s what the elders exhorted me to do - so far, barely anyone at my church knows I’ve deconstructed.) It’s kind of embarrassing that the roles are somewhat reversed in reality.
It’s not just direct proselytizing. Many have been taught that forcing a gay teen to become straight, or stopping an abortion, are ways of saving souls. I’m not sure I want them to be more consistent if it means they’ll spend more time doing these things.
I must admit I have no idea what that means. I guess I am not the right interlocutor for your questions. Would asking how often someone can read the bible be considered inappropiate? It is a long book, but sooner or later you would know it by heart, would you not? There are other books, also religious.
Sorry, my bad. What I mean is that she’s constantly pointing to evidence for God and God’s goodness, pushing me to accompany her to a creationism science museum, talking about how events in her life point to the guidance of God, etc.
The funny thing is, by their perverse logic, stopping an abortion should be more a way of losing souls than saving them.
Most evangelicals believe most people are going to hell. (Again, what sort of god would run a world like that? But I digress.)
Most evangelicals also believe that there’s an ‘age of accountability’ or some such - that is, if a child dies before reaching that age, the child is going to heaven because God’s not going to hold a child that young responsible for having not yet made a commitment to Christ.
And it goes without saying that in their world view, the sluts who have abortions would be unlikely to raise their child in a Christian manner if they went through with the pregnancy.
So if the woman has an abortion, that ‘unborn baby’ is going straight to heaven. But if it’s born, it’s most likely going to ultimately wind up in hell.
So giving these unborn babies the gift of life means that instead of all of them going to heaven, some of them will ultimately go to heaven but most of them won’t.
On the other hand, if Christians really, truly believed in paradise/heaven they would be living their lives extremely differently. If it well a well known fact that, if you follow the teachings of Jesus, obey the 10 commandments, love your neighbour etc etc, “you shall not perish but have everlasting life”. Holy shit, man, can you imagine what a lovely world it would be? But no, most Christians I know are the least Christ-like.
I was raised a young earth, fundamentalist penticostal. I deconstructed about 10/15 years ago.
One issue with being raised Christian is that there’s a danger that you come to equate all the beliefs and practices and “endless silly trappings” of the particular church or denomination or subculture you grew up in with Christianity itself. Then if they find they can’t accept those things, they think they must reject Christianity.
I’m not saying that’s the case with Velocity. But I do know of Christians who have had similar “revelations” to those described in the OP of this thread, who remained Christians, though maybe not the same kind of Christians.
You might consider the Unitarian Universalists. We’re mostly a bunch of like-minded, social justice oriented folks who like to get together to pay attention to things of worth like voting rights, homeless shelters, food banks and a lot more. We’re non-credo, and probably half our typical congregation is agnostic/atheist while the rest tend towards fuzzy deist/other (including some non-trinitiarian christians). Most of us tend to agree with the 7 UU principles which emphasize the acceptance of others, world community, peace, a personal search for meaning, et. al.
Don’t forget the pro-life bunch are actually pro-birth. They don’t give a flying rat’s ass what happens after. As evidenced by their opposition to welfare, SNAP, WIC, etc.
Also, let’s face it, evangelicals and their allies in other church structures have pretty much won the battle to define Christianity in the minds of most Americans. And however they may be individually, collectively they’re a bunch of assholes. So whether one has been raised Christian or not, that’s what most people in this country associate with Christianity these days.
I am not hostile to Christianity - far from it; I’m a born-again Christian, have known the Lord for 52 years and counting, and if anything my spiritual life is the most deep and powerful it’s ever been. But I deeply resent what these people have done to the public image of Christianity. ‘Evangelism’ really needs an antonym to describe what they do.
And if it wasn’t clear before, their opposition and resistance to any and all public measures to protect Americans in the face of the recent pandemic was the slam-dunk there. A million Americans died due to Covid, and many more millions around the world, and they didn’t give a damn.
but don’t be embarrassed. Many, many people never see those things right in front of their eyes. You have. Someone in the thread may have put it this way (I read the OP and skimmed the rest), but what you’ve done is similar to kicking alcohol or drugs. I drank for 22 years, and when I got sober, I was akin to embarrassed at how much I’d missed. But in the years since, I’ve become proud of kicking the habit. You should be too.
It takes a lot of character to change your way of thinking so radically, whether it’s religion, or alcohol, or drugs. You have every right to be proud of yourself. There’s a world worth exploring you might not have known existed.
I grew up Lutheran but my mom grew up Catholic (she had a spat with the Catholic church around when me and my brother were born so she decided to raise us Lutheran) and is now back to the Catholic church. My brother became Catholic because his wife and kids are, and he’s like “whatever.”
My mom is desperately trying to get me to become Catholic and unfortunately the more I learn about Catholicism the worse/sillier ALL religion becomes to me. I spent 2 months living with mom this year, and watched some of her Catholic media over her shoulder and yikes. Just yikes. I’m not talking fire-and-brimstone shit or even anti-whatever rhetoric. Just basic explanations of the stuff that Jesus is supposed to have done, and what God has done for people. To me it sounds pretty much the same as the non-religious “woo” Akaj’s wife is subscribing to in this thread.
I am totally down with all of the being nice and helping people and getting strength from an unknown force part of religion. But as we all know, that can all be come by without religion. All this extra stuff, the rules and the judging and the fear…that all comes from men’s interpretation of books written by men interpreting things men said. And by men I actually mean humans but also…men.
I still support my mom’s path because she truly gets something out of her religion but yeah, her forcing me to think about it has not really gone the way she has planned. The more I think about it, the further away I get from it.
With Catholicism in particular (and no Christian sect or any other religion gets a pass as far as I’m concerned), the Eucharist is especially weird and disgusting. Even if it’s symbolic, transubstantiation is bizarre, but make it literally the blood and body of Christ, and it’s downright cannibalistic. But no one bats an eye about it.
I realize that – it’s literal. What I meant was that if you take it symbolically, it’s bizarre. Taken literally, as the Church does, it’s beyond reality (which is essentially the definition of religion).