Agreed, it’s not bad at all despite being proven less than reliable. And I definitely did not see that angle until Oy stated it.
No, it doesn’t boil down to that at all. I have no idea how you came to that conclusion from what I have posted. Can you please elaborate?
Oy! is not confirmed. Oy’s ability to produce sound reasoning would not confirm Oy, nor would it confirm anyone else. Yet you appear willing to take reasoning from an unconfirmed person and use it as evidence that another player is confirmed.
[OOG]
Off topic, I have a comment and a question.
First, I really, really hate that they took nested quotes away from us. They may be a pain in the ass for the rest of this Board, but in Mafia they are incredibly useful, and since we’ve all gotten used to them, their absence is causing all sorts of headaches. I am not a happy camper, and I think I’m going to lodge a formal protest with the Commissioner.
Second, I have a question for Drain Bead. How should the word “Bead” in your user name be pronounced? Is it pronounced like “bed”, so that “Drain Bead” rhymes with “Brain Dead”? Or is it pronounced like “bead”, just as it is spelled? I need to know, so that every time I am typing your name in a post, I can say it correctly in my head.
[/OOG]
You’ll like me more later, I promise. 
I’m totally with you on the nested quotes thing. Maybe a Game Forum exception?
NETA: Pronounced like it’s spelled. It’s an old inside joke between me and some friends in high school that has long since lost all meaning.
Are you sure you don’t want to change your answer? 'Cause I’ve been pronouncing it the other way all along, and it’s gonna be really difficult for me to change now…
She’s eternally Drain Bead (pronounced like Bed) to me. If she doesn’t like it, she can just Night Kill me. 
OK, is there a reason why we told the Scum who had the flower?
In Super Smash Brothers, the original, a Scum inventor type protected Town power roles specifically for Townie Cred.
It worked wonderfully and ended up with that player being treated as confirmed Town.
Then bring out your investigators. I’m true blue and will never stain. I am an idealist at heart, and I firmly believe that the power of love, nature, and fluffy puppies can overcome even the darkest of evil magic. I know because storyteller0910 told me so.
Oy’s alignment never entered the picture. I was asking if there was evidence to support the claim “Drain Bead is Town”. That evidence, if it existed, could have come from townie Oy, or Scum Oy, or Third Party Cookies, or anyone else. ** If** the evidence existed, and **if **it was sound evidence, **then **it would support the conclusion that “Drain Bead is Town” and move her into the ‘Confirmed Pool’ (bearing in mind that nobody *really *gets confirmed until they turn up dead).
And bear in mind that I was pretty certain that no such evidence was forthcoming when I asked the question. I think I made my position on the subject pretty clear. If someone had provided the evidence I was asking about, I would have been very surprised.
And before anyone goes down that road, I’m not suggesting that Cookies is actually a Third Party player. It was an example to make a point. I really, really hope it wasn’t necessary for me to make this disclaimer.
Ooh, sounds kinky.
I will post a nicely formatted condemnation of Suburban Plankton in the morning, I promise (I finally got through everything, but it’s a mess and I’m almost out of concentration time), but for now please just enjoy the highlight. I always like reading the last page of the book first, I’m afraid.
This is from Suburban, midway through the peeker bandwagon. Diver’s case has attracted a bunch of votes, but as of yet peeker has not refused to post his PM (which is what really sealed it for him).
Please note what Suburban does here. He links peeker’s towniness implicitly to NAF’s own and states now that he’s leaning to believing NAF. To begin with, this is quite a change from his last post on the topic of NAF’s truthfulness and towniness, in which he had such a serious problem with NAF’s request to be vigged that he spent about three paragraphs on it.
But going along with that and more critically – Note that this is virtually the opposite of the logic that many others were following, which was that if NAF was scum, so must peeker be (and peeker might be anyway, independent of NAF). Suburban is saying that if NAF is town, so probably is peeker – and NAF is probably town. VERY, VERY different in meaning and implications, especially once you consider that NAF most likely is town. And peeker was scum.
There are plenty more indications throughout the Day of Suburban’s disingenuousness in his arguments, mostly surrounding his approach to NAF. But this one’s the pinnacle. Or maybe I’ll add just add [one more.](1521: http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=13024706&postcount=1521)
In this one he sums up his late-Day “pings” (not scare quotes, his actual wording) as peeker, idle and naf. He never believed the arguments against peeker held any weight, but his subsequent behavior is suspicious. (He votes peeker at the end of the post.) He was suspicious of Idle’s flip-flop “from the get-go” (though he never brought it up until halfway through the Day when several others were already on the case). Finally, Idle’s claim supports his own feelings about NAF. He could never find a good scum motivation for NAF’s behavior.
This last bit is frankly unbelievable. Suburban spent literally the first half of the Day promoting the case against NAF left right and center (but never voting for him), saying things like “it’s more plausible that NAF is lying than not”. Around about the middle of the Day, when the bandwagon against NAF resolutely refused to pick up steam, he started walking it back a bit, saying he could see no good scum motivation (but never really acknowledging how he could have moved from “he must be lying” to there) but still pushing NAF on the vig request. Finally, Idle’s claim supports where he’s been at with NAF all along.
I don’t believe it, not even slightly. I think Suburban shifted both his suspicion of NAF and his claims about his suspicion of NAF to suit the current situation, no more.
There’s more, including a really remarkable level of curiosity* about the night’s events including the potential of watchers at both Chipacabra and NAF’s places; and his ignoring of two votes placed against him; but what I’ve linked is the crux of it all.
*not quite the right word, but I can’t think of a better right now
No smudge perceived. And I suppose this sort of interpretive dance that we’re all in about Oy’s choices are just what we’re stuck with doing all of this item juggling in public.
Just doing my part to WIFOM the Scum. My guess is that they’re thinking I’m a Town power role, just like NAF did. Maybe I am, and maybe I’m not, but if the Scum are thinking like NAF, my time here is limited. Maybe I’ve already used the flower, and maybe I haven’t. Heck, maybe I can self-protect and don’t need to use it. Then again, maybe I can’t.
I just figured releasing that little bit of info might help Oy! and screw with the Scum’s heads, and therefore would be a net positive for Town.
Why? Same deal as with your double investigation of NAF it limits the information spread.
If fact with two soon very likely three scum dead the PFK-ers might become more of a problem and those are much harder to catch with vote records, etc.
You could be PFK as well but unlikely of the killing type with the flower on Night one.
Fortunatly, scum have more incentive to find PFK than we do right now. They just lost three of their members, meaning that they are down to either 2 or three players left of their team…heck it’s possible that there is only one remaining scum though I consider that to be unlikely.
Normally the best scum strategy would be to try to take out confirmed townies, but with their numbers down so low so early the best strategy is really to keep their heads down, try not to get lynched, and shoot into the unknown pool to try to nail another killing roll or two so as not to lose any more members.
This is good for town really no matter how you slice it. Either scum does our job for us, or they don’t and risk losing the game to the PFKs. We have a Day or two left yet before we have to worry about them.
On to a new topic:
Anyone know why story is ignoring the question about the player list? I figure someone probably has some in game knowledge about that.
Normal,
I only have time to respond to half of your post right at the moment…so I’ll take it bit by bit.
“He links peeker’s towniness implicitly to NAF’s own and states now that he’s leaning to believing NAF.” - Yes, that was the opinion I had at the time.
“this is quite a change from his last post on the topic of NAF’s truthfulness and towniness” - I assume you are talking about Post 1325, in which I do go on for about 3 paragraphs about how NAF should not be Vigged if he is town. The same post that begins by me saying that “I don’t want to believe NAF”, but “I can’t find a good Scum motivation for his play.” The one where I draw the conclusion that although I didn’t like his play in the first place, and it ‘felt scummy’ to me, his actions didn’t make any sense if he were Scum. The one where I come to the conclusion (though I don’t state it explicitly) that NAF is probably Town, because his actions don’t make any sense at all otherwise. So it’s not so much of a change after all, is it?
So now disagreeing with other people is now a Scum tell? As you pointed out, my position at the time was different than others’. But I did not say that “if NAF is town, so probably is peeker”. What I said was “If he’s [NAF] telling the truth, then he still had the Book, and it looks like peeker is legitimately confused.” There is a difference. Yes, at the time I still thought there was a good chance peeker was Town. I was never convinced that his slip was anything more than a slip. That was the possibility I was pointing out in that post.
I believe my statement is an accurate representation of what happened. peeker wasn’t paying attention, and made a mistake. He was ‘legitimately confused’. The fact that he happened to be Scum is in no way related to his slip; it was a ‘lucky break’ for the Town that it led us to suspect him, and ultimately to lynch him (for me, based on his reaction to the votes against him, not for his slip).
I’ll address the rest of your comments a bit later. I have to actually do some work right now.
If not a player list, can we get a vote count? One that shows us where we are on the final vote scale?