I don’t know. A guy friend told me I am voluptuous, and I liked it. We’ve known each other for 20 years and I hadn’t seen him for probably five years, or 20 pounds ago. He is still madly attracted to me. I felt sexy as hell when he said that.
Oh, and I have CLEAVAGE.
Here’s the thing- different people have different definitions of the word “Fat”. I know for a fact, my husband has a seriously different assessment of “Fat”. Having this conversation, just now in our kitchen, he said to me that “Fat” means you have no waist definition. Soooo, by his standard, as long as my waist is smaller than my hips and bust, I’m not fat. I may be overweight, but not “Fat” in his book.
My definition of “Fat” is radically different, and I think I am “Fat”*. I’m working on it, though (almost 20 lbs gone since May…and the size 12 jeans are getting a bit loose in the waist and hip! WooT!) The BMI is still not in the “healthy” range, though. My stupid boobs keep sabotaging me, there.
*I have a severe body image problem, though.
Beyond the “fat carries such negative connotations, where ‘curvy’ or ‘voluptuous’ do not” part of this, I think there’s some size distortion going on here. Oddly enough, I don’t think it’s in just one direction.
First off, if I read the OP correctly, you’re saying that you personally are north of 200lbs. I find that shocking as hell. If you and I were in some bizarro carnival where I had to guess your weight, you’d win the prize because I’d be far below that number.
Frankly, I don’t think a lot of people would get that number right. One of the thing that gets bitchily mentioned in every “no, you don’t have a glandular problem, you’re just fat” thread is how we’re losing all perspective on what’s a normal weight and we’re now so used to bigger people around us that we’re losing track of what’s “fat”. I don’t think this is totally incorrect, though I wish it were not typically mentioned with such rudeness and superiority in tone. With that in mind, a comment of, “You’re not fat! You’re curvy!” could well not be a lie to the person speaking. They may well think the person they’re speaking to is within the range of normal - even if that person is not factually within a healthy weight range. Obviously, if I’m reading the OP right, I would fall in this category as well.
There is also, I believe, size distortion in the opposite direction. We see this all the time in celebrity commentary. How many times was Britney Spears called fat last year when she did whatever she did in that black bikini thing? Not in a any way, shape or form was she actually fat, from the photos I saw.
But, you say, that’s celebrities! That’s not normal people!
I disagree, unless you think I’m fat - or was fat when you first met me in January. I’ve never been more than 5lbs overweight, according to my doctor (yes, using BMI charts and whatever else they use), and that lasted about four months. Usually I’m at the high end of normal, such as when we met in January, and these days I’m solidly in the middle of the range. Even so, it’s been said that my height and weight combination make me fat, that thighs that touch is disgusting and/or that a size 12 is huge. I’ve never posted my height/weight combo on the boards, and don’t intend to start now, but I’ve definitely seen it mentioned in those same “not a glandular problem” threads as an example of an overweight woman. Thighs touching or size 12+ are apparently also immediate indicators of fatness. (The first example, of my height and weight combo, I have only ever read on the boards. The other two have been told to me by people who didn’t seem to realize that I have thighs that touch or wore a size twelve. No one has, that I can recall, ever told me I’m fat to my face nor do I know of anyone saying it behind my back.)
So, frankly, if I’m not willing to believe I’m fat (and I’m not), it can be hard to believe anyone who tells me someone else is fat. I have too much experience with assholes telling me I’m overweight to believe those same assholes when they tell me my gorgeous friend WhyNot is overweight. I know she’s gorgeous. I know I’m not overweight. Ergo, they’re clearly wrong when they say she’s overweight. Obviously, this paragraph is sort of a generic synthesis of a frame of mind, not actually the result of someone telling me I’m fat.
For me, personally, it’s a bit of a combination of both of these types of size distortion, I think.
Yes, sometimes I get the brain freeze mentioned above, particularly when a (generic) rather large friend mentions their weight. But for me it’s usually that I just don’t see it. I may see them as being larger than me, but not fat.
Oh, and on preview, FaerieBeth’s husband* has a point too. The shape of how someone’s weight is distributed has an extreme impact on most people’s perceptions of “fat” vs “not fat”, I think. I suspect this is part of why a lot of people would peg you (for example) as lower weight than you seem to be saying you are.**
*I’m glad to see you back, FaerieBeth! Is he headed back too, already back, or no?
**Man, I hope I’m not misreading the OP. If I am, and have just put your weight at much higher than it is, feel free to give me shit for it when we roast green chiles, okay?
Fortunately, I’ve never had anyone say anything like that to me. It would annoy me, too.
I agree with BlueKangaroo about the body size distortion in this culture. When I was at my buffest, I was size 12. I’d be perfectly happy to fit in size 14 again.
And for your entertainment, a slightly off-topic story:
Some years ago, shortly after I started putting on some weight (5’6", 160 or so), I attended a family gathering. I saw my oldest sister there for the first time in about five years. The first thing she said to me was (exact quote, I swear), “Hey! You got fat like the rest of us!”
Me – “Gosh, Sis. It’s good to see you too. :rolleyes: Besides, I’m not fat, I’m rubenesque.” (All the women in the room cheered.)
Thanks, BlueKangaroo. Stonebow will be back, I’m certain. He lurks as it is, so I’m sure the temptation to start posting again will overwhelm him shortly.
Usually, I just laugh and say something like, “No, I may be [compliment], but I sure as hell am fat, too!”
As for myself on the giving end, I wouldn’t say it, and it’s become something of an in-joke with my girlfriend. She was feeling down about her body image one night and said something like “I’m fat and ugly.” Without thinking about what was coming out of my mouth, I said “You’re not fat and ugly; you’re fat and beautiful.”
I wasn’t sure if I was about to get slapped or not until she had tears in her eyes, hugged me, and said that it was the sweetest thing anyone had ever said to her.
Come on people, if we’re fat, we know that we’re fat (at least for the most part). You aren’t going to fool us by denying it.
Great comeback. I would have loved it too!
Pissed me right off, but I figured anyone who said that were trying to say, in a bass-ackward way, that they loved me anyway, so I didn’t choke any of them.
Except my nutjob mother, who went on a tear about how skinny I was getting because of “that” diet (at 165#ish, and small boned 5’2) and again 2 years later (when I was at 120#) about me getting “just a bit chubby.”
That’s when it dawned on me that other peoples comments about my weight have very little to do with my body, and a great deal to do with their own.
I have body image issues, but I am now very careful to never, EVER refer to myself as “fat” lest it inspire some kindhearted soul to utter that particular phrase.
Have I told you (today) how much I love you?
You read it right. I’m actually at 240 right now, about 50 pounds heavier than my picture in the NSFW thread. Yeah, that seems like a huge frickin’ number to me, and I don’t think I look *that *heavy either, but you know what? I really don’t know *what *I look like. Some days I think I probably feel smaller than I am and some days I think I probably feel larger than I am. You could parade a dozen women in front of me, some smaller and some larger, and I don’t think I could accurately put myself in the right spot in line. There’s a makeover show I’ve seen a couple of times - Look Good Naked, or something like that. He’s done this with several women that I’ve seen, and they don’t know what they look like either, so I think you’re right that size distortion is an issue from both ends of the discussion.
But with a 38.7 BMI and a 22 dress size, the numbers aren’t very ambiguous. I don’t think you look fat, or even overweight, now or in January. I think people calling a size 12 fat are ridiculous, but a size 22, not so much.
akennett, that was beautiful!
I only get it from other fat chicks. I’m not curvy, full-figured, voluptuous, fluffy, or big and beautiful. Just fat. I hate hearing the laundry list of euphemisms because for the most part, I know they’re not trying to convince me, they’re trying to convince themselves. Because if I’m fat, then they’re fat.
I usually wind up feeling bad because at least their busts match the rest of them. They can say they’re voluptuous, because they are, while I’m a fatassed, tiny-titted wonder. :mad:
You’re not fat, you’re curvy. -means- Your fat, but I’m trying to say something nice in a stupid way.
I really like your curves. -means- No connection to fat, but it may be seen as a come on.
Say nothing about body curves at work. - This means nobody gets offended.
Say nothing about your not fat, just… - This means they always think you are fat enough to be offended.
It’s a well-meant but ignorant comment.
I’ve had times when people have given me the ‘You’re not fat, you’re beautiful line’, to which I’ve always answered ‘why can’t I be both?’ and left it at that.
And don’t get me started on the ‘Oh, but you’re not obese? You have to be really big to be obese!’. Thanks to the intarwebs, I can now point them to Kate Hardings BMI project: Private Site
I would have kissed you.
I’ve considered myself fat since I was twelve years old. I wasn’t actually fat until I was in college. Talk about a self-fulfilling prophesy. I have had people tell me “you’re not fat,” and they were astonished when I told them how much I weigh. Apparently, I carry my weight very well.
If I were given a choice between:
a) you’re not fat, you’re beautiful!
b) you’re beautiful!
c) you’re fat, and you’re beautiful!
I would definitely take B or C. A is at least half a lie, and if it’s half a lie, then it might as well be a whole lie.
:raises hand sheepishly:
I told a girl the other day that she wasn’t fat, but curvaceous.
Because it’s true. If I was describing her to someone, I wouldn’t use fat at all. I wouldn’t use “big” or “thick”, either. But according to society’s standards, at a size 16 and close to 200 lbs, she’s fat. I don’t agree; I think “curvaceous” better describes her pear-shaped body. Not that I think her body needs to be described in any particular way, but it’s such a constant topic for her that I felt compelled to say something.
She kept going on and on about how much she weighs, how she hates her body, how she wishes she could go back to her skinny size, etc. I could have said, “Yes, dear, you’re fat but you’re beautiful too”, but I don’t think she was looking for such honesty. Saying that would have made me feel embarrassed too. Perhaps in the future I will just say nothing.
I’m guess I feel like, if you’re kvetching about your body, then you should expect people to say stupid, silly things to you. But if people are commenting on your body apropos of nothing, then yeah, I agree that that’s bad form. Even if they are trying to be complimentary.
Thanks for sharing that! Very cool.
I understand that people drag out the “You’re not fat, you’re beautiful” line as they think I’m putting myself down by calling myself fat, when most of the time it’s simply meant as descriptive. I usually have a healthier and more realistic body image than slimmer friends so unless it’s just one of those GHOD I’M SUCH A WHALE days, which I know for a fact even size zero women get, it’s not meant negatively. Plus it’s far more descriptive than “beautiful”, which I am not. Cute, yes, and perhaps even pretty on a good day with flattering lighting, but I’m not and will never be a beauty. So it’s lying to me, but kindly. A little patronising but sweetly meant. I try to gently correct them in the same manner with a “Sure I’m fat, I don’t see it as a bad thing.”
Not for nothing, but I’m one of those “skinny bitches” people feel so comfortable being snarky about.
Ya know what? I once got up to 185lbs, my normal weight is 120, AND I carried it all in my torso, so I was pretty chunky. It was the most liberating period of my life besides pregnancy. NO ONE, I mean NO ONE said shit about my weight or lack thereof. No snide “well, YOU can eat anything.” No backhanded “Not everyone ha the metabolism you do.” or “You NEVER have a problem finding clothes that fit.” or other like comments.
What I did realize was how unbelievably nasty people could be towards skinny people. It was shocking really.
As for you WhyNot, I know you aren’t a small woman, but you are one of the coolest women I’ve ever had the pleasure to not meet. Maybe you are just overweight to compensate for the curve?
I object.
Currently, I suppose I could be called fat, although nobody’s ever done so that I know of. I’m male, 6’4" tall, and 270 pounds. But when I was 220 pounds, there’s no way you’d have called me fat. I looked good–waist measurement smaller than the inseam, no belly overlap, no flab on the arms… Heck, at 240 people still thought I weighed under 200.
So I disagree with your blanket statement calling anyone under 6’5" tall and over 200 pounds “fat.”
It really depends on the context. I mean, my friends tell me ‘you’re not fat, just fluffy!’, but it’s meant to say ‘you’re cute!’ like I’m a giant Care Bear or something. I’m okay with that. But when people try to use a phrase to mean ‘you’re hot!’ I just feel like they’re lying.