For Christians.....a devotional

The problem here is that there is no singular message. I know well there’s a yearning for there to be a unity to be found.

But there isn’t. As you went right on to note:

Yes. Trying to avoid True Scotsmen road, the two methods are in different ballparks that happen to share a few superficial similarities, but at foundation level are different things; different formulations, different narratives.

People will go on–I’m one of them–about that rusty old saw of blind men and the elephant (sidenote: what the heck’s the provenance and origin of that? Wonder if that’s in the archives), which is fine as far as it goes. But in some cases, it isn’t blind men feeling bits of a single pachyderm; it’s sighted people–imperfect sight, sure, but sighted–one looking at a fire and rose that are one, and the other at wounds and nails.

What’s “effecitve” in this depends on audience. When I came to the Dope, I had already been shaken repeatedly by what it pleases some to call “mystical” experiences–maybe they were just self-caused minor seizures in various bits of my brain, but who can say–and that isness that I was seeing more easily was never that condemning legalistic blood-fetish Other that the fundamentalist warning method proclaims. It couldn’t have been more alien to what I was witnessing–only just as alien in different ways–they could proclaim dire warnings about Quetzacoatl and his urgent need for dripping hearts excised with flint knifes, and it wouldn’t have been any more distant.

That method, though, is undeniably effective, if only in volume. Before coming here, I literally had no idea that Christianity had any formulations of the Divine in it that weren’t, at heart, of the fundamentalist variety; the voice of the “fundie” method has been effective at drowning the other views out entirely (in individual listeners’ cases, not universally; perhaps I’m an isolated exception, the plural of anecdote not being data and all).

As for the last quote I saw before hitting submit–it matters. To this viewer, the Christ that is proclaimed “in all ways” is simply often not the same being. Sometimes, to become narnish, that being proclaimed is Tash, no matter how many times it’s called Aslan.

I don’t think that error comes from a flawed heart or evil intent (statistical outliers like Phelps notwithstanding) in the majority of cases–but I do think it comes from deep error, one with repercussions that echo throughout both this life and those that follow.

You and her and other like her can sure make someone disregard, even despise, Christianity, though. So much so, in fact, that they shut their ears to God’s calling.

I think you totally misinterpreted Lib on this one. He was equating His4Ever to the Pharisee’s, I don’t think his intention was to equate himself with a “pure” unsinning follower of God.

No one said it was a game. The honey aspect is about the approach. You can either be nice to someone, give them adequate reason’s to follow Christ, or you can come at them full of judgement and condescenion. Which do you think is going to get them to convert?

Not to mention what is being lied about? How are you supposed to get someone to believe you when you focus on only the negative aspects of Christianity? Why should they believe you?

Just a little nitpick: What makes you think you are right and they are wrong? That’s where the “better” attitude seems to rear it’s head. Who’s to say that the other person doesn’t know Him better than you? Is your opinion of that person’s faith, really that correct?

Polycarp ,
Your method of speaking God’s truth through love and a personal relationship regarding sin is more as I view God to truly be. Yes, he judges us, and on that day he will. Though, on that day I hope it is he who judges me…not those I have had to deal with in my life for they would surely find fault. As I have mentioned…people who speak as H4E and others…tend to bring up my own certainty that God cannot love me.

How can he love insignificant ME if those who speak FOR HIM seem to despise sinners like me? I have been told that I AM NOT A CHRISTIAN because I DON’T condemn Homosexuality. How can a God who agrees with THAT philosophy possibly EVER forgive my sins of thought? If he has no seeming forgiveness for those who are Homosexuals…and if he condemns people to Hell for an act of love without thought of their hearts for him…how on earth can I believe that he will forgive MY sins of thought which are petty and sometimes wishing for others to fail? :frowning:

I had always thought he searched a persons HEART…and if there was love for him and if a person worked at living for him…that he would forgive that person for their transgressions…

But it would seem…sometimes it seems as if those who speak FOR HIM say that is not so…

That God has a full message…that love for him and belief are not enough in that full message.

Does this thread brings tears to anyone? I think Scotticher (?) mentioned it as well…
Libertarian and Sunglasses

A simple thank you for you kind words. It helps very much and I read your posts with a lighter heart.

Beautiful Lady of the Lake

May your heart always be light.

“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”

Jesus (Matthew 11:28-30)

http://answering-islam.org/Bible/Contra/

http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/contralinks.html

http://www.rationalchristianity.net/links/contradictions.html

http://hometown.aol.com/KingDavid10/Contradictions/Home.html

God calls everyone, though. Unless you think he doesn’t give a damn about certain people and is fine with them not hearing his call to repentance, in which case your God is a monster and a demon, and should be spit on instead of worshipped.

If God calls everyone, and so much as one person is put off from investigating his call because of the evil done here by you, your wife and His4Ever, then yes, the witness of an evil person is enough to offset the draw of God’s call.

People like His drove me far afield from Christianity at one point, with their lies and hate and damnation. It wasn’t until I started reading the writings of a real Christian, Bishop John Shelby Spong, that I found my way back.

Still letting other people do your thinking for you, I see.

Why use a brick when a book will do?

Why are these links needed if there is no confusion in the first place?

His, setting aside contradictions in the Bible, what about all the things mentioned in the Bible that we know did not happen, such as the slaughter of innocents by Herod?

http://www.healthsystem.virginia.edu/internet/personalitystudies/case_types.cfm#NDE

Your answer to my Bible contradictions post is just a bunch of addresses to guys who think like you do and give their opinions on them. Funny, but really sad, that you believe their opinions make any difference.

Love
Leroy

Oops, I got the wrong address on my above post, sorry.

http://www.ffrf.org/lfif/contra.html

In sort of a response to Poly - what brought me back to Christ was the love I saw from Him. After thirty years of faith, my divorce and the unfortunate circumstances in which I subsequently found myself contributed to my turning my back on my God. I felt He had left me alone and drifting. After several years of anger and bitterness, I had an epiphany. I literally imagined the gifts He had given me as presents falling from the sky all around me. All of a sudden, I could SEE and FEEL how He had not deserted me . . . how He had been with me all along . . . how much He LOVED me.

So I was not witnessed to, but the LOVE is what brought me back to God. And it’s the LOVE of God that makes me want to avoid sin and to be a better person.

Amen

Hurray for this powerful, positive post.

Just keep quoting the positive, love oriented verses, and let those who will, teach fear. Love will defeat them easily in the end. They are running people away from God and Jesus and church in record numbers. Who would want to go somewhere they are condemned, judged, and frightened by people who think they speak for God.

The Bible can be used as a tool for good or evil, depending on the heart of the preacher. Always choose love in all things and let the devil have the rest.

Love
Leroy

Their opinions do matter, because they have to be right because they agree with her. Any opinion that does not agree is wrong and a bad interpretation. :rolleyes:

I disagree to agree…:wink: