From where the sun now stands, I will fight no more forever.

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
61

You’ve told us that she’s 55. I assume you’re in that age range, too. Were you married for a long time? Is this your first attempt at dating again?

She’s 55 and appears to be heavily involved in her work. She probably has little interest in a relationship beyond having a man (or men) to go out with, bring to parties and, maybe, have sex with. She probably senses that you’re taking things far too seriously and is backing off. Why she hasn’t backed completely off is a mystery, but maybe she hopes that you’ll come around. Lighten up and maybe things will work out better with the next woman you meet.

62

I’m 45.

Married almost 8 years, divorced 12 years ago. I’d say I’ve had four serious relationships since my divorce.

Re: me taking it too seriously—like I said, it could be argued that I didn’t show enough interest by calling her. I definitely haven’t crowded her in that respect.
Talking all this out with a (female) friend about her age, a good guess might be:

There are a lot of women her age out there who have gone the circuit. They got married, had kids and raised them, divorced (perhaps bitterly). In their 40s and 50s they find themselves single.

Dating is a pain on both sides of the aisle of course. A lot of men and women in middle age decide that relationships are such a lot of work and likely to fail, so they’re pretty choosy about whom they get involved with—a woman whose husband dominated her is going to cherish her new freedom. Besides, the hormones aren’t running like they used to, and it’s easier to put relationships on a shelf and turn attention to other things.

The women either start work or go back to school and throw a lot of energy into their professional career. Maybe it allows a chance to travel, for instance (which this woman does a lot of BTW) but the theme in general is “self-actualization in ways that don’t involve or require a man.” They’re not cooling their heels waiting for a man to call; on the contrary, they’re filling up their schedules with everything else.

The question, then, is whether they stop their momentum (career, travel, etc.) and allow for a man in their life when that man comes along.

I dunno…Occam’s razor is just too dull for this task.

63

Well shut my fucking mouth.

She just called.

She was just checking to see how I was doing. She knew I’d been having problems with my AC from our last talk, Monday.

So I detailed what happened since then.

She said she slept 12 hours last night.

She asked what I had planned for tonight. I replied that I didn’t have anything planned. She said she was just taking it easy, thought she’d rent a couple movies and veg out. For a nanosecond I thought about asking if she wanted to get together, then decided against it.

She said she’d see me tomorrow. I said ok.

64

…and she called again just now.

She said she was feeling sick and decided not to attend the function today. She said she realized I’m busy and she’d catch up with me later.

OK.

65

This … you’re coming across as borderline obsessed. If a woman wants a second date her schedule will be as open as she wants it to be. You’re hanging on with your fingernails because she doesn’t know how to brush you off politely. Stop this nonsense and move on, you’re degrading yourself.

66

“No thank you, I’ve moved on.” And move on.

67

Wow, I don’t know what happens between the time I compose a message and it is read by the SDMB.

My purpose in posting was that I said I would keep the board notified. Eleanorigby said:

*I bet if you wait for her to make the next move, you’ll never hear from her again. *

I replied:

*Eleanor, I’d like to believe you’re right—that if I don’t make a move, that will be that. But I’d take the bet that you’re wrong. The reasons Shodan listed, well, none of them are a mature way to act but all of them may be correct. There has to be some kind of payoff for her or else she wouldn’t do it.

I promise to follow an honor code on this (cyber pinky swear). As I said, I know we’ll cross paths this weekend at a function. After that, wait two weeks…I predict that she will, without provocation from me, contact me, on or before August 17.*

Today, by the way, is August 3.

To me, this is a major bone of contention. People are telling me to “let her go” and I will. But what part of **"SHE won’t stop contacting ME" ** is not getting through in what I’m writing?! How is it that the fact she called me twice in the last two days evidence that I’m holding on by my fingernails, that I’m borderline obsessed?

I just wanted to understand the psychology behind what she’s doing. Women do so many things I’ll never figure out, but I thought maybe the dope could shed some light on it.

There are a few other developments; I guess they’re not worth posting.

68

…
Sometimes part of saying ‘goodbye’ is calling Ma Bell and having a phone number blocked. Or adding an email address to a Spam filter.

Better days to you, lobotomyboy63. Better days…

69

I don’t think you are obsessing, nor do I think you are waiting by the phone for the next call…so can I hear the new developments? the psychology fascinates me, too…

70

I get that she is calling you.

But you’re also taking her calls. And having inane, pointless conversations with her. If you’re “done” with her, tell her. Who cares what the psychology is?? She sounds like a flake. Or married. :dubious:

Either way, making yourself crazy over this woman’s rationale is a monumental waste of time.

You seem like a cool dude, **lobotomyboy ** - you don’t deserve that kind of treatment.

71

What she said.

I had an ex-boyfriend who, while we were still dating, did stuff to tick me off in the hopes that I would break it off with him; he claimed in a letter months after I finally did, that he was too cowardly to do it, so he wouldn’t return calls, wouldn’t make plans to see me, etc., to get me to break it off. (I think he figured I wouldn’t be as broken-hearted or something but it really didn’t work that way.) In her case, she might be kind of stringing you along because… well, who knows - maybe she feels vaguely bad that she screwed up your first date, maybe she thought you were being too pushy with your “good time” comment and she is screwing with you for some reason, who knows? Maybe she’s thinking you’re jerking her around because she expects you’ll make concrete plans and be more headstrong with her if you’re really interested.

It doesn’t matter. She’s not fitting what you’re looking for, so just tell her it’s over. You had a great chance to do that - and missed it - when she called with the whole “couple movies and veg out.” My interpretation was that she was feeling out your interest level and when you said nothing, she figured you didn’t care to see her, and so her call the next day was her way of not actually coming out and saying that.

Tell her. If you want, wait until the next contact then say, “Actually, I won’t be up for going out on Saturday, I don’t think this’ll work out between us.”

72

Sure. PM me? I don’t mind telling anybody how it turns out, and I feel obligated…I don’t think shaggy dog stories are cool. But I feel like this thread has worn out its welcome, so I’ll conclude on the board here.

To those who say that I still take her calls… Awhile ago I posted that my sisters told me not to break contact, to give her another chance. While I disagreed with them, I decided to suspend disbelief, try to learn something by not going with my instincts. Someone defined crazy as “Doing things the way you’ve always done them and expecting different results” and I decided to go with that. When she called she said we would go out in the next two weeks. Since I did not cut her off at that point, I felt I had to follow through to the end of the two weeks (which ends at midnight tonight).
I’ve decided that dopers are right in suggesting I not email her anything. For one thing, it’s like answering a question that hasn’t been asked. One of the reasons I wanted to do it was that I avoid conflict and I felt more comfortable choosing my words at leisure.

I predict the end will go like this: she’ll call and I’ll answer. I don’t have caller ID on my home phone, but even if I did, I’d answer. Might as well get it over with.

I’ll be very neutral—not angry or happy or anything. She’ll mention something about a date, and I’ll take it as my in. I’ll say, “I’ve let that go. It’s clear that there is no time in your schedule for me, so no thanks.” At that point, if she wants to hang up, it suits me right down to the ground. My very nature is to avoid conflict, so hopefully she won’t tell me an outright lie that pisses me off and makes me say things I don’t want to say.

BTW, asking me not to analyze is like asking a dog not to bark. Like a lot (?) of dopers, I wish I had more social skills, particularly when it comes to the opposite sex. Even though this didn’t work out, I’d like to understand because maybe it would help me avoid people like her in the future. Besides, I have 50 college credit hours in psychology, so this wanting to understand people goes back a long time and runs deep.

But I admit, posters are probably correct in saying that all juice of understanding has already been squeezed out of this lemon. Thank you, sincerely, for all your comments and support.

73

Prediction: At that point, she says of course she has time for you, makes a bunch of excuses/apologies for past flakiness, and sets a date right then and there. You’ll be taken so off guard, having analyzed everything ahead of time, you might even forget your resolve and agree to see her again. If she’s really talented at this game, she might even manage to convince you that you were the source of your own distress this entire time and by the end of the call, you’ll apologize for not talking to her about this earlier.

And then she’ll blow you off again. Maybe not for the next date, but for the one after.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

It’s the dating equivalent of asking the computer to calculate the exact value of pi. Or Charlie Brown thinking that this time, Lucy will really hold the football.

I know the feeling, but she shows all the signs of being the type of person who defies analysis, and once you think you’ve got it figured out and have a plan, she’ll shift the playing field on you again. So brace yourself for that possibility and don’t get sucked in by it. Sometimes it’s sufficient to analyze someone into the “not for me” bin, which I’ve learned the hard way a time or two myself–thus the prediction about where this is headed. :wink:

Good luck, regardless.

74

Well, I can see from your description of those two calls why you’re so perplexed. She’s definitely sending you mixed messages, which is the pits. The “what are you doing? I"m just hanging around…” sounds very much like her way of opening the door for you to show your interest and ask if she wanted company. When you didn’t do that, she was probably embarrassed, taking it as a rejection and then following up with the “I won’t see you tomorrow, you’re busy anyway” call could be another invitation to hearing you express more interest. Very interesting. She may have gotten spooked on that second “date” and then has had time to think about it. At our age, you just don’t know what someone’s baggage is AND many women, as assertive as they may be in other areas of their life, are not in the frame of mind of being assertive when it comes to dating. They still expect the man to do the asking and take charge. If he doesn’t, she takes it as a sign of disinterest.

I’d say it’s time to take the bull by the horns and flat out ask her what’s up if she calls again. Tell her straight out you’re getting mixed messages and her behavior is confusing. It doesn’t have to be confrontational or nasty, just ask. Ask her the very questions you’re wondering about here. Something as simple as “I’m a little confused here. You keep calling, but you’re never available…” and then, it depends on how you feel. You can say you’re still interested, but not interested in continuing the game and want to set an actual date (and then do it - you set the date and time and if she doesn’t show, be done with her) or you can say you’ve had enough and would prefer she doesn’t continue calling or she’s welcome to call to chat, but let’s drop the date talk and leave it casual - whatever you want to do at this point. My guess is she’s waiting for you to do something. That may have been the nature of her marriage and what she’s used to and comfortable with.