The only online game I’ve played is Battlefield 2. I have reported people for racist remarks, and they’ve gotten warned, then (if needed) kicked or banned.
Each server is a much smaller game world (max 64 players at a time), and most of the ones I play on use TeamSpeak, so there’s no emailing involved–I just hit the shift key and call foul on somebody, and the admins deal with it.
I suppose I wouldn’t have as much of a problem with this if Blizzrd weren’t so nakedly hypocritical about it (which, I suppose, explains why Martin Hyde supports the decision.) WoW comes with a built in filter. It’s client controlled, sure, and up to the player to turn it on or off, but it defaults to “on,” and automatically blocks swear words and ethnic slurs… but not “fag.” The public chat is absolutely filled with people using fag and gay as synonymous with “bad” or “stupid.” “Alliance fags ganked my kill in Plaguelands,” “I hate Murlocs, they’re so gay,” and on and on and on. Blizzard does absolutely nothing to stop this, but apparently, they will move to prevent anyone from trying to create a group in the game that’s free from this shit, or at least, from letting anyone know that such groups exsist. (And no, I don’t report people when I see these sorts of comments, because if I did, I’d spend more time typing up complaints than I would playing, it’s that common.) I don’t think Blizzard is actually being homophobic, I just think they are being fucking cowards. There is no reasonable opposition to gay rights, no more than there is reasonable opposition to racial equality or religious tolerance. Blizzard has decided that they don’t want to risk losing out on bigot’s subscription fees, is all there is to it. The line that Blizzard is supposed to be “orientation neutral” is a flat-out lie. There are dozens and dozens of NPCs in the game that talk about their (opposite sex) spouse, and last Feburary, the WorldofWarcraft.com ran an extended “Valentine’s day” section of theme art. Apparently, gay people are too controversial for their game, but a cartoon of a minotaur necking with a walking corpse (I kid you not - it was on the front page of the site) is a-okay.
Bolding mine in the above. I agree completely - homophobia is only the reason that this can happen at all, not the reason it specifically did happen. It happened because Blizzard doesn’t have to care about anything but the bottom line. So be it; they’ve lost a few subsciptions today, and they’re getting a few letters, and maybe eventually the filter will get changed and everybody will feel like something happened.
But nothing much will happen. Queer gamers on WoW - like women, like non-whites, oh yes, you guys, fucking believe it, cuz it is true - will continue to be likely to feel marginalized and isolated.
Please nobody come back and say 'But my friend the half-Swedish half-Asian intersexed lesbian said she doesn’t feel - ’ I know. I know. Some people are perfectly comfortable. But it’s a big big World of Warcraft and a lot of people - young people, people on the edge of their lives trying to figure out who they are - are in it, stumbling around with FAG or BITCH or FREAK branded on their head in giant invisible letters, terrified everyone can see it.
While my honey Martin Hyde sits in his cushy guild, where nobody assumes he’s gay, and looks out the window with nothing in his mind, ruling the world.
Well, fine, if you think that merely advertising a group as being friendly to LGBT members is “flagrantly flout[ing] their sexuality”. It’s a pretty stupid thing to think, but there you go, I guess. You wouldn’t think merely highlighting the fact that a particular group doesn’t break the abuse rules would be such a controversial thing. Well, you would, apparently, but fuck knows why.
They’re not running round in pink spandex, eating chocolate-shaped novelty willies and chanting, “we all want to spank Martin Hyde!” They’re saying, “we won’t call you a fag or a queer.” I have literally no idea why this bothers you, or why you believe it’s something that should be stamped out.
You know cthiax, you might have a more convincing argument if you didn’t assume the worst for mankind over some gaming company’s policy. It’s just a stupid game.
Also, text molesting those who disagree with you is counterproductive. You think it shocks and embarrasses them to the point of running away and leaving you standing victorious. Sorry my friend, it just shows that you’re too cowardly and immature to debate their points.
No, it shows I have a sense of humor. 
I believe I have actually debated their points quite sufficiently while at the same time - molesting? Really? With endearments, perhaps. If you’d like some text molesting I can certainly oblige you, big boy.
Of mankind I assume the best. Of gaming companies, not so much. Shall we abandon all discourse because cynical is suddenly passe’?
I’m glad you’re here now, because your argument was possibly the only one missing from the usual bag of tricks: It’s Just A Stupid Game. This is the same argument people used to make when White Wolf was producing a game called Jew: The Baby Killing or something like that, where Jewish people were all really good with money and drank blood - no, sorry, it was Gypsies with magical fortune-telling powers, that’s right. Whatever, same thing.
The argument is a real limper. It boils down to “there is no community here, just a bunch of people side by side” which is clearly untrue, and “it doesn’t effect anything in the real world”, which rates of suicide among queer youth kind of belie as well. Imagine if they had a place where they could feel like they could just hang out without being verbally assaulted every five fucking seconds. Gee. Too bad that would totally blow everybody’s precious little minds.
Apparently humor, like sexuality, is in the mind of the beholder. If you’d been any more obnoxious in this thread, they could have cast you on Will & Grace.
Blizzard’s world is Blizzard’s world. If they don’t want “Real-world” sexual issues becomin an issue in their game – well, it’s their call. Leaving the game – well, that’s your call. I have to vaguely side with Blizzard on this one – I found guild chatter annoying enough so that I quit the guild that I was in. Far as I’m concerned, guild chatter should be restricted to “I’m looking to do a quest” and “How do I kill a level 51 elite three-toed sloth.”.
Agreed. I was kind of inclined to agree with cthiax… until he started verbally baiting Martin Hyde. Argue the points, or shut the fuck up- insults and taunting do not an argument make.
My history- I was a developer on an MMORPG. I was also one of the in-game GMs, and I was also the main guy in charge of the game’s forums. The MOG that I worked on was a very cheap, very low-tech game- so we had a LOT of teenage boys… and you can easily imagine the type of language they prefer to use. Add in the fact that we had PvP, and you’ve got players constantly insulting each other.
I let everyone know that I would not tolerate the words “fag” and “gay”, etc., either in-game or on the forums. Many of my friends are gay, and I equate the derogatory “fag” fight up there with “nigger”. However, I would’ve voted to disallow an openly GLBT-friendly guild… because once the devs allow that sort of guild to exist, where does it stop?
How about a “GLBT-unfriendly” guild? How about a “whites only” guild? Where do you draw the line?
What’s more, a GLBT-friendly guild would constantly be harassed by teenage homophobes seeking to prove their masculinity- and that’s a customer service nightmare. Better to just disallow it, and avoid the whole situation.
Now, you say that Blizzard, by disallowing the GLBT-friendly guild, is inherently backing the (by default) hetero guilds… well, you’re wrong there. If someone specifically made a “Hetero-Only” guild, they’d get the customer service shaft as well. Blizzards not taking sides- they’re trying to AVOID taking sides.
MMORPGs are a service, not a necessity. Vote with your feet. If you don’t like what they’re doing, don’t pay them. If enough people do this, some other company will be more accomodating- and Blizzard will HAVE to change.
This might be a stupid question, but what exactly is the purpose of labeling your guild ‘GLBT friendly?’
In any case, I don’t find issue with the Blizzard decision as long as they make some effort to enforce their other policy on harassment/hate/forbidden speech. Apparently, they are not. Is there legal recourse, or is it simply a matter of voting with your dollar?
Are you fuckin’ high? Read Martin’s first post in this thread. He’s an asshole right out of the gate. If anything, cthiax was restrained in her response to him.
I guess it would have been better if I’d stuck to calling him a motherfucking dogfelching sonofawhore, huh?
Yeah, Blizzard can do what they want. I can explain why it sucks. You can call me a fag, or possibly a junkie or a headcase, some more. Liberals can try to defend straight people’s right to a gaming environment totally sterilized of every mention of queerness, right down to four…little…letters in a Guild ad. And the machine will just grind right on.
He had a frigging guest account? That means he played, for what, 15 days? I’ve reported people for using profanity and racist terms… and yes… for using the word faggot. I did get a GM response… of course, I’ve been playing since it went retail… maybe I’m more important. I had a guy in an old guild get his account suspended for calling someone gay. Some of the people that I reported got their accounts suspended also.
If you submit a GM ticket, you get a GM response. I’ve never had a ticket go unresponded to… but as I said before, maybe I’m just special.
No. You could have acted like a mature adult. But instead, you decided to prove that people can be jerks regardless of their sexual preferences. And, incidentally, proved Blizzard’s point – you’re no more mature than the people who run around yelling “fag” or “gay”, and I agree that your GLBT guild had the potential to be a very uncomfortable thing for other gamers.
The most common thing would be being able to get in a group of people without having to listen to a constant litany about what parts of the game are “gay” or which NPCs are “fags.” It’s not really a big deal, but it does get really old after a while, and there’s a definite appeal in being guaranteed a group where that just doesn’t happen.
On top of that, MMORPGs tend to be very social. It’s not really an aspect I go in for, but a lot of people treat them like chat rooms with the occasional dragon. For players who are into that sort of thing, it’d be nice to be able to mention your boyfriend/girlfriend without worrying about one of the other people in your group spazzing out because you happen to be the same gender as your SO. It’s never happened to me, personally, because I don’t ever mention that I’m gay in the game, despite the fact that 90% of the time my boyfriend is in the same group as me. Like I said, it’s not something I’d go in for anyway, so I’m not particularly hurting from feeling like it’s not something I can talk about, but I can see how it would be galling for more socially minded players.
Draw the line between guilds that have inclusive membership policies and guilds whose membership policies explicitly denigrate or insult minorities.
Gee, that was easy.
Or just enforce the damn service agreement in a consistent manner. You know, the part which disallows “clear and masked language which insultingly refers to any aspect of sexual orientation pertaining to themselves or other players”, and for which the suggested penalty is to be temporarily suspended from the game. Teenage homophobe harasses the guild -> suspended teenage homophobe.
Of course, that would require Blizzard to interpret “hey you faggot” as an insult, and they seem to think that “GLBT” is the term being used which is inherently insulting…when used by gay people.
No, no, guest account here on the Dope. He’s played WoW since it opened, for several hours a day.
Maybe I’m missing something. While not worded quite as politely or considerately as it could be, I don’t see anything that makes him an asshole. I see the “Did you start crying” comment, which could be construed as assholish behavior… and I see the “drama queen” comment (but that’s immediately followed by “I don’t mean that with a sexual connotation”)… but all I see from the rest of his post is, effectively, “it’s just a game”.
Certainly there’s nothing in there that immediately calls for
Yeah, it’s slightly rude, but it’s not an extreme reaction to the second-to-last paragraph in the OP which was so far over the top that it could be used to tether a space elevator.
Oh, c’mon, that was first class jerkery on Martin’s behalf. The reply he got was entirely comensurate with his first post. He acted like a dick, he got treated like a dick. It all happened in the pit. How does this reflect badly on cthiax at all?
Never said that. By the way, are you actually gay? Because I’ve known many gay people in my life and not one of them ever used the word queer, the only times I ever hear that word used are in relation to a popular Bravo television show and in 19th century literature.
Well you’ve basically had a complete logical breakdown here. I said Blizzard wants to create an environment without gratuitous “sexual issues.” And it will take steps to foster that environment when it has the power to do so Blizzard isn’t actively aware of the many “faggot” instances you talk about because as I said, they don’t monitor every line of chat, they do monitor new guild names though and anything that gets reported to them (I’m betting someone reported the gay-friendly guild.)
The fact is a “gay guild” or a gay friendly guild is very likely to create waves in the Blizzard world, and plus, its making unneeded and unnecessary reference to sexual issues that have no place in the false-world of Azeroth.