Dangerous words, that. This is GRRM we’re talking about. Like Joss Whedon, he seems to derive a perverse pleasure from killing off characters his audience enjoys 
Ah, ok…so I wonder if HBO will indeed get further along in the series than the author. And if that happens…I wonder if Martin will bother writing anything further.
Well, there’s 3 more books out there and I believe 2 more to be written. And I think the plan is to do 2 seasons per book from now on. So he’s got 6 more years to finish the series.
I was thinking about the “proper” line of succession, presuming a Salic or Semi-Salic inheritance law - OK, so Robert was king. He has offsprings but not really, so the title should by rights go to his next brother Stannis.
Had Stannis died on that beach, who’d get to be the “legit” heir ? Renly, naturally, but he’s dead too so where does the title jump to next ? Back to Cersei for being the last alive on that branch of the family tree ? To Joffrey because a bastard’s better than nothing and “heads of state” is a no gurls allowed club ? First cousins is I think the way these things worked in such succession crises in Europe, but does/did Robert’s father have a brother with his own set of heirs ? Or does the line just die and it becomes an official free-for-all ?
No idea if this is spoilers or not; I don’t SEE anything here that’s different from the series, and the pics are all of the series actors, so…I’m assuming it’s all within the series.
Andd…I can see that doesn’t really delve into the Houses before the series’ current characters, so…not much help.
Joffrey told Mandon he was to “represent the king on the battlefield,” and was left behind very specifically, while the rest of the Kingsguard follows Joffrey away. Would anyone be surprised to learn that at the point Joff was still full of piss and thinking he was going to swagger out on the field that he already had a plan to have his slap-happy little uncle “accidentally” put away by Mandon in the heat of battle. The instruction to Mandon seemed a little too specific to me, when combined with Mandon’s actions.
He actually ordered two Kingsguard to remain, not just Mandon.
Did he? Still, he didn’t give the other guy any instructions, did he? It just seemed very pointed to me.
Taomist’s chart is from the first season, and doesn’t show Stannis at all. Stannis has at least one daughter who was mentioned as being sickly, right? If you dump all of Cersei’s kids as the illegitimate products of incest, I think the daughter would be next in line to the throne.
But might usually makes right in these kinds of dynastic struggles. Then the scribes, heralds and maesters try to make it all look kosher.
I suppose if the Baratheons had been in power for a long time, the power would probably go to the closest, eldest cousin of Robert. Which is probably why Martin started the series relatively shortly after Robert took power. Even if Joffrey was a legitimate son, I bet there would still be struggle over the throne.
“Sir Boris, Sir Mandon, stay with my uncle and represent the king on the field of battle” - it was a spontaneous decision to try to save some face by at least allowing his king guard to fight, rather than a preplanned attempt to pair Mandon up with Tyrion.
Anyway, though… Joffrey, Myrcelle, and Tommen are NOT King Robert’s bastards. They’re Jaime Lannister’s bastards.
King Robert’s known bastards have been killed off, with the exception of the blacksmith fellow that is pals with Arya. So I guess that guy could have a decent (if backhanded) claim to the throne, if only he knew who he was and could prove it to everyone. Which he doesn’t and he can’t.
So from what I can see, if Joff gets himself killed, his brother Tommen and sister Myrcelle would be next in line, unless Tommen, Myrcelle and Joff are outed as being incest-bastards, in which case Stannis is the proper heir.
If Stannis dies, then it’s on down the line to his offspring, if he has any. Shadow baby with red-headed-crazylady notwithstanding. I also believe that a sickly daughter was mentioned but not named, and it’s reasonable to believe that the daughter might be an adult with children of her own, since Stannis isn’t exactly a young whippersnapper. So presumably the daughter, if she exists, would be next in line, and if the daughter does NOT have children, then the claim would pass to Renly upon her death.
Renly, of course, has already died as of Season 2, so that’s a moot point. Unless by some miracle he managed to get his wife, Margary Tyrell, pregnant before he died. Miracle being the operative word since he was by all accounts gay.
Personally, I’d say that the person with the most legitimate claim to the Iron Throne is Daenerys Stormborn Targaryen.
However, there doesn’t seem to be any popular movement in Westeros to restore the Targaryen monarchy. Unless and until her dragons are good to go, she’s out of the running.
I could be wrong, but I don’t remember anything about Stannis having a sickly daughter, just a sickly wife who isn’t doing too well in the breeding department. Mellisandra said about his wife, “She has given you nothing, no sons, only still-borns, only death.”
I think it’s pretty certain that Cersei was the one behind Mandon’s actions.
First, Mandon was the one Cersei had capture and bring in Tyrion’s supposed love-interest. Then even after that, when she thought she had him by the balls, Tyrion quite pointedly promised her some pretty serious vengeance. And the promise of vengeance wasn’t based on something happening to his supposed lover, it was for her daring to do what she’d already done. At that point, I think she realized that her move wasn’t as effective as she’d hoped and decided to strike first, before Tyrion got a chance to retaliate.
And although I’m not quite as confident of this part, now that I think about it, I suppose it’s also possible that she was behind the Hound’s picking a fight with Bronn. Taking out Bronn would have made it much easier to ultimately take out Tyrion.
Before the Targaryens arrived & conquered–with the aid of dragons–the Seven Kingdoms were just that. Separate kingdoms! So, the Baratheon line doesn’t have an ancient claim. And, really, no other noble house has much of a claim to rule all of Westeros.
Some still consider Joffrey & his sibs legit heirs–at least, the Lannisters & their allies do. For those who don’t recognize Cersei & Jaime’s brood, Stannis is the rightful king, as Robert’s surviving brother. If he’s got a daughter somewhere, she’d be next in line–but the rights of female heirs are a bit dicey. Renly was younger than Stannis, so had less of a right; but he was more popular & had allies. Being dead puts him out of the running & he never got around to conceiving an heir.
Gendry probably doesn’t know the identify of his father. On Earth, bastards could occasionally be considered–if their mothers were well born, they’d been recognized & educated as gentlemen–& had strong allies. Nope, he’s fleeing for his life right now–as are most of the Westerosi not secure behind strong walls.
Robb doesn’t want to rule the whole place–just the North. However, he needs to avenge his father & fight for the North’s independence. The Greyjoys don’t really want to rule–that’s too much like work; pillage, conquest & rapine are their things!
So, Dany does have a birthright–but’s that never enough; her current situation is powerless. Oh–and winter is still coming, even if most of the Westerosi are too busy to notice…
I’ve really come to like Sansa as a character. For most of season 1, she was a superficial, arrogant little bitch. Then, with the death of her father, she became at least pitiable. Now, over the course of this season, she’s become very sympathetic and a much more noble character. She’s been broken down emotionally and is still very fragile, but her actions in this episode show her becoming stronger and, hopefully, less fatalistic about her situation.
Westeros is based on medieval England and/or Europe. When someone usurped a throne in that era, they usually had some kind of actual blood relationship with the royal line. Or some former royal line. It was never just some bloke with a sword and a dream. It was never the son of a field hand.
The Baratheons, for instance, could be descendants of one of the royal families of the Seven Kingdoms. If so, they could be basing their claim on that, as much as on the de facto “my arse is on the throne therefore I am King” argument.
I have not read the books, so I’m just speculating here. But it seems to me likely that at least some of the currently noble families are descended from and/or intermarried with the former royal families of the seven kingdoms of Westeros. So there could easily be other claims that we’re not yet aware of.
I very much doubt it. To me it just looked like your average Friday night bout of “You lookin’ at me, pal ?” “I’m not your pal, friend” “Yeah ? Well I’m not your friend, buddy”.
Judging by Clegane’s general behaviour and what we’ve seen of him (notably during his rescue of Sansa), I would think if he’d been hired to kill Bronn he’d have simply strolled into the tavern, calmly walked up to him and lopped his head off without bothering with a word.
Yeah, if that was supposed to be a hit it would have ended with one of them dead.