All-
I am going to get a divorce from my wife. I am not really thrilled about it, but it has to happen. We have two boys together, ages 9 and 5. I don’t know if I should go into a lot of detail about it since the process is just getting underway, but I was looking to you guys and gals to throw some friendly advice my way in the hopes that you may help me think of everything possible to cover all my bases.
Thanks in advance.
Okay, here we go.
First off - it will all get better in the end. Keep that in mind at all times.
I have a personal mantra that helps in times like this: “Remember that NOTHING you are going through is unique, other people have dealt with the very same thing before. Some have done poorly, some have done well. Your job is to figure out what the people who succeeded did to succeed, and you will too.”
So coming here and asking is a good start.
If you can afford an attorney by all means do so. It will be incredibly painful (financially), but you have to consider the long term. I worked with an attorney who called his plan ‘the secret attorney’ where I did all the face work & negotiation (under his guidance) and he drew up papers that withstood a serious legal assault a year later (whole 'nother story - won’t tell right now.)
As for your kids - many children are the products of divorced, hybrid families. They won’t feel a stigma from that like they may have 20, 30 or 40 years ago. You must keep up all the good communications with them and don’t be afraid to speak to them in adult terms, children have the wonderful ability to understand large concepts better than you might believe.
Remind them it’s not their fault, that you love them and you will always be there for them. Keep repeating that. They listen.
Regarding yourself, just remember that even if the situation may seem ‘amicable’ (and I don’t know your situation), protect yourself. Seek guidance and counseling. Things may seem like they are low key but your soon to be ex-spouse may be working to ambush you. I know this from experience.
You will have a life when it is all over, and it will be surprisingly refreshed and fulfilling. You will have new loves, adventures and experiences.
Always remember - you are not alone! Others have gone through exactly what you are going through (it’s a big world out there) and they have THRIVED!
Be one of them!
Good luck and please return with updates. I would be glad to expand my input on any topic. Personally, I’ve been through a lot and I would not mind helping at all.
Sorry you’re going through this, FoieGras.
[mod]Advice threads, esp. advice threads concerning legal and financial matters, plus mental health issues, go in IMHO, so I’ll move this thither. [/mod]
:dubious:
What are you implying?
Anyway, sorry about putting it in the wrong place. And 2gigch1, thank you for your response.
I might type out all the lurid details at some point. I haven’t necessarily comported myself entirely admirably during our separation. I have harassed her via cellphone, mostly because I kept wanting to talk to her and she just wouldn’t answer. But I am past that stage now. I have to stay focused on my boys, and on the fact that I am going to be shooting for primary custody as I am the sole income earner at this point as my soon to be ex can’t seem to keep a job lately.
Okay - good to know. I am heading out to do some chores, I will hit you later with some more ideas.
My advice is the advice that Judge Judy dispenses often: Love your children more than you hate your spouse. They are a product of her just as they are a product of you. When you trash her, you trash them indirectly. So don’t drag them into your pain more than is absolutely necessary.
Don’t invent excuses to talk to her. If there are things that you absolutely need to communicate because it involves your kids, then consolidate them all into one brief phone call or email and resolve to stay on topic.
Hire a lawyer so that you’re not taken to the cleaners, but don’t fight over petty things. Pictures can be copied. Most everything else can be replaced.
Don’t wave a hand at issues and say, “Oh, we’ll work it out.” that might later lead to conflicts. Better to stipulate holiday schedules, pick-up times, summer vacations, etc. for your children in the agreement itself rather than risk fighting about it later.
Oh, and I’d highly advise stipulating that neither of you can move x miles outside of your current residences without the other parent agreeing to it. That is the one stipulation that I’d fight long and hard over.
Other than that, give yourself time to grieve and get to the gym and wear yourself out so that you can sleep.
Good luck to you.
I have never gotten divorced, but my wife has. We have a stepson, so this advice may be useful - always remember that the parenting agreement is *never *final. If you find the situation you agree to regarding the kids unworkable, you can always reopen the parenting agreement.
And good luck.
My divorce was very amicable, so I have no tactical advice for you…
but remember a couple of things:
remember your kids come first
civility goes a long way and acrimony will only make their lives more painful
children don’t have the same perspective and perception as adults…unspoken hostility towards your wife (or vice versa) will have long lasting effects on them, far more than the mere fact of a divorce
money and things are only as important as you let them be, you can always find a way out of a tough situation involving material things. Traumatic emotional and interpersonal relations build psychological scar tissue that will always be there.
tomorrow is a new day, for everyone.
Thanks for the advice guys. And yeah, it hurts. A lot. I should have known this was coming, but I chose to bury my head in the sand. We have been together for 11 years and I am 41 now.
I suppose what I find most hopeless is the prospect of dating again. Its been a long time. I have to keep reminding myself not to try to call her, or that there’s something I can say or do that will change her mind. There isn’t and I shouldn’t want her to…we aren’t meant for each other, and on the surface, I know this, but I can’t help my other feelings either.
That’s a bad idea. A very bad idea. Do not do this.
The year my second divorce was final, I turned 40. I’m now in a very happy and stable relationship. Don’t sweat it.
Also, my mother died when my daddy was 60. He is also now in a very happy and stable relationship (he is 80 now). You’re never too old. 
I will echo the advice of others: No matter how angry you are, or what shenanigans are going on, never, never, NEVER NEVER say one bad word about their mother in front of those kids.
Outside of that, just try to stay calm and keep an “open door” communication policy with your ex. My first ex-husband and I parted on the worst of terms but now, 23 years later, we are very amicable and can chat about anything.
Good luck.
Concur - well, type 'em out if you like, but do NOT post it in any forum - do it for your own reflection if you think it will help. Posting it anywhere - especially while things are underway - could go wrong in a number of ways.
That’s perfectly normal. When you’ve been rejected, you feel unlovable. But you just need to look around you at other divorced people to realize that that notion is just silly. Lots of really fantastic people are divorced because the chemistry simply wasn’t there, or their personalities were incompatible. Or their spouse was a jerk. Take your pick.
Let me also say that my husband at the age of 45 is in almost every way a better catch than he was at 25. I would like 25-year old back again, yes, but age, marriage and fatherhood has done him a world of good: he’s more mellow, more established, more comfortable in his own skin, more wise, more sympathetic, more charitable, he’s learned how to fix more shit…and he’s better looking to boot.
40 is when you start hitting your stride! 
You know, I had a number of people on this board give me the same advice when I was going through my divorce. I’m curious about what the potential harm is. I’m not talking about name-calling and slandering the person you’re splitting up with. I’m talking about simply discussing what actually happened. Does someone have a real-world example of how this has gone wrong?
Back on topic, I wish you the best of luck, FoieGras, and I’m sorry you’re having to go through this process.
Not advice for right now, but for later when the kids are getting married …
Do not make it a me and my wife vs the ex wife and her husband. You are not competing for the ‘best parent’ award at the kids wedding. You have to share the roles normally done solo - 2 fathers can’t take the bride down the aisle, 2 mothers can’t have that front corner pew … 2 fathers can’t have the second waltz with the daughter and 2 mothers can’t have that second waltz with the son.
I was extremely pissed off at my father in law during my sister in laws wedding rehersal … Dad and step monster in law got to sit at the head table during the rehersal dinner, and mrAru and his mother [and I, though I don’t care about me in this, I wasn’t married to him at the time] got barely noticed, and seated at the most remote table in the room … I could see it if dad had custody of her while growing up, but mom had sole custody of the kids while growing up. Nobody bothered toasting the birth mother, Nobody mentioned her at all … nothing like being totally marginalized at your daughters wedding rehersal dinner.
You have to make sure that no matter who gets custody, you need to work together to raise them still. Birthdays, Christmas [or whatever], vacations, graduations, weddings, the birth of grandchildren.
Don’t do this. If the case becomes contested–and if you are going for primary custody, it very well may become contested–anything you post here could be used against you.
Go the “no fault” route if at all possible. In my experience, people are generally happier with an agreement they made themselves than they are with a Judge’s decision. Judges tend to “cut the baby in half” to a certain extent, and sometimes that can be worse than whatever the parties worked out between themselves.
In my state, you can agree to the divorce, but allow the court to decide property division/custody/support/visitation–this saves airing the dirty laundry about the divorce, but much of the same evidence can also be relevant to custody issues.
Think long and hard before sending any sort of message via email, twitter, facebook, text, etc. One quick angry message can put you in a world of shit when it comes up in court.
Most importantly, get counsel. Your own counsel. At least in my state, one lawyer cannot represent both sides in a divorce. You want someone advising you, and looking out for your best interests. Don’t let her hire a lawyer and you go pro se. You will get a much harsher deal that way.
Good luck on getting full custody. Even if she doesn’t have a source of income, that’s what alimony and child support are for and are readily recognized by the court. Not having a job is not a basis for you having sole custogy. Also the courts tend to lean towards the mother with regard to custody. This also depends on what state you live in. Some states are more father friendly.
Do you really want to keep your kids away from their mother? I would recommend that you work towards joint legal and 50/50 physical custody. If you can convince your wife of this then it should be accepted to the court. But if you go off on a fight and you both are fighting for sole custody…I would expect that you would lose.
DEFINITELY GET AN ATTORNEY.
Since you appear to be the sole bread winner, you do realize that you will be paying a substantial portion of your income to your soon to be ex-wife, don’t you?
Again, depending on the jurisdiction, she will be entitled to alimony for a number of years or until she re-marries. She will also be entitled to receive child support for the time she has custody of the kids, normally based upon a state based formula.
Also depending on how long you’ve been married, she’s entitled to half of your assets, including your retirement accounts, if you have them. You should begin taking an inventory of your financial and hard assets if you haven’t done so. These are the things an attorney will give you more detail on.
With regard to dating again. Don’t worry about that now. It will come naturally later. In fact you probably shouldn’t be rushing into new relationships on the eve of a separation. I would advise you to get some counseling to figure out what went wrong in your marriage. Both of you created it and both of you are responsible for it’s destruction. Counseling will also help you deal with your kids in a healthy manner. Counseling will also help you later on when you do decide to date again, to not make the same mistakes the second time.
Best of luck. You will get through it.
Neither of these paragraphs are necessarily true in every state. In my state, the Court has discretion to award alimony in a marriage of long duration. It may be in the form of a lump sum, or periodic payments. It may not be awarded at all. Child support also varies wildly—some states impose child support in pure joint custody scenarios, others do not.
I usually recommend against joint physical custody. This requires a large degree of communication and cooperation between the parents, and doesn’t often work out well over time…usually see problems when one or the other parent finds a new romantic interest. Can work out fine in some circumstances, but not to be done lightly.
Likewise, property division can vary widely. In my state, the Court starts with a presumption that a 50/50 split is appropriate, but retains discretion to adjust the percentage awarded to each party according to the circumstances of the case. Each party is entitled to an equitable distribution of marital assets, but equitable doesn’t always mean 50/50.
This is why you need a lawyer licensed in your jurisdiction, rather than listening to random advice off the internet.
:dubious: Not read much?
Your phrasing was pretty sloppy, and could easily create erroneous impressions. Then again, I’ve only practiced family law for 15 years, so what do I know?