I’ve a short story first, then I’ll close this post with a few questions.
One of my closest friends is certifiably a ladies man, meaning that at his age (25) he has already slept with several different women in addition to the handful of long-term SO’s that he’s already had. The thing is, his standards are definitely lower than mine; although he has also hooked up with a number of very attractive women - his most recent was a 34 year old that he met in a Seattle bar - he has also been with a number of women who (in my mind at least) are resoundingly ugly & wouldn’t be on my radar in any conceivable way. Note, he is also much more driven by his gumption to get laid than I certainly am, so perhaps that has something to do with his standards as well.
Now, in my case, at age 23, I’ve yet to sleep with any woman, nor have I ever had an SO. Yeah, yeah, I know…that’s not as old as some of the other virgin guys on here, & it doesn’t really bother me that much beyond the slight “maybe I should do something about this” feeling. More and more, however, I’m starting to wonder if the reason for my continued lulls could perhaps be attributable to unrealistic standards that I have for the women whom I deem to be attractive.
My buddy has proactively tried to help me out in this regard whenever we go clubbing and stuff, but the women who he pushes me to pursue are generally the girls whom I wouldn’t want anything to do with in conventional times. He has even told me that I should really lower my standards & work up to more attractive women over time.
So, should I do that? Is that good advice? Guys (and gals), how attractive was the first person you had sex with?
If oral counts as sex, fucking hot. He was a boy I dated when I was 17. Most people who met him seemed to agree so I don’t think it was mere subjectivity.
He was dumb as a brick, and really immature, and we lasted 3 months, but I don’t regret it. It was pretty awesome that the first person I experimented with was that smokin’.
That depends on how badly you want to get laid. I think it’s true that you might meet someone you don’t find tremendously attractive and find out you have amazing sexual chemistry and it changes everything. But it’s not really something you can count on when you’re trying to determine if you’ll enjoy a sexual experience. Actually being attracted to that person is a good place to start. I mean honestly, I kind of think it would be sad if you lowered your standards and then had a negative first impression of sex.
I have a tendency to become really super attracted to people with great personalities as I get to know them. I mean, it’s a legitimate sexual attraction though, not like I’m overlooking their appearance. They become attractive to me. And I’m not really the one-night stand type. So depending on the type of person you are, giving people a chance who you might not ordinarily be attracted to might work out well.
I’ve also been in a monogamous relationship for the majority of my adult life so take that FWIW.
Bloody gorgeous. I’m not bragging or anything, it’s just one of those weird facts of the universe. Actually, most of my partners have been ridiculously attractive.
If there’s one thing I’ve learned, though, it is that physical hotness does not necessarily equal a great experience in the sack. The brain is the most important sexual organ. Personality and how compatible you are with someone is more important than a pretty face and nice tits. It’s a holistic thing. A more “attractive” partner is not necessarily (in fact, in my experience, not usually) a step “up”. It’s much more complicated than that.
The best sex I’ve had was with someone who, God bless her, would never have a successful career as a model, and would probably not have been anyone’s first, second or third choice in a lineup of prospective hookups. But, man, she was wonderful. If I had the chance to go back and spend one night with one of my past partners, it would be her, no contest.
Conversely, I’ve been with girls with supermodel looks who were about as interesting in bed as a block of wood. There’s just no correlation there at all, I think.
I can honestly - 100% truthfully - say that I lost my virginity to a Russian model. Stunningly beautiful, buuuut turned out to be crazy. As in, was admitted to a mental hospital about three weeks later.
Anyway, I wouldn’t “lower my standards” if I were you, but rather pursue the ones I genuinely found attractive. As in, walk up to one of them and say something. If she turn you down, accept that and move on. Return to your friends’ table, have another drink, and if another genuinely attractive woman shows up a little bit later and you once again feel like giving it a shot, by all means do so. The trick, I think, is to do it enough times to realise that a “no thanks” from a beautiful woman isn’t the end of the world. Everything becomes easier after that.
To be honest, to take the pragmatic point of view for a moment, I think that there actually is something to be said for “lowering your standards”. Or rather, especially if you’re inexperienced or find talking to attractive women difficult (if the latter, come join us, we have a club), there is something to be said for hooking up with women that you’re not particularly attracted to. You’re likely to be a lot less nervous and awkward around them.
In my case, I realized at some point that there are two categories of women that I should just leave alone: The ones that I’m genuinely repulsed by, and the ones that I’m head over heels about. The former because, well, I should have *some *standards. The latter because I’ll invariably turn into a blithering idiot in their presence, which is not the way to make a good impression or behave in a healthy relationship.
The middle category, the ones that I like just fine, but who don’t cause me to dribble on my shoes or turn into a creepy stalker, is the way to go.
Really, some of my best relationships, both short and longer term, have been with people that I initially wasn’t that crazy about. This is also the category of partners that have liked me the most, and, as far as I can tell, who have the fondest memories of me after those relationships ended. Which is obviously because I was able to behave like a normal person around them. By contrast, the ones who hit all my buttons for attractiveness most likely remember their encounters with me as meeting either a maniac or a half-wit.
Not saying that this applies to your situation. Just a thought, is all.
Have look at what women look like in general, then decide if your “standard” is realistic or if you’re lusting after bikini models in the top 5% of physical attractiveness. Also factor in where you might fit personality and physical attractiveness wise.
I’m guessing you’re at best average and have your standard set at “supermodel”. Maybe not so much a lowering of standards as a reality check and a lessened focus on the physical.
Nobody can tell you whether or not you should lower your standards without knowing what your standards are and what is your own level of attractiveness (in general, not just physically).
Are you ugly, boring, shy, a boor and targeting supermodels? Yes, you should lower your standards.
Could you link to a couple pictures of women you would deem borderline acceptable (less attractive than that and it’s a no go) so that we could have an idea of how high your standards are?
Also, is their satisfying physical appearance the only requirement, or should the supermodel also be bright with a great personnality?
And what are you after, exactly? Are you just annoyed to still be a virgin? Devoured by unsatisfied lust? Feeling terribly alone? Seeking sex? Intimacy and companionship? Love? A one-night stand? No string attached relationships? A potential spouse?
If you are fine with the results that you are getting, that’s fine. But I think there is a good argument for expanding your range of consideration a bit. It’s a big world, with a lot of different types of people, and a lot of those people are a heck of a lot of fun to sleep with (and pick the right 34 year old, and it will be a LOT of fun!).
I think the real problem with high standards come when an average guy won’t look at average girls, but then gets intimidated or otherwise acts weird around the very attractive ladies, eventually ending up in a negative feedback loop that amps up the weirdness and anxiety even more until he ends up so weird he is undateable.
Lowering your standards works for this one, because it can break that anxiety cycle and build confidence.
Another issue is dating the women you feel like you should be dating rather than the ones who really get you. I had a guy friend in a high prestige career who felt he should be dating Ivy League models. But he was at his core a quirky guy who really just wanted to play board games, cook, raise a bunch of kids and be silly and relaxed at home. So he’d date these really driven, high maintenance women, and get really frustrated that they wanted a different lifestyle than the one he values.
Getting over this one is just a matter of self-knowledge and maturity.
There is a lot of middle ground between “brings home basically anyone” and “somehow thinks every girl in a packed club is too ugly to get with.” I would venture a guys that hookups at clubs might not be the best dating model for you. I’d definitely avoid building up too many expectations for the big night- sex with a new partner is rarely that great. It takes a few times to find each other’s groove.
It sounds like you’d be a lot happier in LA. There are people (my Father is one) for whom the foundation of happiness is a life that looks a certain way. It is absolutely incomprehensible to me, but undoubtedly true for him. He does not care how stupid or ignorant his partner is, as long as she is beautiful and meticulously groomed. He does not care what city he is in, or how close he is to family, as long as his house is among the best in the city and there are top of the line golf courses nearby.
So, just make sure your standards are the ones which will lead you to the life you want. If you are looking for a laid-back home life, with comfortable furniture and pancakes on Saturday morning, then supermodels are really not for you.
Likewise, if you want a life filled with companionship and dates every weekend and warm loving encounters, then rejecting women left and right waiting for one in the right package will slow you down considerably.
But if truly, the life for you is one that includes lots of lettuce and kale smoothies, cool colors and minimalist furniture, Bikram classes and evenings spent with irritable hungry women whose shoes are hurting their feet, then you are on the right track. It sounds like hell to me, but I acknowledge that their are people for whom this represents the pinnacle of success and happiness.
Decide what you want, then make sure your “standards” will lead you to it.
Oh, and no matter how beautiful she is, or how much time and effort she puts in to being that way, you should never expect a woman to be flattered when you tell her that you want her for her looks. Best keep that to yourself and try to notice something else about her to compliment.
One other thing, 2ManyTacos- you’re still 23. You’ve got a lot of time ahead of you. Don’t worry too much about being rushed. If you’re desperately wanting, you’re desperately wanting, but (barring a few extreme conditions) it won’t go bad.
Hell, yeah. I did a double take at that part of the OP. 34 is supposed to be “old”? What the heck? That’s less than my age. I guess I might have thought about it differently when I was 23, but now I know a number of 34 year old ladies who I still think of as, well, kids, more or less. Or at least “young people around my own age”. They’re certainly not wrinkly old grannies by any standard.
To answer the title question: not terribly attractive. The first girl I gave/got oral with was pretty average (I mean, I thought she was cute at the time, but hormones had a lot to do with that). The first girl I had PIV sex with was decidedly below average. But I don’t regret it. She was a nice girl overall, plus it gave me the confidence to ask out women I was more interested it. (That girl is now engaged, so it’s not like she was broken up by the process. I wasn’t her first).
For the OP, let me relate to the story of a friend of mine. Now, he’s not a virgin, but he does have ridiculously high standards. High like “asian supermodel with a max-level wow character and doesn’t mind that my apartment smells like feet because I only clean once a month”. He’s had a couple of girlfriends - both of whom were overseas and one he only met in person once. He’s been terminally single for years. I, on the other hand, am happily married with two kids.
“Forever alone” is an internet meme, but it can happen to people that set their sights too high and never readjust.
Ah, Elliot Rodgers of the world… Women are actual human beings, not just physical objects for you to rate and deem worthy or unworthy of your untouched genitalia. Should you attempt to hook up with women you meet in clubs even though you do not find them attractive, then “work your way up” to attractive women? No. Not because you would be “lowering your standards,” but because it is ridiculous and offensive behavior. Try thinking of women as real people first, not animated magazine cutouts and maybe ask someone who you are attracted to out on a date, during which you could potentially get to know and like her personality.
My possibly totally wrong 2 cents (and coming from an aging female who has nothing in common with a 23-year-old male, it almost certainly is off-base):
It sounds to me like your sex drive simply isn’t as supercharged, crazy high as is often the case with young men - if it were, more women would look good to you and you would happily compromise your standards simply for the release/pleasure of getting laid.
This is totally fine - not every single person, male or female, has to have an insanely high, think-with-the-wrong-head type of sex drive. If you feel comfortable being more particular, and it works for you, then you are probably on your way to a solid relationship some day that is based on a lot of other things besides sexual attraction (though I hope sexual attraction does end up being a really big part of your relationship, because sex with the right person is a great part of life).
To answer your question: the first guy I slept with was probably a 6 or 7 out of 10 at the time, when he was 17. (Forty years later - we’re in touch and I have seen recent photos - he has aged well to an 8 or 9.) I was verrrrry horny and genuinely attracted to him intellectually/emotionally, so that was plenty good enough for me.
That’s one explanation for the OP’s situation. Another one is that he is using his “high standards”, consciously or subconsciously, as an excuse not to talk to more girls. Hey, I’ve done it.
Just realized that I didn’t answer the OP’s stated question. He was very attractive for the times, and considered a real catch by our peer group. He was tall and broad-shouldered but thin-ish, very early 80’s chic. I wouldn’t find him attractive at all today though.
He looked a bit like this guy. With a Leif Garrett build.
