Seriously, it’s really starting to elude me. I generally have no trouble attracting men initially, but then they seem to run for the hills after we date briefly . . . anyways, I haven’t really had a relationship in over a year, and I’m beginning to wonder what I’m doing wrong.
I’m really beginning to think the conventional wisdom on the boards is wrong: that openness, honesty, etc is crucial to starting a relationship. Maybe once you’re there, but beforehand? I think it drives men away.
So, so far, from what I can tell, what a woman needs to do to attract guys is
Be as hot as possible
Be vaguely interested, kind of, but not that interested
What else? I’d be particularly interested in hearing the men’s opinions.
Gestalt.
P.S. Sorry if this is totally incoherent; I’m kind of venting/rambling as well.
Being as “hot as possible” as you say might help initially attract someone, but that only goes so far. For me, a long term relationship is based on honesty, trust, and good sexual chemistry. It might sound male-centric to say this, but if you’re not into the same things sexually, a relationship is doomed. Basically, you need someone with a similar interest in sex, similar kinks, whatever. Everything else in a relationship is important too, of course - but without a level playing field in the bedroom, you’ll have trouble hanging on.
I’d say the best advice is to not stress so much about finding “the one.” Just date guys and see what happens. Like Dan Savage says - **“You don’t know if it’s going to work out until it does.” **
If you don’t know Savage, I highly recommend his weekly “Savage Love” newspaper column, and also his weekly podcast. They’re really informative and he always gives great advice on all sorts of issues, including questions like yours.
Attracting and keeping are two different things, as far as I can tell.
From my perspective, attracting involves (for either gender) looking good enough to make it onto the other person’s radar, and being interesting enough for whatever reason, to keep the other person coming back.
Whether that reason is personality or the lure of freaky sex, that’s what keeps them coming back.
Eventually, it’ll become a more serious thing, at which point, keeping them switches to being open, honest, and mature in your dealings with the other person, and hoping that they do the same.
One big thing in keeping someone is developing the ability to argue or fight, without being hateful to them. This generally means no cheap personal shots about how fat they are, how annoying they are, etc… Argue about the behavior in question, and why it bothers you, and ALWAYS propose a reasonable solution. Without a solution, you’re just bitching, and it’ll irritate them. Having a reasonable solution indicates that you’re trying to work with them, not attack them.
That’s my 2 cents; there’s almost certainly more, but I’m having a hard time articulating some of the ideas in my head. I’ll come back later & elaborate more.
Well if you want to keep a man I would disagree with #2.
I’m done with dating just to date. To me it is a waste of my time and money. I already have friends to hang out with. I’m looking for long term relationships now, not actively but if a girl comes along I give it a try, so if after a couple of dates the girl is acting not that really into me then I end it.
Aaah, see, okay, I bought that spiel too, but most guys seem as fast as they can when you say something like, “Can we talk about x situation? Right now I feel like y is happening, and it’s making me uncomfortable/upset/whatever.”
For example, guy that it just ended with. We dated very briefly, and I brought up at some point that I disliked when he lost his temper, but I said it very calmly and rationally. Later, he brought up that he thought that I seemed a little needy, and I said that yes, he had a good point, and if we were to date more seriously, I would work on that, just like I hoped he would work on the quickness-to-anger.
He pretty much immediately broke up with me after that, saying that things were going too fast, and that we shouldn’t talk about changing ourselves for each other at this early stage.
WTF???
This is really starting to frustrate me . . . sorry, but I just also feel a need to vent . . . I’m starting to hate dating.
Big clue right there. You dated “very briefly” and you’re already into nitpicking his behavior and wanting him to change. You barely know him!
Honestly, he made a very good point there that may be your problem. Within the first handful of dates or so, you shouldn’t be telling anyone that they need to change their behavior to suit you. If they’re not right, move on. On the other hand, you might point out that he’s a little quick to anger, but please make sure that you’re not doing this while he’s in that state of anger, or you’re simply throwing gasoline on a fire.
Yikes. Maybe it’s just me, but when I say “be honest and open” I don’t mean “share your every neurotic thought”. I mean don’t lie, and don’t pretend to be something you’re not. Being honest is not the same thing as being uncensored. You’re still allowed to run things through the filter.
And if after dating someone very briefly, you’re turned off by his temper, and he’s turned off by your neediness, break it off immediately, for the love of god. He was smart. Look for someone you LIKE and then have a relationship with him. Don’t try to fit any random guy who comes along into the “Boyfriend” slot.
If you were dating someone briefly and they began losing their temper you don’t need to be that a-hole anyway…Courtship is about learning about one another, usually entails great sex and mad love making and going out to dinner etc…etc…then things calm down and we have a cool off period of hearing the other fart for the first time, learning that your new mate’s breath smells like a dragon in the morning and learning to love every aspect of them from that moment on. That’s what keeping your mate is all about…when you are with them long enough to learn all these things and love the quirkyness anyway!
Aaah! Thanks guys, that was actually very helpful . . . I think that what I mean when I say, “honest and open” and what others mean when they say, “honest and open” are two very different things. I do have trouble with my filter, it’s very true, and so to me, “honest and open” means “share your every neurotic thought.” I need to work on that, although I think I’m getting better. I think I need to keep my criticisms to myself more . . . hmm, such things really are not obvious to me; I think I missed a memo somewhere along the way . . .
My background…I was a complete nerd in high school. College level courses, AP classes, trooping down to the guidance office with the rest of the nerds every nine weeks to check our class rankings.
Ivylad, while smart, was a bit of a partyer. He didn’t really date, so much as sleep around. A lot.
So, I was the complete opposite of the girls he usually went out with…I was smart, didn’t have big boobs, and I wasn’t a slut.
I have to agree that it sounds like you’re trying to go from first date to committed relationship pretty fast. That will scare off most guys. And no guy, ever, in the history of the human race, has ever enjoyed the “We need to talk about something” line. Guys in committed relationships learn to put up with it, but unless the something to talk about is a new sexual position that you want to try in the next ten minutes, it’s going to be Bad News and Very Uncomfortable.
Lighten up, have fun, and the guy will stick around.
It’s OK to admit that there are some things in life that you don’t like, and that some things bother you. That’s a way of connecting. But when your neuroses become a burden on him, or are about him, that’s just no fun at all. That becomes scary.
Keeping a man is a real problem if you want to live in different places.
This includes side issues like wanting to keep the kids in the same town even after job market dries up.
I think that is the main reason for problems when the relationship was normal and sound (no fooling around, drinking, gambling, jail, etc.)
And, that means one of you has to give in to the other every time it comes up.
So, I’d recommend giving in the first time, but asking for assurances that next time it’ll be his turn. Of course, by then you may be ready to move anyway.
I don’t understand this at all. The Formulator may have figured “Well, if the guy is interested, he’ll work harder to make me interested.”, whereas my feeling is “Oh, she’s not interested. Move on to something else. Or someone else.”
Timing can be a significant factor. Part of the essence of dating is to reveal yourself, and learn about your dating partner, at an appropriate pace. There aren’t absolute rules about it, but someone who’s always too quick to get serious can be scary, someone who’s always too slow to commit can be frustrating. It’s important to be genuine, but it’s not necessary - and often counterproductive - to be excessively forthcoming. The relationship needs time to develop, and it needs to develop.
Ideally you’ll see things you like in the other that fuel your interest. As you get to know someone better, you start seeing things you don’t like so much, and assess how important they are relevant to the good things. If and when the point comes that the negatives outweight the positives (and this is often the case, otherwise we’d all marry the first person we liked), it’s time to move on.
You didn’t mention your age. The advice we’d give to a 13-year-old is different from what we’d say to a 53-year-old.
Also, I’m not clear (and maybe you aren’t either) about what you want—both what kind of guy and what kind of relationship. The wrong approach is to first “attract a guy,” any guy, and then work on turning him into exactly what you want in a guy.
