Just curious, because your horseshit in this thread makes me doubt your reading comprehension.
You think that “like you had a shot at them” is a personal insult? It’s not. It wasn’t intended to be. I said it wasn’t intended to be. You still think it is. You’re wrong. But hey, fine, if you and/or Blue want to interpret it that way, nothing I can do to stop you. Of course, if there were a stupid smilie stuck on the end of it, it wouldn’t have raised an eyebrow.
Then you come back and claim that my saying that an idea is insulting is a personal attack? What the fuck? I criticised the idea that it seemed to me that she was expressing. I said that the [i[idea* was nasty, not that the person apparently expressing it was. If my saying that her idea was nasty is worthy of your blowing your little whistle, then Blue’s calling my response “nasty” was too. Nice double standard.
If Blue’s feelings were in any way hurt by my saying that she was probably not in line to be the next squeeze of any of the Grey’s Anatomy stars (which was a reference to the unlikelihood of her ever meeting any of them), then I’m metaphorically down on my knees begging forgiveness. But your claiming that my second statement was a “personal comment,” let alone an insult, is total bullshit.
I eagerly await your 10,000th variation on “I get another point in the Mod pitting contest” response.
So I’m at this club tonight and this guy comes up to me and starts hitting on me. I politely told him that I was very flattered but I didn’t like guys. He said that that was a pity so I beat the ever loving shit out of him for smearing the heterosexual community.
I generally think Dex blows, but even a blind squirel finds a nut every once in awhile. You sounded like a dick initially and when that was pointed out to you you acted like more of a dick. Good on ya. And now you start this pit thread. Exquisite. Good day for a flameback*.
*Do we have a term for a pitting in which the OP is disagreed with by pretty much everyone and soundly mocked? If not may I suggest my term?
Generally speaking, when I insult someone by accident, I apologize. Maybe that’s just me.
Could you explain it to me? Because that seems a pretty harmless comment to me. People say the same thing when a hot celebrity gets married. I don’t think that makes it insulting to married people.
Generally speaking I don’t apologize when people go out of their way to look for insults when none are intended.
Because saying that it’s a shame that someone’s gay carries with it, in my mind, the idea that the person saying it thinks there’s something wrong with being gay. LB says she didn’t mean her remark to have that connotation (although she didn’t apologize about possibly hurting my feelings) and I accept that at face value. It would be nice if my saying that I meant no insult were also taken at face value, but it wasn’t, by her or by Dex. It is a double standard and it’s bullshit. And that she can call my remark “nasty” and not be admonished for it while my calling what I perceived as her idea nasty gets busted is also a double standard and is also bullshit.
At my wedding, my wife’s friend commented that one table had all the cute guys, and when pointed out that all the guys at this table were gay, she said exactly the same thing. Hell, one of the guys at the table had said that about me, when he found out that I wasn’t.
Otto, you made a comment about LavenderBlue, the poster. Whether you intended it to be amusing is irrelevant: it was easily interpreted as insulting, and when it was reported to me, I agreed with that interpretation. There is no need, in a discussion about an actor, to make comments about another poster. By doing so, you crossed the line.
She said that your comment was nasty, and it was. She did not say that YOU were nasty. There is a difference between making remarks about a person and responding to what a person says. She very carefully did NOT cross the line.
If you choose to interpret her comment as insulting to gay male actors, that’s your privilege, I suppose, but even so, it’s not a personal insult directed at you or at any other poster. The rules do not forbid any insulting remarks, they forbid insults or personal statements directed **at another poster. ** You can insult the actors, the writers, the artists, whatever, all you want. There is a difference.
I don’t know whether ** LavenderBlue**'s statement was truly insulting to gay male actors; I don’t think it was. People here comparing the statement to “Too bad he’s married” are very to the point. I can see that either view is arguable. But, regardless, the forum rules do not prohibit insulting actors. So, frankly, it is completely irrelevant (from a Moderating perspective) whether Lavender’s statement was insulting to T R Knight.
Just to be clear: Insulting the actors is permitted. Insulting other posters is not.
I guess it does raise the question of what it means to be “insulting.” You find her comment, directed at an actor who is not you, to be insulting. I think that’s a different use of the word “insulting.” You’re using “insulting” to mean “offensive,” but that’s not the spirit of the rules. You are not being directly insulted. If you think you are a member of the group of good-looking gay male actors, I suppose you could take the comment personally; we’ve had the question before, whether insulting a group is a hidden way to insult an individual poster. In this case, her comments preceded yours, so even if you are a good-looking gay male actor, it’s hard to read her comments as a personal insult directed at you.
Trying to eliminate any language that anyone finds “insulting” or offensive is impractical and would lead to sterility. I find it insulting that you don’t like science fiction. You find it insulting that I like classical music. And so on. How do we have discussion?
I also call everyone’s attention to the fact that we have amended the rule (your incident was one in a series, the proposed amendment was put up to the mods several weeks ago, but I didn’t get around to implementing until your comments pushed me.) This is not a change, this is the way the rule on not insulting other posters has always been interpreted, but we wanted to be clear. The idea is that comments about the other posters in Cafe Society are not good manners. “You’re not hot” was always out-of-bounds as a comment in Cafe Society; the revision makes it clear that “You are hot” is equally out-of-bounds. The discussion should be about the art, entertainment, sport, whatever and not about other posters.
And, by the way, once a Moderator has asked you to cease and desist, you should do so… and carry on any protest in email or in the Pit. An occasional rules violation is no big deal; persistent and repetitive violations of the same rule, after explicit Moderator warning, IS a much bigger deal.
You were admonished for saying that she is “not hot enough.” You attacked her. She was not admonished for saying that your remarks were nasty. She was responding to your statements, not to you. If she had said that you were nasty, she would have been warned off as well.
Again, there is a diff between attacking the poster and attacking what the poster says. The former is prohibited in Cafe Society; the latter is not.
And then I said that an idea she possibly expressed was nasty and you called that a personal attack. So it’s all right to say that what a person posts is nasty but it’s not all right to say that an idea the person thinks is nasty? When exactly in the transition from thought to action does it become all right to call someone else’s thoughts nasty?
No, actually, I’m using the word “insulting” to mean, you know, "insulting. If I had meant “offensive” I would have said “offensive.”
Bullshit. Post exactly where I said the quote you’ve attributed to me. As I’ve explained at least three times now, my comment was about the unlikelhood that she would ever meet any of the actors from Grey’s Anatomy. Quit trying to be a mind-reader because you suck at it.
And yet, in your post, you cited my saying that an idea is nasty as a “personal comment.” It’s fucking ridiculous that saying a comment is nasty is OK but saying an idea is nasty is an actionable “personal comment.” What sort of instrument does one use to split a hair that fine? Because I can’t say as I see a lot of difference between the supposedly actionable “your idea is nasty” and the supposedly non-actionable “your [idea that you typed up and put in a] post is nasty.”
Otta, you sounded like an utter dick. As many other people have said, her comment clearly had nothing to do with negative feelings toward gay people. I’m so glad to see that you’re completely ignoring all of those arguments.
Otto, one more from the peanut gallery telling you that you were a dick.
There is no difference other than the actual words between me saying that a guy is perfect for me, too bad he’s gay and me saying that a guy is perfect for me, too bad I’m married.
When I whine that a person is unavailable to me for any reason at all, that is not offensive. Offensive would be if someone said something liek ‘he just hasn’t met the right woman yet’, or ‘I could turn him straight’; there is nothing offensive about ‘too bad I’ve been left out of the running to get in his pants.’
I’m not ignoring it. I’m saying that it’s irrelevant. A smoke screen. Unrelated to my argument. The what of what either of us said to inspire the other to call it “nasty” is immaterial. She could’ve said “Monkeys are cute” and I could’ve said “I like mangoes” and if the rest of the exchange was the same I’d have the same reaction. The pitting is about the double standard, not the perceived insult to gay actors.
Oh, my comment was mostly unrelated to your argument. I just wanted to tell you, in an appropriate place, that I thought you were acting astoundingly assholish. Therefore, if your point involves a complain about being warned, I am unsympathetic - you were a jerk. LavenderBlue was not.
As I’ve said already, I accept LB’s statement at face value that she did not mean to be insulting. Dex also accepted her statement at face value. He did not accept my statement at face value that I did not mean to be insulting. Double standard, and his “you can say a post is nasty but you can’t say an idea is nasty” is ludicrous hair splitting.
Was your change from “poster” to “post” in this comment inadvertant?
There is a difference between a comment about a poster and a comment about a post and that rule has been consistently held in every Forum except the Pit for many years.
I really try to stay out the pit because it’s generally not my style. But I’m going to reluctantly respond.
Otto, all I did was initially write
That is NOT an insult to gays.
I then wrote (after another poster asked how it felt to learn Isiah Washington might be a homophobe),
I made an innocuous comment. You took that as an occasion to make a nasty and unwarranted mean spirited comment about me by writing:
That was a completely undeserved personal attack. You then said it,
BULLSHIT. Of course it was. Anyone with basic reading comprehensive skills would understand that.
After I wrote:
You then wrote:
Again I call BULLSHIT. That is not what I wrote. Your implication was that I am a homophobe. As others have stated on this thread that’s ludicrous. You lobbed a nasty personal insult to me, absurdly twisted my words to make them seem homophobic and then continued to lob more insults.
Jeez just admit you were wrong initially and move on.
FTR, I am a very much a supporter of gay rights. I will not vote for homophobic candidates. I support the right to gay marriage. Heck I’ve marched in gay pride parades just for the thrill of annoying the religious right. I have gay friends and two first cousins who are gay.
I used to teach. I cannot tell you how awful I felt when I had obviously gay kids in my class and the insults would start flying. During the three years I taught I never heard any anti-Semitic comments or racist comments. I always heard rotten anti-gay slurs. Having witnessed the effects of that kind of behavior firsthand I hate, hate, HATE homophobes. So the last thing I would ever do is is be one.
Like everyone else I would also never get insulted if a gay guy said it was a pity a straight man wasn’t gay.
I reported the post because I thought you were acting like a jerk. And you’re still acting like one now. Neither C.K. Dexter Haven nor myself deserves to be pitted because you got offended at clearly harmless comments.
Having witnessed the effects of that kind of behavior firsthand I hate, hate, HATE homophobes. So the last thing I would ever do is is be one.