Hey hauss, suck it up, chickenshit

The BBQ Pit
1

I am not sure that I’ve every pitted anyone like this before, but in this case it’s well deserved.

First here, then here, in a quickly closed redundant thread, hauss is trying desperately to weasel out of the responsibility he has because he knocked up his girlfriend. It’s a fascinating read, and if this is any example, hauss is a real piece of work. No matter how many time people tell him that he is responsible for the result of his orgasm, he doesn’t want to hear it.
"Couldn’t I go crazy? Become a criminal? Run away?’

NO
Here’s the skinny, shitface. YOU chose to have sex, YOU accepted the inherent risks involved, and now that she’s pregnant, YOU have to support YOUR child.

Period.

End of discussion.

All of your craven whining, childish bitching and disgusting weaseling means nothing. This is a child, a new human being, who needs a father, not a sperm donor. Hopefully someday your ex-girlfriend will find someone to be that father. Meanwhile, you’ve proven to all of us that even though you can fuck, you are in no way, shape or form anything resembling a man. Fuck you. You make me ashamed to have a penis.

2

There are some people who believe that as long as women have the option of an abortion thus absolving themselves of motherhood, men should have the option of a ‘legal abortion’ to absolve themselves of fatherhood.

That is obviously not the case under the law now, but in my opinion and the opinion of others, it should be. Nobody should be forced to be a parent, financially or otherwise, against their will.

And if you argue that it’s a man’s responsibility to care for a child because he chose to have sex, does that mean you’re also opposed to abortion because it’s a woman’s responsibility to care for a child if she chose to have sex?

3

Nice one, Dave. For once, I agree with you, hands down.

Pay your bills, shitface. It’s assholes like you that make it doubly harder for the men out there who actually do pay their child support, or who have run into hard luck. These guys who are generally good guys get rammed up the ass and are handed down absolutely no sympathy whatsoever because a much smaller population of men thinks it’s ok to weasel out of support.

Sam

4

Sorry, it’s not against his will unless he was raped. Sex causes pregnancy… even with various methods of birth control, pregnancy sometimes happens. If he didn’t want to be a father, he should have abstained from actions that could lead to him becoming one.

I argue that it’s up to the woman whether she has an abortion or not. If she is pro choice, she can decide herself. If she’s pro life… I’m not about to try to tell her she has to abort the fetus she’s carrying, making her feel like a murderer within her own mind.

5

Then why isn’t it up to the man?

If a woman can kill a fetus - and I’m all for abortion, but let’s make no bones - why can’t a man decide the much smaller thing of simply not wanting the child?

6

I have to say, I’m with catsix.

Obviously, ideally, nobody should have sex if they aren’t prepared to deal with the consequences, and at very least should ensure that both partners are on the same page before having sex.

But if they don’t, which is too often the case, it doesn’t seem right that a woman has multiple choices and a man has absolutely none, when they did the very same deed and made the same decisions to get there.

That said, however, the fact is that the way the law works right now a man is on the hook and should factor that into his decision to have sex, and be prepared to deal with the consequences as they are now.

And on preview, to Who_me? Whether a woman has sex willingly or not, she has several choices after the fact to deal with the consequences, why is it not only fair for men to have equal opportunities?

And I certainly agree that nobody should be able to force a woman into an abortion, but it seems awfully sad that a woman can, in effect, force a man into one. Do you think the father of an aborted fetus feels no pain? It might not be comparable, but I argue that it is not inexistant.

I’m just saying, a man and a woman can both consciously decide to have sex, fully aware of the consequences, but in the case of a pregnancy, she can decide whether to deprive the man of fatherhood or force him into it, while he has absolutely no rights whatsoever in that decision. Sad.

And on preview again: ** Anaamika**, well said.

7

If the woman wants to abort but the guy doesn’t, but what about the other way?

Pretty interesting question.

I guess the dude is SOL

8

I think it’s everyone’s responsibility to accept the forseeable outcomes of their actions. Mabye it’s not fair that a man has to shell out for 18 years for a baby he wanted to abort. But it’s also not fair that a woman has to either shell out for a pregnancy or an abortion, and that she’s the one taking all the physical risks no matter which path she chooses. But neither side gets to whine about it, because they both knew the score going in. He knew that her deciding to keep a baby he didn’t want and him paying child support was a very real possibility, and he took off his pants anyway. By doing so, he accepted the risks as they currently stand, and so he has to accept responsibility for the consequences.

9

They do. It’s called a vasectomy.

10

The problem I see with giving a man a legal way out is that it will be abused all to hell and back. Maybe if there is a financial reason like simply being unable to afford child support, but even that’s shaky. I just think that there is too much of a slippery slope issue with letting men opt out.

As for hauss, his threads give me very little to view as positive about him. He needs to quit looking for a way out and just pay his dues. :mad:

11

Yeah, it’s not fair, strictly speaking. Biology has rendered this an inherently asymmetric situation, so it can’t ever be perfectly fair. However, I think the current situation is about as close to fair as we can get.

In our current situation, the woman controls the decision of whether or not to keep the baby, but still bears most of the burden. If the guy skips out, she has to raise the child single-handedly. That is a tough, tough life. And unless he’s well-off, odds are his child support are not going to cover most of the costs associated with the child. So it sucks for both people, but it’s about as good as we can do for the child, apart from more and better sex education (i.e. none of that useless abstinence-only crap) to keep people from getting into this situation in the first place.

12

No, that’s not what she’s saying. Getting a vasectomy doesn’t absolve a man of his fatherhood duties to children already conceived.

13

That’s the thing. It seems to me that if we did things this way men would be walking out on women constantly, without a backward glance. This is one of the reasons I’m pro-life–the idea that a man can tell a woman “have an abortion, and if you don’t, I will never help you two out and will never be involved in the baby’s life” seems to take away the whole choice thing anyway–women who have them are already feeling desperate and hopeless, so why take away the legal recourse they have for their men to do the right thing?

I am aware that Anaamika is of Indian heritage, and I also know that it is acceptable there for even a married woman to routinely abort female children; but it is not taken so lightly here. I would be surprised if even in India it would be all right for a man to walk into a courtroom and ask for a divorce without child support because his wife was refusing to abort their daughter, but that would be the end result of what she is suggesting.

Most men should be in relationships where there is no question that they will support any children that result. That is one of the main reasons why almost all cultures have marriage. Those who choose to exercise the sexual privileges of marriage without the ceremony have that right, but in so choosing they have to deal with the results. Hauss is asking us to help evade his, and the OP in this thead is rightly calling him out for it.

14

The problem with your reasoning is that in the case of abortion, there is not a living breathing child whose needs must be met for the next 18 years. If a father is given the option to “opt out” of fatherhood, who do you think takes up the slack? In most cases, it’s the taxpayers, in the form of welfare, food stamps, and other social programs. So by the father opting for a “legal adoption”, the REST of us have to pay for his mistake. That’s not fair, either.

I do hear what you’re saying, and I do sympathize for guys in hauss’s position. It AIN’T fair that a woman really has the final say on whether or not a child is brought to term. But we can’t change biology. If a guy is that much against an unplanned pregnancy, he really needs to avoid intercourse or protect himself by always, always, always using a condom. No, they’re not fullproof - but used correctly, they’re pretty damn good at preventing pregnancy.

15

She was obviously discussing a retroactive vasectomy.

16

**hauss ** makes me ashamed *he * has a penis. I’m still OK with mine.

17

I didn’t read it that way. Seems to me that catsix was suggesting there be a legal mechanism in place which would have the same effect as an abortion, for men; i.e., terminating their parental rights and obligations. I could be wrong, though. Wouldn’t be the first time.

18

I get really tired of this sort of argument, I admit.

Look, it’s one of the inherent imbalances of society that women get to choose whether or not to abort a fetus. This implies, and is known ahead of time, that any man putting his weenie in there is giving up a certain measure of control over his life should his number come up in the ‘daddy’ lottery.

And I see no way to correct his imbalance. Suppose one DID give a right to ‘legal abortion’ (or whatever you want to call it). Think of the imbalance that could cause…

A couple has sex. Whoopee!
Pregnancy occurs. Whoops!
Woman wants baby.
Man does not.
Together the couple has enough dough to raise a child. Individually the woman does not.
Man ‘divorces’ baby thereby forcing mother to abort even though she didn’t desire it.

So it sucks either way.

And face it, guys…if we want to play the ‘societal injustice’ game we, as men, are WAY the hell ahead of women. No glass ceiling, no ‘mommy track’, no time limit for ferility, etc.

For Christ’s sake…suck it up.

19

Great post Giraffe, and I completely agree. The “keep it in your pants” crowd is no different than the “keep you legs together” crowd from 50 years ago. A person has sex, a pregnancy ensues, and you’re told Tough Shit, deal with it.

It’s a crappy thing to say to a person, even if it’s the best option available, it still sucks, and you shouldn’t act like it’s just A-OK.

20

I wanted to point out that I agree with this position. I don’t agree with catsix, but I wanted to clarify an apparent misunderstanding.

But, to be fair to ]b]hauss**, I can see him being young and scared. He’s probably a bit panicked and not thinking clearly. That his first instinct was to run is not completely surprising, and it doesn’t necessarily make him less of a man that he felt that way. It’s what he does, now that he’s had time to consider things, that will measure him as a man.