This may better be in another forum, but here is the problem facing our local chess club. We meet on Wednsday evenings at a church, which has kindly allowed us to use its facilities. The pastor is a member. Unfortunately, there is an individual who has some kind of problem, a personality disorder, or something. He is rude, swears, and has threatened fisticuffs. He has never done any of that to me, but I’ve always found him obnoxious because he will walk in, walk over to my game, and start kibitzing while I and my partner are playing. Many times he has obviously not looked into the position with any depth and still makes recommended moves, etc. Whether or not he is right is not the point. (He usually isn’t.) I’ve always resented that. Now, I’ve found out that the church is fearful of liability and wants to ban him or our club.
We could, of course, just refund his dues and kick him off the club. Is that the right thing to do? I’m all for that, but, hey, it’s not his fault that he is a mental case. Any ideas?
This may sound harsh, but I know for a fact that being a mental case doesn’t mean that you cannot LEARN new lessons, or even how to behave. But verbal reprimands seldom works. So, in some particular cases, corporal punishment - i.e., a good asskicking - is a great teacher.
It worked with a similar basket case where I live. He was a naggin’ pain for years, till the day he messed up with the wrong person. A good beating and SHAZAM!, today he ALMOST behaves in a civilized way. Try to think of a mental case as a grown-up child and you’ll feel less guilty about punching his lights out. They beat children, don’t they? So there.
Of course we’ve asked him to behave. And we can’t punch him out. We’re civilized adults. Besides, then we would be liable for assault and battery. The Pres. wants to pro rate his dues and kick him out and asked me for my opinion. I’m of the opinion that if we kick him out (which, apparently we must do), we should refund his entire year’s dues. This is not a matter of life or death, or a job or not, but chess is important to me and I’m sure to him.
I didn’t mean to imply that chess wasn’t important – I was thinking more about the legal ramifications of denying something to a handicapped individual.
I’d give him back his entire dues payment, just to keep from having to deal with him anymore.
Gee. Lawyers REALLY did turned American in a Nation of Wussies. Here in Brazil, well… we’re not exactly the Paradise, but at least we’re not so PC-obsessed. Here, butts are kicked everytime, lotsa people get hurt and no one fears The Strong Arm of the Law.
Lawyers? Heck, we beat em senseless too! And THEY don’t sue! HAHA!
Seriously, now: it the guy is a mental case, as in retarded, the wrong thing to do is patronize him. He HAS to learn to live in a normal society. And if a beating helps, so be it. It worked here, and worked pretty fine. As I said, some mental cases are just overgrown children - and children are usually beaten into respect. That’s NOT child abuse; it’s teaching.
Have you tried…
{Excuse me, Your behaviour is obnoxious and unappreciated. Perhaps it is our fault for not being firm in our request for playing by the rules so I will explain this to you in the simplest language possible.
If you do {insert objectionable behavior]again,
we will not allow you to continue to play with us.
Ok? Is there any part of this conversation that you do not understand? Good.
Consider this your first and only warning. }
Some people just like to push boundries. When they cross one line, others just draw another line. Let this person know exactly what is expected of him and if he still will not cooperate, refund his money pro-rated and tell him to hit the road.
Tell him to stop messing with The Sicilian before you shove your dragon variation right up his queen side. If he’s willing to accept your gambit, then en passant your piece, and get a little capablanca on his ass. Control his center, wait until you’ve got a tempo, and lay the smack down on him with your knights of fury.
After all that, he too will be searching for Bobby Fischer.
Mermaid, you have a good idea there. I don’t know if that was said to him in those words. Actually, I haven’t been able to make the last few meetings so I don’t know exactly what transpired at the last meeting to make the Pres and the Pastor so incensed, except what they told me. I will mention that to the Pres.
As to the last reply, we have to stop horsing around because this guy has really been rooking us. If he messes with our Sicilian, we’ll get the Mafia after him.
In case you are interested and don’t know by now, Kraminik is the new world’s champ, defeating Kasparov in 16 games, winning 2 and drawing 14.
Based on the very little informatio provided about this guy, I am going to give you my arm chair quarter back prognosis.
**He is rude,swears, and has threatened fisticuffs. He has never done any of that to me, but I’ve always found him obnoxious **
First thing I thought of was Turret’s Syndrome. If it is this, he cannot help the outbursts. ( Turret’s is a mental mis-wiring of the brain, usually found in males, where it caused the person to have verbal outbursts -sometimes swearing- other times just weird phrases, that the person cannot control. They also usually have strange facial ticks and can make odd noises (grunting, snorting) that can be disconcerting. )
Just a thought.
If it is something different than that, perhaps just ignoring him would help. Or perhaps he is very lonely and tries to hide it by being severly obnoxious, sort of a defense mechanism. Maybe the lot of you can take turns playing a game with him a night. Sort of a round robin:
" Today I will play with Obnoxious Guy, then next
Wednesday it’s matt’s turn, then Alfred…" Giving this guy a wide variety and everyone sharing the burden. Maybe he isn’t so bad after all. Just rough around the edges regarding society rules.
If things don’t improve, then instead of singling this guy out , state the club rules or guidelines aloud for all the members to hear. (It’s been awhile since we’ve discussed this, but this is as good as time as any to review the club rules.")Maybe this will help him get the hint without anyone in particular having to do the dirty work of advising him face to face.
Good Luck!
It’s spelled Tourette’s, Shirley, and it’s what I have. No swearing or outbursts; just a constant twitching and sniffing that has alienated manny people over the years. Not to mention the awkward moments when guys think I’m making eyes at them, or when my elbow goes out and hits someone. People who met me at the ScuzzyDash meetings may have noticed, or you may be unjudgemental people who weren’t scanning me for flaws.
Anyway, I think it would be a good idea to approach this guy and discuss the situation. Tell him diplomatically that his actions are disrupting the group. Don’t order him to stop, or to leave, just tell him that he’s making himself unwelcome, and give him a chance to tell his side.
In other words, don’t be like that girl in high school. I hadn’t been diagnosed yet, so I couldn’t defend myself on that ground, and most people just yelled “Spaz”. She was annoyed with my tics, as many people are, but she took it as a personal threat. One day, without warning, she blew up and ranted at me for literally ten minutes, not giving me a chance to speak for myself. Other students were there, and none of them said, “Okay, Char, you’ve made your point.” A goddamn teacher was there, and she didn’t say, “Char, back off or I’ll write you up.” I think she (the teacher) thought I deserved this, like how else would I learn? Finally, she snarled, “It really pisses me off!” and flounced out of the room. Her best mate reassured me, “Oh, she’ll get over it!” I never exchanged words with her again.
God, I shouldn’t have gotten into this. This is what I mean when I say other people have made me feel worthless. I wasn’t as good as other people. I was a nuisance, an annoyance, “Oh, no, not Rilchiam!”. And anyone could say or do anything they wanted to me, because Rilchiam had no one on her side; picking on Rilchiam wasn’t the same as picking on a person.
My hands are shaking, so I’ll end this by saying, Please don’t make this guy feel like judgement has already been made. Don’t make him feel ganged up on and cast from society. Whatever his problem is, that would be certain to make it worse.
No, it’s not Tourette’s. There’s a misconception about Tourette’s; people usually thing that this mental condition caused the person to swear. It’s not exactly like that. There’s swearing in some cases, but the most visible symptoms of Tourette’s are a series of nervous tics and sudden, involuntary, and seemingly agressive limb movements.
But the fact is that people with Tourette’s Syndrome are perfectly sane (by social standards) and able to perform any task. There’s even a famous heart surgeon that suffers from Tourette’s, but it’s widely acclaimed as a genius in the field - and he even performs surgery on others. So no, Tourette’s doesn’t make anybody antisocial or retarded. Try to imagine Tourette’s as a variation of Parkinson’s disease (it’s not, but that’s an easiest image to visualize).
Rilchiam, the fact that you suffer from Tourette’s doesn’t mean that you’re a freak. You’re not, and don’t let ANYBODY say that you are, cause they are SO wrong.
Thank you, smartt. Actually, if I’d known earlier that Tourette’s was what I had, it might have been easier. If people get used to someone who’s Different at a young age, they can be accepted as The Kid With a Leg Brace, or whatever. The kid in my elementary with diabetes was actually the focus of some envy; our naive minds thought it would be cool to be able to say “My blood’s low” and get out of class for five or ten minutes. The problem was people who thought I was purposely being annoying, or too self-centered to know how I came off, or who just rejoiced that they’d found an easy target. There was one guy in 8th grade who watched me in the cafeteria and did everything I did a second after I did it. And best of all, the people who thought they could coach or nag me into changing. If peopple had known I couldn’t help it, at least those people would have backed off.
There’s a friend of mine who’s full of nervous tics. He was never diagnosed as having Tourette’s, but that’s what I think he have (and so does he).
Fact is, he may have an odd behaviour sometimes. He blinks all the time, and sometimes he just stops in the middle of a sentence to make weird gestures. But he’s also smart as hell, has a really sharp sense of humour, and a heart so good and generous it’s impossible to dislike him.
You can hate the disease (and by “hating” I mean, hope that science finds a cure or a nice treatment) but love the person. All you need is an open mind.