I Created A Monster

The BBQ Pit
201

I’m curious - have you thought about telling him that this semester he can’t go to school. He has to repay you. He can live with his father in the meantime, but schools not an option until he repays you.

I’m assuming that either you or his father are paying for his school here.

That way, all semester he has to think about what he’s done and all semester he will be working full time to repay what he stole. Additionally, one semester isn’t going to actually hurt his academic career, but I think he will feel more of the gravity if his life is actually ‘put on hold’.

202

Foxy40, we’ve been riding your ass pretty hard in this thread. It does seem that you’re taking some steps at least; whether they are enough for your situation is hard to say from across the Internet. The essential things to remember are that your son realizes you are rightly pissed off at him, that he does need to make things right, that you won’t bail him out of problems he caused, that you do still love him, and that your primary job is not to be his buddy but to teach him how to be a member of society. It’s rather late now, but you can still steer him away from being a career criminal.

203

Someone who is only concerned with whether they think they will get caught will try to cheat the system if they think they can get away with it. Witness Ken Lay and Scooter Libby, for instance. Many people are like this, albeit not to that extreme. Ideally, a person will do the right thing because it is right, not because it is expected.

204

How can things like that work, though? He’s a legal adult. He can go to school if he wants to. What’s to stop him? I mean, unless he doesn’t realize he’s an adult or something.

205

I was under the assumption that she was paying for his education, although I admit I may have missed her saying something to the contrary earlier in the thread. If I’m right, though, it would be a simple matter of cutting off his funding.

206

I’m… flabbergasted. I really must say that, amidst all the hand-wringing and excuse-making, it never dawned on me for an instant that there was any notion of actually paying his way. That’s exactly the lesson he doesn’t get — that money is something of value, representing his parent’s labor.

207

You are correct - if he’s paying for his education. I don’t think this is the case though.

All she has to do is tell him that she’s not paying this semester.

208

I do it. I only make $10 an hour (not a lot, but not bad for a college student-- I have friends that work food service that make $11 and $12 an hour), but I pay my rent and bills all on my own, all while going to school full time. I have plenty of friends that do the same.

I assure you that if you are raised understanding the value of money , you tough it out and work while going to school. Plus, I enjoy having stuff like purses, shoes, and movies, so that’s another reason I work my tail off. Why? Because if I didn’t work, my dad sure as hell would never hand me over $100 to go buy some new jeans.

209

That would probably help quite a bit with the cash flow for paying off the credit cards, too.

210

I did it too, and I (usually) made minimum wage or not much more. (This was in the mid-80s.) Granted, I had a scholarship, but it was only partial (and I earned it fair and square, thank you National Merit), and my mom sure didn’t have much to give me. I did take out some student loans also (probably co-signed, but I paid them all off myself.) Granted, I either lived in the dorms or shared a house with a bunch of roommates, but with the exception of $20 from my mom now and then, I paid my entire way through college.

211

Also, it will effect his future; ie, every semester that the cash isn’t returned is another semester that he has to wait.

Granted he shouldn’t expect her to pay for his college anyway - but if she’s going to, I think she should delay it until she’s paid back.

I remember when I was in sixth grade and I brought home a report card that had a ‘d’ or an ‘f’ on it and I was all sullen when she got upset. She then cleared her face and said something to the effect of ‘you know what, go ahead, get bad grades, it’s your life that’s getting screwed up, not mine’.

The way she said it was important, but it was the first time that I realized that my goofying off was going to effect ME. I got my act together quickly after that.

212

The only reason I’m not on the “call the cops” bandwagon here is because that could backfire and teach him how to become a criminal on a larger scale.

It’s pretty obvious that you don’t want your son to pay any life altering consequences despite the severity of the theft. But you have got to draw a line here. Telling him you won’t pay for school until you are repaid would be excellent. If he’s paying for his own education, more power to him, but if you are paying you shouldn’t continue to do so unless you have already been paid back for the life lesson tuition he owes you.

213

I don’t have anything to say about what he’s done that hasn’t been said already, but what stood out to me was you saying you didn’t want to ruin his chance at schooling.

I’m only a few years older than your son, and when I was 18 I started going to college. I was fucking up royally, though; it was so different from high school and I had to be so much more responsible that I just didn’t have the mindset to succeed yet. You said he changed after he started college, right? Maybe he needs to grow up first.

Right now I’m on my own, working full time, and I’ll go back to school when I can get financial aid without my parents’ income being considered and without them helping me at all. I needed to just grow the fuck up and be an adult for a while.

I tell ya, now that I’m out on my own, I’ll really care and appreciate what I’ll learn when I go back to school. It’ll actually matter, whereas when I was 18 I just didn’t get it. I couldn’t see what the big deal was when I was screwing up, but I do now.

ETA: I totally forgot what I originally wanted to say, which is that this isn’t the only chance he has to be in college. People go back to school in their late 20s, their 30s, 40s, 50s… it isn’t some small window in time that folks can go. Honestly, the older groups that I saw when I was in college were the ones that made more of an effort and cared more about learning, while the young pups just goofed around, wasting money.

214

Overall, I think you’re doing an okay job of balancing the need to discipline this guy against the hope for redemption. Not the same choices I might make, but it’s a rough decision.

However, I’m a little concerned about your “I can’t mess up his dental school” attitude. He can’t be more than a year into college - neither you nor he know what his capabilities or interests will be by time he graduates. What makes you think that he will want to go to dental school? What makes you think he’ll get the grades and extracaricullars that will get him in? Or was this your goal for him? Do you often decide how his life should run years ahead of time?

Besides which, not being able to go to dental school leaves about 100,000 lucrative and financially rewarding job paths still available.

215

Your daughter is the younger child right? Now is the time to make sure you don’t create two monsters. Make sure your daughter learns the life skills that your son missed out on before she turns eighteen. If you’ve been spoiling her, and decide to stop, let her know she isn’t being punished for her brother’s mistakes.

I would pack him up, drop him off with his father and change the locks. Your other child will be watching this, and shoud see both the consequences of stealing, and how to properly respond when someone takes advantage of you.

216

I would say:

  1. You go with your father or
  2. I call the police on your ass.
217

Hmm. Please know that there is more than one way to address this problem–as has been said, perhaps your solution is not the one that some here would take, but it is valid.

I like what was said about goals. Have you ever sat down with him and asked him what his goals were? He may not know. I think you might want to sit down with him now and do so. His #1 goal right now should be regaining your trust and paying off his debt. If he says getting his Wii back or similar, he is very emotionally immature and that should tell you that you need to continue the Treatment for much longer.

Doorknobs on the counter don’t do much, but they might have helped you feel better. You need support through this as well–you are fundamentally changing the entire dynamic of your relationship with your son. This is exhausting and all-encompassing. I admire your staying with this thread–people can be very harsh (not that the situation doesn’t warrant serious treatment)–and people tend to think that their solution or a drastic one(jail, military) is the ONLY way.

By all means, get those forms and post them. They might serve as a reminder to him (and you).

I would also be concerned about the GF–not to put the blame on her, but I do wonder how much of this was to look good in her eyes. She should be appalled by all this–if not, he does NOT need someone like her in his life.

Just a note here–he doesn’t need to have his face rubbed in this every day. By that I mean don’t harp on it and constantly underscore his fuck up in every conversation with him. Especially don’t talk trash about him to others–no need to shout his praises, but keep this as private as you can. Otherwise, you will ultimately undermine your position with him and he will become what you most fear: untrustworthy in life over time. The room, the lack of privileges, the money etc–believe me, he is as tied and trussed as you could have him. No need to spit in his eye as well. He’ll start thinking he’s the injured party and that won’t end well (sorry to repeat myself, I’m tired).

Some here will think I’m being too soft (or softheaded) on this guy. I’m not, really. If he pays her back–he will have learned several crucial lessons–scared straight soccermom style. I know what it took to get me straight (long story)–and it did not involve the police, complete stranger’s judgements of my parents’ actions or hard labor. This is his one last chance-- I say let’s let him have it. It’s up to him now (and foxy).

218

I’ve pitted my brother, who is an untreated bipolor. The quote from it is long, but I think it’s worth repeating.

It didn’t always be this way. He used to not be that bad but as Mom would continue to cave in time and time again, then it would get worse and worse. I’m more along with the kick him out and let him work shit jobs for a year so that he can appreciate the value of a good education and a meaningful career.

A person’s career isn’t going to be hurt by not jumping into school right away. I worked my way through school because my parents wouldn’t pay for my education, so it took several years longer to graduate. It has never been an issue with any of my jobs.

There’s a few things which jumped out at me.

Why is he asking? You’ve set your rules and he’s not accepting that he is getting off lightly and he shouldn’t be pushing you.

He’s testing you, and that’s what two-year-olds do.

219

Wow. I just read through the whole thread. Shitty stuff. My own position has changed in the time it took me to read through this. In summary, I am going to second Acid Lamp’s idea.

You said he is your bitch now. I think you need to go further on that direction. Empty his room. Every last thing. Leave only his crappy clothings (the type he will need to do lawns or whatever job he can get). He can sleep on whatever he can buy for himself.

School should be put on hold. His life is only about paying you every last penny. How much are we talking about? I understood from one of your posts that it was around $5K, but that doesn’t sound right for the rest of the thread. At any rate, it is probably less than a year or two of income on any shitjob.

His pay check goes to you. Not a percentage of it, all of it. He is your bitch, remember?

The minute you get your last penny, he goes out the door. He can fend for himself now. If he wants dental school, he can work for it.

Print this thread out and give it to him. Let him know that word on the street is that he should be everybody’s bitch in prison and that he is very lucky that he gets to be yours.

Once he is on the street, paying for his own way in life, check on him. Talk to him, help him out in every way you can. He is your son and you still love him very much. You are just not his bitch anymore.

220

The longer it takes him to pay back the money he stole, the longer he is getting an interest-free loan. Even though he didn’t get to keep the stuff, he still put it on a credit card. The consumables too.

And even if you were able to get all of those cards cleared right away, you should be charging him interest anyway, at the same rate you would have been charged. Same with late fees and minimum payments.

If he wants to be a big man and use credit cards then he can pay the money back as if they were his cards.

Fucking with credit cards is a lot more expensive than fucking with real cash. Make him learn the difference.

He’s not going to learn about responsible CREDIT if he has an indefinite time to pay you back (whenever he has a chance to make some money). Paying off CREDIT CARDS and interest-based LOANS is an absolute miserable existence because you feel you can’t get ahead. You’re babying him by not making him experience that too.

Cut the school funding, make him get a job and charge him interest.