His ignorance about how interest works is the least of it. Jesus. Who cares if a fucking thief knows how interest works?
I sincerely appreciate that. I do like this site because many wise people frequent the forums. There is no point in posting if I don’t absorb and think about the responses. Of course like every site, there are people that attempt to critique a total stranger’s personality or just cause trouble but I find there are a lot less of those types here than elsewhere.
I don’t post my opinions that often because I am very busy and by the time I catch up after a few days, everything I would have said has already been said and way more eloquently than I could have written.
Wow. You’re the one who did a shitty job raising him and you not only blame his girlfriend but have no intention of “forgiving” her for his conduct? I’m starting to see where this kid learned his complete and utter lack of accountability for his actions.
This may well be the most asinine thing I’ve ever read on these boards. Well done, madam.
So to punish him for these offenses, the only reasonable redeeming thing to many is to call the police and press charges. Paying me back isn’t enough. Getting rid of most of his belongings isn’t enough. Taking away all of his privileges, his phone and means of entertainment isn’t enough. It is either throw him out of my home or put his ass in jail. If that is the only appropriate punishment in many of your eyes, I am very glad I didn’t have parents like some of you while I was doing some major fucking up as a young adult. The kid screwed up and there is no defending it. I take the blame for “creating a monster” by spoiling him. I shouldn’t have given him a credit card and a gas card when he was in school to pay for his gas and lunches. I should have taught him the value of a buck. I am of the mind set that it isn’t too late.
However, I am not going to put a felony on his record for being a selfish little shit not to mention what happens in prisons if he actually is given more than probation. As it was so insightfully put above, he considered it “family money” and felt he was entitled. Not to say he didn’t know it was wrong, he just didn’t think it was as big a deal as he found out it was.
Rest assured that he has this one chance because I don’t really care if he leaves right now. I would prefer it. He is balancing on a tightrope without a net and I hope he can walk the straight line.
Oh, yeh, they’re making a real impression, all right: “Hey, if I cry and moan and look pitiful and tell her what she wants to hear, Mom won’t follow through on all those stupid threats! I just have to wait till she wimps out again.”
Good luck with that. :rolleyes:
I can’t add much more to what’s been said, except
- You realize you spoiled him. Good. Now stop feeling guilty about it and fix it.
- Ride him hard until he pays you every penny back. Don’t do his laundry anymore, don’t cook his meals, he’s responsible for his own finances.
- The sooner you get him out of the house and force him to live in the Real World where he has to pay for Rent and Utilities and Get A Job the better.
I don’t understand this trend toward catering to one’s children. At work a woman who works in another department mentioned she had to take the day off work just to clean her house. She has an eight year old daughter who doesn’t know how to load the dishwasher or run a vacuum! Another friend of mine has a college-aged daughter who never had to iron her clothes.
Folks, there’s more to raising a child than making sure they get ballet and horseback riding and oboe lessons. They have to know how to take care of themselves and hopefully future romantic relationships, so knowing how to do more than boil water and what temperature to wash underwear is crucial.
I’m with ya, trust me. It’s astonishing how few Americans have even the foggiest of clues what they are doing with and to their credit. Of course, that explains the incredibly high percentage of personal debt in this country.
But it’s because things have gotten so bad with credit that kids in my generation are innundated in high school and college with basic information about credit cards and loans. I just find it hard to believe that someone who is in college hasn’t once had to sit through a lecture or two (at least) about how these things work.
That’s what you do with criminals.
Were you a thief, too?
No, it’s not too late. However, with all the excuses you are making for him and the fact that you continue to let him manipulate you means that it’s unlikely you’ll do anything to fix the situation.
He was more than “a selfish little shit.” He broke the law. He stole from you.
And your inaction lets him know that it really wasn’t a big deal.
Sure. Then he’ll just cry and whine and you’ll relent.
(bolding added)
Is that really true? You’ve already wimped out once when he turned on the waterworks.
I’m reminded so much of a similar parent/sociopath relationship I was once aware of. He pulls shit, she (or the authorities) catches him, he cries, she bails him out (sometimes literally). Repeat ad infinitum.
At some point a REAL hammer needs to fall.
On preview: ivylass, I know a parent like that too. I just can’t stand to watch anymore, because I can see the trainwreck coming.
My only 2 cents in this whole thing:
EMPTY THREATS ARE WORTHLESS.
Foxy40
Your son is a felon.
He is not a prosecuted felon, nor a convicted felon. Yet.
He doesn’t even know he is a felon, because you never taught him that he is a felon.
But, I am absolutely sure he won’t be going to Dental School. They don’t have Dental School’s in prison.
Go to the police department. Get a complaint form. Get a half dozen, in fact. Sit down and fill out a complaint for every single felony that your son has committed against you. Sign them. Show him that this is what he is facing. Not “Mommy is disappointed in you.” Not, “You have put me in a difficult position”
Tell him that “You have to convince me, very soon, not to have you put in prison for what you have done. I am sorry won’t do. Being sorry doesn’t matter, when the subject is serial felonies. I am sorry is for “stayed out late without calling” or “skipped school, and went to the mall.””
Each felony can be punished by one year, or more in prison. There is nothing in the world you can do for him more important than teaching him this.
The facts of real life are that he could plead the felonies down, as a first offender, and would probably get probation on the plead down misdemeanors. Don’t tell him that. Because eventually stealing will result in real prison time.
I still think he’s on drugs.
Tris
Stop that, or I will taunt you a second time!
This kinda jumped out at me, because it kinda emphasized my impression that, despite his transgressions, you are still sorta treating him like your little baby, sheltering him from reality, and dealing with things emotionally.
Telling him he has the option of moving out (and meaning it) isn’t supposed to “hurt” him. Whether it “hurts” him is irrelevant. What it is supposed to do is to make him realize how seriously he betrayed you, how little he is “entitled” to, and how hard he has to work to be allowed to remain living in your home.
Seems to me that neither of you is truly acknowledging the reality of what happened. You’re making some of the right noises, and making some gestures, but I suspect the both of you just kinda wish it had never happened. It will take a long time and considerable effort for both of you to truly change the behaviors and perceptions that led to this pass.
I’m coming late to this, but feel the need to post anyway.
First, the military is a bad idea. Imagine the punishment when he steals from the Army, Navy, Air Force or Marines. Not everyone can be as lucky as my brother and come out with an honorable discharge after cooking the books in the Marine Corps—if it hadn’t been such an embarrassment that he found a way around their systems and if he hadn’t been willing to show them how to close those back doors, little brother would probably be in jail forever.
Next, I stole from my dad…when I was 14. Took his ATM card and stole $40 dollars from savings for gas and then “borrowed” his truck for a joyride. He didn’t find out about the money until he got his bank statement, and once he found it and figured out who it must have been, I was in major trouble. BTW, I got more punishment for that little stunt than you’re willing to give your son now.
Your son is not a kid anymore, despite the fact that you are still treating him like one. He is an adult and needs to face real world consequences. I don’t think that you should call the cops…yet. But don’t assume you know your kids so well. He’s a person and like all people he has stuff inside that he doesn’t share.
You have no idea if he’s using drugs unless he’s with you 24/7 (because despite your belief that you would know, you are obviously wearing blinders about this kid), you have no idea who he hangs with (because he’s not going to bring the real bad ones home), you don’t know who else he’s victimized and what he’s gotten away with (because you haven’t been told yet).
Punishment for adults really doesn’t include the same things you’d whip out for your 12 year old kid…taking away the toys, grounding him, not letting him have his friends over. You still aren’t realizing that he’s an adult and he’s committed a major crime. Forgery and credit card fraud are not like stealing $5 from your mom’s wallet for gas money.
You need to tell him that he has completely lost your trust and exactly how disappointed you are in him. That you aren’t sure how he can earn back that trust or how long it will take. That a good start to earning your trust would be to take responsibility for his actions by moving in with his dad instead of making you deal with a person who didn’t care enough not to steal from you (he should want to give you space after fucking you over) and to pay you back. He should be coming up with the way you will be paid back; for example: it will take xxx months at $XXX a month, to pay back $XXX total that he stole with XXX% interest over the course of that time. And then he should be held to that schedule and if he misses a payment, well that’s just more interest then.
If he really didn’t learn about money management in school (and as Diosa points out, most high schools have mandatory courses in this now), then you need to help him learn it now by charging him interest and making him pay the entire freight for his fuckup.
Good luck.
You are absolutely right. I wish it never happened and would just go away. I wish I had not spoiled him so bad that he has no concept of what it takes to earn a buck. I wish I had not given him this what is mine is ours attitude. I wish I didn’t feel a twinge of guilt when I peered into his room this morning and saw him on the mattress on the floor with nothing else in that room.
Mostly I wish that this was an isolated event, a learning experience and some day it will be something to pick on him about around his wife and kids like my folks do with the shit I pulled at that age.
You let him have a mattress?
What a sucker you are.
Foxy, I don’t know you or much of your situation, but I think the above is a great idea. I’d hang all of the complaint forms on the fridge. I wouldn’t take them down until every cent was paid back.
Not only should he have to pay you back - but he has to be made aware of the real consequences for his behavior, every day. You don’t have to harp on him everyday (especially after a year or so), but he needs to have a daily reminder.
You’ve mentioned this a few times. You need to understand that stealing thousands of dollars isn’t just normal teenage shit. It’s not a childish prank. Even if your son was still a child (and he’s not, by the way), there is no excuse for it. He committed a serious felony. You want to excuse it through a variety of means (you didn’t raise him right, his girlfriend encourages him, he’s a kid and all kids do shit like this). Whatever. He is a monster because of this kind of attitude. Your way of dealing with it will only means he will continue along the same path.
No one seems to have mentioned “what happens in prisons” to a nineteen year kid, in places like Florida. I have never forgotten a TV special some years back; a big beefy Florida corrections officer smirking as he
described the fate awaitng a couple of sixteen year old kids he had prosecuted as adults: well yes, he smirked, they’re going to be raped and prostituted; if they didn´t like it they shouldn´t have committed the crime. If there is any possibility that your son is mentally ill and you send him to a Florida prison, you may end up destroying any chance he has to recover.
After reading through this thread I have to say I’ve got a different take on this. It’s all about you, Foxy40, not your son or anyone else.
YOU need to figure yourself out - probably with professional help. Why do you allow people to hurt you without consequence? Why do you have such a poor opinion of yourself that no matter what your son does, a cross look turns you into a pool of Jello?
What kind of person thinks leaving some purchased locks on a kitchen counter is sending any kind of real message or believable threat?
I’d suggest not worrying so much right now about your son’s behavior as concentrating on how you can prevent yourself from being victimized by it - both monetarily and psychologically.