I need some advice on women. Actually, thats BS. I need to vent to strangers again

In My Humble Opinion
41

Wesley I’m a little confused. Are you saying that you ask girls out merely on the basis that they smile at you? That you walk over to them, introduce yourself and ask them out immediately?

Well, if you’re supremely self-confident (which I gather you aren’t) and if the girl in question is extremely trusting, that approach may work, but keep this in mind.

This is exactly what girls going off to college are warned about before they leave home, during their freshman orientation and at every “learn to protect yourself” class offered by damn near every college in the United States.

My advice, kick back, relax and try to take things a little more slowly.

42

Ok I’m probably in the same demographic of women you want to meet (attractive, early 20’s, college educated) and I’ll give you advice on what will get me to go on a date with you, and what won’t. I might seem harsh, but I am being honest.

First off, just because a girl smiles at you DOES NOT mean she is interested in you. I am a very friendly person, I smile at everybody. This does not mean I want to go on a date with them. And if some random guy comes up to me at a library, or some other non-social place, and asks me on a date, that is a turn off. First, I don’t know anything about you, so why would I want to go on a date with you? If you see a girl you like in some sort of non-social setting, it would help to start off with small talk first and then maybe ask for a phone number or something low key like meeting for coffee- but do not ask her off the bat to go on a date.

The fact that you still dwell on things from high school is a huge turn off. Shitty things happen to everybody in high school. Get over it. Move on and don’t let those experiences shape your view of women and dating. If I dated a guy and he still dwelled on things that happened to him in high school, I would run for the hills.

I’m sorry to hear about your mental illness and I know it was something you have no control over, but don’t talk about it with a woman you have just met. From this post you seem very neurotic, and women AVOID neurotic men just like they avoid a power-tool shop. No woman wants to deal with a man who might potentially stalk them or get bent out of shape about something they did or might do (i.e. break up with him). There are plenty of men for women to date so they will definitely avoid the ones who seem crazy. Therapy would help.

If a women rejects you, don’t be so bitter about it, nor keep trying to pursue them because “you know you’ll win them over once they get to know you.” I’m not saying you do this, but it is just a warning. No means no.

An internet relationship DOES NOT mean you are stable enough to handle a real relationship. Honestly, I can’t even believe you somehow logically convinced yourself about this. Interacting with someone IRL is completely different than the Internet. Don’t give yourself props for maintaining this relationship in regards to your love life.

Don’t think just because you get rejected by a girl, she is going to go on to her friends and gossip about you. I have turned down many offers for dates, but I rarely go out and tell my friends about it. It’s just something most normal girls don’t do. Everyone is scared of rejection, and it sucks and you feel like crap, but shake if off and move on. There are plenty of fish in the sea and if one doesn’t like you and you get bitter about it, it makes you seem scary to the women who would want to date you.

43

You do seem a bit harsh. But I can’t say I blame you. Men think we have it tough in the dating game; it’s several times scarier for women.

This does, however, run the risk of putting you in the “Just Friends” category.

No?

44

Well if I really am interested in a guy and all these factors were happening, then I would date him ASAP. But if from the inital meeting, I already knew I wouldn’t be attracted to him, then he was already doomed to be in the “Just Friends” category anyways. I think most women will know by the initial attraction if they want to be friends, or more than friends. There is really nothing you can do to get yourself out of that label once it has been cast.

45

I don’t consider myself attractive, but I’m not ugly. I’m also a college-educated mid-20s white midwestern female. If any guy, no matter how much I might think he’s cute or whatever at first, asked me out (as in, “let’s go get dinner”) after just a short conversation, I’d absolutely say NO. I guess it’s my history of being teased by men I find attractive. If a guy I found attractive struck up a conversation with me and then said “I gotta go, my buddies and I are going to see [insert hip new movie] can I get your number [pause] or on second thought, would you like to come?” I’d probably say yes.

No one ever goes into my ‘just friends’ category if I’m at all attracted to them. (well, they do now, but this is pre-engagement, naturally). If I tell you I just want to be friends, it means I’m not attracted to you for whatever reason.

46

Then this is one way women today may differ from years ago. I’ll stake my very existence on it, in fact: my mom knew my dad while going with a former boyfriend, but at first, she didn’t think much of him. Boyfriend #1 broke it off, she began hanging with dad and a year or so later they got married.

I guess today, our attention spans are so short that if a person doesn’t appeal to you right away, there’s no possibility for “developing” a relationship out of a friendship. That’s kinda sad, if you ask me. And I know, no one did.

47

Ah, but did she find him physically unattractive while she wasn’t thinking much of him? Maternity wards are full of the results of two people who started off disliking each other, but very rarely does “less than no spark” turn into a spark later. Physical attraction and liking the other person have nothing to do with each other – the latter tends to enhance the former, but goodness knows there are men I’ve been attracted to who I didn’t like as people. Sometimes you don’t feel any physical attraction to someone until you get to know him/her, but that’s different from feeling not attracted to them right off the bat. Believe me, there have been a few men I’ve wished I could have been attracted to … incredible guys, just no “spark.”

48

If your alienating women by asking them out, it’s probably because you are coming on too strong too fast. And yeah, smiling != interested.

49

Also, you have to get aquainted first, because unless you are super confident and very atractive women won’t be interested right away and then the rejection can become awkward. If a woman doesn’t see you as someone worthy of keeping as a friend and she’s already turned you down she’s going to be on the back foot next time. It’s only natural because by far most people don’t handle rejection well.

This goes back to stop looking for dates and focus on improving yourself and just meeting interesting people.

50

To finalize (I promise) I also think the advice to stop over-analyzing women as a monolithic entity and start regarding them as individuals is very sound.

51

In this snap-judgment, sound-bite, speed-dating culture, I wonder. I really do wonder.

52

Don’t confuse what gets the most press with what really happens. Have a little faith in people. :wink:

53

OK, another thing (maybe it’s been said already): Don’t bring up your mental illness or dump your problems on a girl you’ve just met. That’s like being covered in shit. Actually don’t do it unless you have a very close relationship.

Hope this helps.

54

Well, that sounds real healthy. Never know about the good advice you’ll get from happy, well-rounded individuals here on the Dope.

55

Sorry, but this is just the Nice Guy Lament wearing a skirt. What’s the percentage of cheerleaders and beauty pageant winners? 5% tops? You think that all single horny guys are flocking after the 95% and ignoring Miss Average, or Miss Slightly-Fatter-Than-Average-But-A-Lovely-Girl-Really? I sorta doubt it.

Some guys set their goals realistically and still strike out time and time again. Most guys, additionally, figure that if a girl’s carrying seventy or more excess pounds by the time she’s into her twenties, the odds are good she’ll do more of the same as time goes on. (And this is Satan rebuking sin, 'cos Mal might win a Mr Thin competition in a sumo school, and then again he might not.)

Incidentally, if you’re peeved that guys are turning you down for being too fat, a whole Sara Lee straight from the freezer is not improving your chances any. Just sayin’. (But from pinkfreud’s use of the past tense, I’m guessing this is no longer a concern in her case.)

56

“…flocking after the 5%, and ignoring the 95% that includes…”

57

I am curious about your voluntary poverty lifesyle that you think some woman will be superficial about. It could be that you present as someone who is not marriage/ family man material, over and above other social issues.

Also, you can tell us the words you might have used on a potential date…but we can never know what your body language was saying eg you might not smile enough, you might stand too close, you might blink too much…who knows. There are probably millions of ways that we can muck up in our comunications without even being aware of it ourselves! Infact the more socially inept we are the more likely that we are not going to be good at reading others or ourselves in any given social situation.

So with all the memories you have, I wonder what the other people involved would say about their side of the story. Its just a thought that maybe what you hold as fact, is actually not so.

Deep down I feel that you are a nice guy, with issues, a little immature…but hey, no ones perfect, and I wish you luck…

But please…whats with the voluntry poverty…???

58

I don’t think even sven was tring to suggest booze as some cure-all for romantic ills, more that it is a traditional helping hand in overcoming awkward inhibited behaviour.

I would second the booze, and second the ‘no cold-dating’ rule. IANALurvemeister, but I have generally in the past:

  1. Met women through friends and got to know them.

  2. On a later meeting if a spark is still there, increase flirtation proportionally with volume of beer drunk (this tends to happen naturally) and see where it goes.

I mean, unlike a library, at least people go to pubs and clubs part of the time for romance, albeit rather slurred…

59

Ya’, and I am saying that is unhealthy. Here at CU-Boulder we’re well above our required quotient of drunken slops that are too stupid or socially inept to possibly communicate any of the following without first consuming massive amounts of alcohol:

A. I like you.

B. I’d like to see you naked.

C. I’d like to date you.

I think it’s rather pathetic. People need to learn to like themselves and become more comfortable in their social interactions. Wesley Clark is right about this often being difficult for college age men (although I disagree with the white/educated part) because they’re still figuring this whole thing out. However, I’m sure that he will gradually indeed get these things figured out and his personality will net him all of the women he needs. Deciding to just go get sloshed and stumble into other lonely, horny individuals that can’t successfully communicate what they want doesn’t seem to be a great path to fufillment.

even sven has publicly discussed her sexual unhapiness in spite of hooking up regularly on these boards before, so I’m not sure that I’ll take too much advice from her.

I mean, Jesus H. Christ on a pogo-stick, people, we’re way past the sexual revolution. Find out what you want in terms of sex, from nothing, to random hook-ups, to a committed monogomous relationship or marriage, and go get it. You don’t need alcohol to take advantage of incapacitated women.

60

I’m personally not big on bars, but they are a good place to meet women. I’ve actually given this some thought.

Women have a hard time feeling okay with signalling that they are sexually interested. We had a thread here earlier where a woman said her coworkers were gossiping about her because she didn’t complain when men looked at her. If a woman isn’t even supposed to let men look at her, how is she supposed to let them know she would like to meet a partner?

The answer is that we go to dark places where our parents and bosses are unlikely to show up and drink a potion that makes us hornier and less self-conscious. Then we go dancing, which is a sexually charged yet noncommital way to discover if you have any chemistry with someone. Ideally then we could undergo some of the dating/getting to know you stuff with a lot of the hedging and bullshit cut out. I’m not advocating drunken one night stands (though those have their place.)

Not all women at bars are there to be picked up on, but most people with SO’s don’t go alone to bars. In any case, unlike the library, there is an established ritual for meeting women at bars, and nobody is going to fault you for giving it a shot. In our society we’ve lost a lot of public space where one would normally meet partners (church, casual sporting events, civic clubs) but bars continue as a place to go after work or whatever to be social with people you don’t know without being creepy.