I Pit Men Who Think Working Women Are There to Service Their Sex Drive

[Steophan]

@Nawth_Chucka

While you’re at it, ask if they’ve been offered or asked for sex while at their jobs, compensated sex or otherwise. I have. Women who are a captive audience are just irresistible to some men, more than you apparently realize; they feel they might have a chance to get away w/ something and they’re going to take it.

It’s happened to plenty of women I know, including some that have been the victims of serious sexual abuse in the past. The thing is, they are not a captive audience, as they can tell the person doing it to leave, and if they don’t get a manager, a security guard, or the police to do so. I know people who’ve done this, mostly bar workers rather than shop workers but the principle is the same.

What happened to Broomstick is a regrettably common situation, with a clearly defined way to handle it. That she, for whatever reason, chose not to do that, but instead took the guys number and continued to talk to him, will have a lot to do with why he didn’t fuck off. Had she, instead of doing that, got her manager and a security guard, I doubt he would have been back asking why she didn’t call…

So yes, had this happened to someone I cared about, I’d have been pissed off at the guy. I’d also have been annoyed at her stupidity

I read this whole miserable thread and I’m convinced some people cannot or will not empathize w/ others. Most men I’ve known would be furious if the woman in the OP was their sister, mom, daughter or SO. Some of you clever pieces of shit enjoy being fuckers merely for the sake of being clever fucking piece of shit fuckers.

No, I’m quite capable of empathy. I’m also quite capable of seeing how her behaviour here, calling what he did a threat, and him a potential rapist, trivialises the suffering of people who have been victims of these, and also reduces the likelihood of people who complain about genuine threats being taken seriously, due to the “crying wolf” effect.

I’m also quite capable of being fucking furious about it, because that trivialising is part of what has cause the suffering of people I care about.

[Left_Hand_of_Dorkness]

@Steophan

It’s happened to plenty of women I know, including some that have been the victims of serious sexual abuse in the past. The thing is, they are not a captive audience, as they can tell the person doing it to leave, and if they don’t get a manager, a security guard, or the police to do so. I know people who’ve done this, mostly bar workers rather than shop workers but the principle is the same.

Bars tend to have security at them. Shoe shops?

I’m also quite capable of being fucking furious about it, because that trivialising is part of what has cause the suffering of people I care about.

Back down, dude. Sleep on it, back down, and chill. At this point you are 100% blaming the victim, and it’s pretty crazy. You may see things differently in the morning.

[The_Tao_s_Revenge]

@Left_Hand_of_Dorkness

Back down, dude. Sleep on it, back down, and chill. At this point you are 100% blaming the victim, and it’s pretty crazy. You may see things differently in the morning.

Repeated for emphases.

[Myrnalene]

@Steophan

I’m also quite capable of being fucking furious about it, because that trivialising is part of what has cause the suffering of people I care about.

How grateful the women in your life must be that you are so outraged on their behalf that you are attacking a woman who was harassed and frightened by a dude who refused to take no for an answer.

Carry on, valiant soldier! Fight the real enemy!

[even_sven]

What do you guys think rapists do? Grow horns and say “Ok, so here is the deal. I am going to sexually assault you”?

Rapists, would-be rapists, and stalkers often, often start by gradually violating your trust and judging your reaction.

They guy who got the closest to raping me pretending like he was helping me after I was seriously injured in a motorcycle accident. Then he started getting weird and I started to get uncomfortable. Then he started getting weirder and I started to get scared. Then he tried to rape me (of course, Steophane can always say I shouldn’t be so upset…after all he didn’t succeed in raping me…). That’s the common progression.

Slightly helpful and maybe a bit funny, if awkward -> a little “off,” but nothing to get alarmed about -> hitting some boundaries, but with plausible deniability -> seriously violating boundaries -> physical assault.

When anyone starts edging into stage three is going to feel like a threat to me. And if I feel threatened, my only interest is not being raped. I don’t care if it hurts someone’s feelings. I don’t care if I am overreacting. I don’t care if it’s “just words.” I am not going to give the benefit of the doubt. I really, really, really don’t want to be raped. And if it starts hitting step three, yes, I am going to feel oogy and uncomfortable. It’s part of the “I don’t want to get raped” reaction.

@Invisible_Chimp

I mostly agreed with your post, including your interpretations of others’posts, but I disagree with this. I don’t blame it on guys being resentful of anything. I do think it might have to do with social awkwardness though, i.e, they lack empathy, miss social cues, etc.

You’re bagging on the social awkward guy is getting old though. It’s almost as bad as their supposed misogyny. Do you realize that now that you’re over thirty, you’re the female equivalent of the socially awkward guy? Men, in general, are going to prefer the younger, hotter chick over you.

I think I should apologize here. I wasn’t talking about socially awkward guys. Actually, most of the real socially awkward guys I know are in happy relationships at this point.

I am referring to a subset of asshole guys who are consistently confused that their asshole tactics- usually replete with badgering, guilt tripping, misogynist bullshit- doesn’t win hearts and minds. Baffled by their inability to stick their dick in any passing woman that becomes their target, they decide that the only explanation is that women are horrible judges of character and “only like jerks.” Under the false banner of the “socially awkward,” they whine for the rights of assholes.

Everyone has their advantages and drawbacks in dating. What matters is how gracefully you work with what you’ve got. In my life, right now I’m hoping the only younger chick my SO is interested in is the daughter we are hoping to have.

[mister_nyx]

@billfish678

You left out

8. OP didn’t tell the whole fucking story and the most important part of it from the get go.

Huh, because the original story in post number #1 is actually totally sufficient to confirm that Broomstick has every fucking right to be upset.

But, I mean, obviously you didn’t think that proved she’d suffered enough to complain.

[Hbns]

@Myrnalene

Also, for future reference - most women don’t need advice from most men on how do deal with creepy dudes, seeing as how we are unfortunately in the position of having more experience with this issue. And Monday morning quaterbacking is even more infuriating when it’s coming from someone who’s never held a football.

And yet nary a sister in arms has suggested she file a report with the police.
One does not, and should not wait until they have been physically assaulted to file a report. The man is harassing Broomstick this needs to be reported. :smack:

[Hbns]

@Jragon

Hell, there’s no guarantee calling the police is even the right thing to do, he hadn’t done much other than skeeve her out, the chances of him getting off without being arrested are relatively high. They could remove him from the shop, but he knows where she works, there’s a non-trivial chance that will just tip him to the breaking point of “full on stalking, rape her because she deserved it.”

That is about the stupidest post I have seen all day.

You don’t report the creep only if you think he can be arrested. You report the creep to establish a paper trail and a history of harassment with this person. The sooner that is established the more quickly and seriously the police will respond to further harassment or stalking behavior.

[billfish678]

@mister_nyx

But, I mean, obviously you didn’t think that proved she’d suffered enough to complain.

Well, if thats what you’ve gotten from what I’ve said about what she’s posted your reading comprehension sucks donkey balls.

[mister_nyx]

@billfish678

Well, if thats what you’ve gotten from what I’ve said about what she’s posted your reading comprehension sucks donkey balls.

So, uh, you’re agreeing with me that post #1 in this thread gave her absolute right to complain and that subsequent complaints about it were off-base, given how valid her argument was?

Or are you stupid, and you’re trying to bluff? It’s one or the other, there’s not actual grey area here.

[billfish678]

@mister_nyx

So, uh, you’re agreeing with me that post #1 in this thread gave her absolute right to complain and that subsequent complaints about it were off-base, given how valid her argument was?
.

What the fuck does that even mean? You’re gonna have to reword that baby before I can respond.

[Broomstick]

@Steophan

What happened to Broomstick is a regrettably common situation, with a clearly defined way to handle it. That she, for whatever reason, chose not to do that, but instead took the guys number and continued to talk to him, will have a lot to do with why he didn’t fuck off. Had she, instead of doing that, got her manager and a security guard, I doubt he would have been back asking why she didn’t call…

No you jackass, I DID NOT TAKE HIS NUMBER. He put it on the counter. I did NOT continue to talk to him, I ordered him out of the store. The manager, in case you missed it was in another fucking county. After he put that goddamned piece of paper on the counter I ordered him out of the store and he left. He protested, but he left.

In other words, I did exactly what you say I didn’t.

When he came back the next day I did NOT engage him in conversation, I once again ordered him out of the shop. Again, he protested but left.

If he hadn’t left when ordered to do so I would have called security, of course, but since he left under his own power doing so would have been an over-reaction.

But hey, don’t let the facts interfere with your fantasy or the jollies you get in deliberately misinterpreting someone else’s statements. so you can get your rocks off blaming a women for the harassment she suffered.

[mister_nyx]

@Steophan

No, I’m quite capable of empathy. I’m also quite capable of seeing how her behaviour here, calling what he did a threat, and him a potential rapist, trivialises the suffering of people who have been victims of these, and also reduces the likelihood of people who complain about genuine threats being taken seriously, due to the “crying wolf” effect.

I’m also quite capable of being fucking furious about it, because that trivialising is part of what has cause the suffering of people I care about.

It’s really fucking rich of you to act self-righteous at this point, after post after post after post of you attacking the OP for not accepting grossly unacceptable sexual aggression the way you want her to. Yeah, let’s all pretend your interest here is in defending sexual assault victims.

[OtakuLoki]

@Hbns

That is about the stupidest post I have seen all day.

You don’t report the creep only if you think he can be arrested. You report the creep to establish a paper trail and a history of harassment with this person. The sooner that is established the more quickly and seriously the police will respond to further harassment or stalking behavior.

You’re the idiot. Often enough such a paper trail only exists to highlight at a murder trial, that the system let down another person who trusted that such reports would do something. Sure and they’re damned useful at murder trials to point towards aggravating circumstances to lead to harsher sentences than would have been handed down otherwise.

But that sort of thing is damned cold comfort for the victim.

If your imagination isn’t totally ossified, just imagine how some of the asshole posters here would respond to a complaint if they were the investigating officer given the circumstances? Ridicule is the mildest response I would expect from such an officer. Harassment and charges for wasting the officer’s time have been known to happen.

Just out of curiosity, do you have any memory of what the officer called to the scene of the Ben Roethlisberger incident behaved like? I’ll give you a hint - he started right off blaming the woman for wearing clothes that asked for it.

That shit happens. Reporting harassment (or worse) is a crap shoot - there’s no way to know ahead of time what sort of reception such a complaint will get. If you don’t believe that you’re fucking brain dead.

[Broomstick]

@Hbns

And yet nary a sister in arms has suggested she file a report with the police.

Actually, that has been suggested several times - go back and re-read the thread.

One does not, and should not wait until they have been physically assaulted to file a report. The man is harassing Broomstick this needs to be reported. :smack:

And what law, exactly, did he break?

He asked that I fuck him. That isn’t, believe or not, illegal. It might be skeevy as all hell, but it’s not illegal.

Filing a police report on this I would expect exactly the reaction I’m getting from *Steophan - oh, you silly, over-reacting stupid woman, he’s just awkward and trying to be friendly. Cops want to see evidence of wrong doing. Being skeevy isn’t illegal.

Now, refusing to leave when asked, that might be grounds for security or police, but apparently he’s savvy enough to avoid that little faux pas. That doesn’t mean he’s any less skeevy, or any less harmless.

Now, if he develops a *pattern *of this sort of shit, yes, that might work for showing he’s a potential problem, but two visits don’t make a stalker. Perhaps I’ve been assertive enough he’ll seek easier prey. I certainly hope so. If he comes back again, yes, I will document it and take whatever further steps are necessary.

[mister_nyx]

@billfish678

What the fuck does that even mean? You’re gonna have to reword that baby before I can respond.

So let’s see: what she described in her OP was enough to show how badly she’d been treated. You nonetheless are complaining at her. You can’t come up with any reason to complain, but you’re complaining anyway.

I think that’s an adequate summary. And I think that’s an adequate reason to assume any future posts of yours will be just as worthless as their predecessors.

[Hbns]

@OtakuLoki

That shit happens. Reporting harassment (or worse) is a crap shoot - there’s no way to know ahead of time what sort of reception such a complaint will get. If you don’t believe that you’re fucking brain dead.

Well if the choice is rape, assault, or officer dickwad. I’ll deal with officer dickwad. I can’t believe you are going to sit there and suggest the best fucking response to continuing unwanted sexual advances is to just say “please go away”.

Because oh my fucking god the guy I am worried might rape me, might rape me if I report him. Jesus christ it doesn’t take an diploma to see how senseless that approach is.

[Hbns]

@Broomstick

Actually, that has been suggested several times - go back and re-read the thread.

Yep I know, I was one of them. Maybe you missed that through the red mist.

And what law, exactly, did he break?

He asked that I fuck him. That isn’t, believe or not, illegal. It might be skeevy as all hell, but it’s not illegal.

Filing a police report on this I would expect exactly the reaction I’m getting from *Steophan - oh, you silly, over-reacting stupid woman, he’s just awkward and trying to be friendly. Cops want to see evidence of wrong doing. Being skeevy isn’t illegal.

So the guy freaks you out so bad… and yet… nope, mister policeman might be a potential rapist too so I better just keep mum and maybe it will all go away? And if he comes back again, in the eyes of the cops it’ll be the first incident and they still may not take it very seriously.

File a report. Yeah, some cop with zero empathy will think you are wasting his time, but they’ll take the report if you insist. But hey, maybe the skeeve will never come back again.

[DianaG]

@OtakuLoki

Reporting harassment (or worse) is a crap shoot - there’s no way to know ahead of time what sort of reception such a complaint will get. If you don’t believe that you’re fucking brain dead.

Sure it is. That doesn’t mean that you don’t do it. That’s what cops are there for, and if they’re dicks about it, call them on that shit.

Seriously, what should she do? Not what should she feel (which is, of course, whatever she feels), but what should she do?

I’d just like to submit the possibility that the OP is overreacting a bit (or at least venting here in a way that indicates such, which may not be the same thing) AND that it’s not unreasonable to react that way. Both are entirely possible, even simultaneously.

She doesn’t know anything about this guy except how he’s behaved in front of her. The way he’s behaved in front of her is utterly unacceptable. That doesn’t necessarily indicate that he’s plotting to hide in her backseat and The Room her.

Afraid is no way to go through life but prepared is good, and no one is powerless. Take reasonable precautions to protect yourself (and I’m not talking anything elaborate here, I’m talking pepper spray and SING) and then trust your instincts. Better to offend someone who already creeps you the fuck out than to err on the side of politeness. Without commenting on the OP’s behavior, I do think that more women need to truly accept the idea that it’s okay to say, LOUDLY “I’m not interested, go away and don’t bother me again. Ever.” Do NOT equivocate about this shit.

[Dave_Hartwick]

Stop blaming the victim, you guys. Don’t tell her she could have possibly did something differently because that’s what victim-blamers do.

I just checked and sexual harassment is still bad,

Dave