This really bears repeating.
EXCELLENT points Guinastasia, too bad they’ll never pierce the void.
Google didn’t have a single hit for “SPNG” and “Self proclaimed nice guys”. And “SPNG” didn’t seem to have any hits that had anything to do with "this subject. Although “self proclaimed nice guys” did have a hundred hits or so- most were from the same websites, and none (well in the first few pages) used the entire term all in quotes. (it’d be= self-proclaimed “nice guys”)
Hardly a 'well-known term". Sorry.
Nor have they themselves “coined the phrase” as so far- what I have seen is OTHERs saying that “SPNGs” use that phrase to refer to themselves. Sure, I have no doubt that somewhere here in the English speaking world- a few losers/stalkers have used “nice guy” to refer to themselves. Yeah- so what, it’s a common phrase.
Susan- all those links go to the same site you know. Of course the guys there use that term- so have I. Doesn’t mean that they think that it is a good & accurate term. Just that they are replying to other postings- just like here.
Well, “sorry” but that’s when it helps to actually read the whole thread. BTW, the following articles are written for the most part by men. Oh, you’re right, they don’t say “Self proclaimed Nice Guy”, My mistake, they say self Professed nice guy.
At any rate, again, reading the ENTIRE thread, and poster’s ENTIRE posts might help clear up the difference between what other posters are actually saying, and what you imagine them to be saying.
You’re right, they didn’t coin “self proclaimed nice guy”. They merely appropriated the term “nice guy”. And if you read what it says, you’ll see that being "“nice” according to old and even current definitions, isn’t all that “nice” after all.
Neither do WE think it’s a good and accurate term…Good GOD man, reading comprehension?? Hello? At least HALF of our complaints about this sort of man is that he is NOT nice, but claims to be, and acts like an asshole under the pretense of “niceness”.
We think it’s a very inaccurate term, hence part of our irritation at those who do so. They say, during part of their diatribe against women who dare turn them down for a date “I’m a nice guy…women are all bitches who only date bad boys…sneer sneer, woman all only date assholes, of COURSE you’d be no different etc…”
That is why we, and a bunch of others not on this board, or in this thread, are calling this guy (and as you can see by the cites provided, we’re not the only ones) the "SELF proclaimed Nice Guy[sup]tm[/sup]. Not nice guy. Is it piercing the void yet?
Second, yeah, her links go to the same site, which contains links to books and other sites. You just have to look further than the end of your nose. At any rate, at least she GAVE a cite, more than you or catsix have done. So, the angry stalker loser exists afterall, so you don’t like that they call themselves “nice guys” neither do we, but…a rose by any other name…
Wait, you’re saying you have read every word of all 303 posts in this thread? Yeah, that’s likely…
Copy & paste my hairy ass.
And you continue to ignore the fact that the number of short women getting tall men is much, much, much, much, much higher than the number of short men getting tall women. You only seem interested in criterea that support your premise, and ignore the others. You give lip service to the fact that I am correct, but then immediately proceed to ignore the point in favor of your own self-selected evidence.
My God, this is getting downright comical. How many more times will you repeat this, while ignoring my point?
How many times are you going to say the same thing?
Yosemite: Men have an advantage because women might still find them attractive if they are older.
Blowero: But women have an advantage because men might still find them attractive if they are shorter.
Yosemite: But men have an advantage because women might still find them attractive if they are older.
Blowero: :smack:
Obviously.
Look, Nightime gets it, why don’t you?
But you call me a dumbass because you can’t keep track? Please.
Yeah. Right. Because then you’d actually have to read the thread in your search for a quote to copy and paste. And you’re obviously not going to do that.
I’ve never denied that. I just don’t think that overall, women have a harder time of it in regards to “looks management” than men do. Doesn’t mean that I think that men have no problems with “looks management,” just that overall, in general it is basically not as severe.
Get a grip man. Once again, since you obviously haven’t really read the thread and you don’t know what I’ve been saying here, you’re lost.
Men have a disadvantage if they’re short, or in some cases, if they’re bald. But women have more disadvantages. The list of their disadvantages isn’t the same as men’s, but it’s a longer list and it generally affects a higher percentage of women for a longer period of time.
Look, if Aeschines gets it, why don’t you?
At least Aeschines has bothered to read the damned thread.
Ugh. And I previewed. It should be: “I just think that overall, women have a harder time of it in regards to “looks management” than men do.” (Take the “don’t” out of there.)
I take that to mean you haven’t read every word of every post in this thread. Oh, but you expect others to. That’s special.
Look, you stupid fuck - When people converse, each reply relates to the thing the person is replying to, not what you said last month, or the day after tomorrow.
Fuck you. I know what you said; you say the same fucking thing over and over and over. It was wrong the first time, and it’s STILL wrong. You obviously have nothing to add now, because you’re just repeating your asinine “you aren’t paying attention” meme. Shove that bullshit up your ass.
Wow, when you get a little theme going, you just can’t stop repeating the exact same thing, can you? I’ve heard parrots with more original thoughts. Call me when you have something interesting to say.
Who cares? Your post is drivel either way.
Ok, I lost track of this thread for a while. I think I’m back up to date, but…blowero and yosemite, are you now debating whether or not perceptions of physical attractiveness can override desirable personality characteristics in regard to choice of mate? Because if you are, then I – “He Who Posts 20-Paragraph Diatribes In Response To One Sentence” – have this to say on the matter:
Yes. Yes it can. For men and for women. In roughly equal amounts depending upon situation. YMM, with respect to the individual men and/or women you personally know, V.
Or am I missing a finer aspect of the point?
I’ve never in all my life had someone say something like that to me, and if someone did, I certainly wouldn’t think he was a ‘Nice Guy.’
So on your planet, a manipulative person is a ‘Nice Guy?’
I guess asking the OP to stick to the one person who pissed her off instead of generalizing (and then having a following of generalizers come in after her) to proclaim that pretty much any guy who calls himself a nice guy is a dickwad was just not broken down into small enough words for you.
And she knows so much about men based on what exactly?
And a lot of that is a personal choice. Women do not have to be thin and gorgeous and have perfect hair and make up to have a guy, because there are lots of men out there who don’t give a rat’s ass about those things.
You’re a woman, right?
She’s saying they call themselves ‘Nice Guys’.
Let me break it down for you.
Two guys. One says “I’m a baseball fan. I just love the game, I play with my friends in the park once in a while. I never miss a game where my favorite team is playing.”
One says “I’m a baseball fan. I sleep with my favorite baseball bat. I once prostituted myself to get World Series tickets. You don’t like my team? You’re a horrible evil psychotic person who doesn’t deserve to live.”
Both call themselves “baseball fans”, but would you admit that perhaps one of them is a little off his nut?
Likewise:
“I’m a nice guy. When I take a woman out, I listen to her opinions and what she has to say. I try to show her a good time. I would never hit a woman, talk down to her as though she were a child, or badmouth her either to her face or behind her back.”
“I’m a nice guy. Which sucks, because women are horrible and cruel and take advantage of me. They do it because they’re evil as a gender, but I’m still nice to them – the ones who aren’t bitches who won’t give me the time of day.”
I know both of these guys. Sadly the first one does not want to date me, as he is in love with a girl who won’t give him the time of day. 
I’m perfectly willing to admit that the men who fall into the second category have probably had wretched ungrateful women walk all over them – because it’s oh so terribly easy to manipulate someone in that situation. Especially if guy number 2 USED to be a sweet person, a romantic, and falling into category 1. I’m not saying there isn’t a reason for guy number 2 to be the way he is.
But you know what? There’s a reason for everything. If I murdered my mother, I might have a reason. I might have a good one. I’d still be a murderer. People should not get away with bad behavior because their feelings have been hurt. People are not entitled to kindness or pity or sympathy. That’s the great thing about kindness, pity, and sympathy – we can individually give them to people we individually consider deserving.
And you say there are men who don’t care about good hair, good bodies, pretty faces. Fair enough, but what is the initial attractor for them? They might love a girl for her personality, but if they never say hello to her, how are they going to find out? And a pretty girl has more opportunity to get someone saying hello to her.
You are the only woman I have met who hasn’t had this experience, or one very similar, at least several times. Maybe you should wait until you get some actual Real Life Dating Experience before jumping to conclusions about mine.
Dingdingding! Yes, if he identifies himself as such. That’s why we have the capital-N-capital-G-in-quotations “Nice Guy” (or SPNG) – to distinguish them from a genuine nice guy (GNG).
Dude, you never “asked” me to do anything. You attacked me for not doing something your way, but until now you haven’t said just what you did want.
First, it wasn’t just one guy – he was just the first SPNG I had been stupid enough to date in a while. Scenes like LPNinja described happen all the time. I just saw a pattern, and reported back on it.
Second: Find exactly where I said that any guy who calls himself a nice guy (lower case) is a dickwad. You can’t, because it isn’t there. I think a guy that has to identify himself as “nice” within five minutes of meeting you is probably a bit insecure, but to cross over into SPNG territory he would have to meet several other criteria, all of which have been explained in depth over the last 7 pages.
Third: you never actually answered my question about filters (and no, insulting me doesn’t count): you are seriously saying that you allow everybody equal access to your time, regardless of the giant flashing warning sign above his or her head?
It’s nice to say that we judge everybody on their own merits, but if it looks like a duck…
I’ve been following the entire thread, and moreover, I know what I’ve said on this thread and what I’ve meant. You aren’t remotely even attempting to keep track of what I’m saying, and therefore you’re lost. Not my problem. And of course, when this is pointed out to you, you become increasingly short-tempered and hostile. Also not my problem.
We’re not talking about last month, we’re talking about the same damned thread, posts made within hours of each other. And you won’t bestir yourself to keep track? Once again, not my problem.
And I also might add here: Dude, this is the Dope. You can’t just gloss over big parts of a thread, get lost, and then get pissy when that fact is pointed out to you. Won’t read the whole thread? Won’t read my posts, written within a short amount of time from each other? That’s not my fault, and ranting and saying “Fuck you” isn’t going to change that.
See what I mean? 
Blah blah blah. You keep repeating “But short men get treated unfairly!” as if that changes everything. But it doesn’t. I don’t think I’m wrong, and your repeating the mantra about the poor short guys isn’t changing that, no matter how many times you repeat it.
What I’m saying is not even a radical or ground-breaking thing. It’s something that most people (well, if they reside in the real world) kind of have always known. So why is it such a controversy here? Color me as befuddled as Aeschines (yes, I dared to bring up his name again) as to why that is.
Oh my gosh. Humor-impaired. Look—you quoted someone else, thinking that what? It would change everything for me? Well, I can quote people too, buddy. Big whoop.
So what is your point? And you’re a man, right? So what?
I have actual real life dating experience.
That’s funny. So if I called myself a three-headed alien from the great beyond, you’d capitalize it for me?
Nope, but people do generally get a decent chance. Instead of writing them off the very first time they aren’t exactly what I expect, I usually try to figure out if they are always a pain in the ass.
Jesus, you’re thick.
Of course not. I’m not talking about guys who are genuinely nice. I’m talking about someone who claims to be a nice guy, when he is not, and says that he doesn’t get dates because he is, what HE calls, a “nice guy.” He CLAIMS to be a “nice guy”, but he’s really a whiny, passive aggressive doormat.
No, not every guy who calls himself a nice guy is one of these “Nice Guys[sub]TM[/sub].” But just calling yourself nice doesn’t mean you are. I could call myself the Queen of England-does that mean I am? No. Same with these SPNGs.
And no, we don’t owe these guys jackshit. Hell, do you think you owe Chuckles the Assclown the time of day? Of course not. I don’t owe these manipulative fucksticks a thing.
Just establishing context for the earlier quote.
Who do you have to sleep with to get Series tickets? Seriously.
Sure, if enough other people also called themselves three-headed aliens that I could see a pattern. I’m not certain that this “dating experience” you say you’ve had has happened on this planet anyway. You are either unbelievably lucky, or you have some sort of SPNG repellent spray (which I totally want, btw).
Good for you for being so patient, but any time you spend with someone after he has displayed assholish behavior isn’t a social obligation. It is not owed to that person, and your responsibility to him would be fulfilled by a polite good bye.
I think what really makes me worried and angry about SPNG is that I have spent a lot of time honing my FuckingCockery radar to avoid aggressive assholes, and they come up with another type of assholery that sets off no alarms at all.
It is harder to spot, harder to explain, and harder to get away from, mostly because of the mislabel Nice Guys. I would looooove it if they would just call themselves Passive-Aggressive Loosers. It would make life much simpler. However, nobody thinks of themselves as a bad person: an abuser calls himself “a protective, passionate guy,” a censor calls him or herself “a protector of children’s minds,” and a P-A looser calls himself a “Nice Guy.” Labeling him is part of protecting yourself from him.
So far as it relates to my job having to interact with his job, I actually do owe him the time of day. That doesn’t mean I’m going to hang out with him after work. He was, however, given enough of a chance to find out whether or not he’s a flaming imbicile all the time or just having a particularly bad day.
This isn’t Total Recall, and I’ve never been to any other planets.
Yet you don’t apply their own mislabels to them the way that you do ‘Nice Guy’. Why is that?