Well, whaddaya know?
Thanks!
I don’t know, I’ve been in many Spanish classes where we were asked to pick Spanish names. If one’s name could be, um, hispanized, one was allowed to use the Spanish version of their name. If one’s name, like mine, had no Spanish translation, we were asked to choose a Spanish name.
I actually found this useful in my later days travelling in Spain, as I could introduce myself as Carmen to strangers instead of using my actual name and getting blank stares of bafflement in return.
They did this in my Russian class too, and ditto on the name - mine doesn’t translate well so I got a somewhat-similar-sounding Russian name.
To clarify my earlier post, using a Jewish/Hebrew/Yiddish name isn’t so much the issue, it’s that the instructor asking who is Jewish and who is not Jewish, in order to assign names. (And I’m not sure if that is what happened but that is what I inferred from the OP). In a Spanish class, that might be like saying “Catholic students will be referred to by the name of their patron saint, translated into Spanish. Everyone else, I will give you a name.” Which is different than what usually happens, where the instructor goes down the roster and picks a translated or phonetically similar name. As in: “Peter? You’re name is Pedro. Hope? How about Esperanza?”
I’m confused…(South Georgia girl of Christian descent in an area where Jews are rare). How can you be Jewish - as in religious and attending synagogue - and atheist? Why would you follow the Jewish rules (customs, I can understand somewhat) if you don’t believe in God?
This always struck me as pretty funny. In all the language classes I’ve taken, which is a lot, I only remember it happening in Grade 6 French. (I am perfectly willing to be known verbally as Mathieu, Mateo, Mateu, etc. as necessary when using another language, even though I’ll write my name the same everywhere.)
Again, it comes back to the intertwined-ness of Jewish religion and Jewish culture. Practicing American Jews are given a Hebrew name, usually soon after birth (or at time of conversion, if a convert). The Hebrew name is sort of an “a.k.a.” that is used during religious services. Sometimes, but not always, it’s similar, or even the same as their secular name. I gather that a Catholic confirmation name is similar, but not exactly, since that is considered part of the Catholic’s full name, as in John Peter Paul Smith. For Jews, it’s more like: Sol Greenberg, who is also know as Shlomo Moshe ben Yitschak (translated back into English, that would be Solomon Moses, son of Isaac.)
So “having a Hebrew name” is not the same as “having a name of Hebrew origin”. The Jews in the class are extremely likely to already have a built-in Hebrew-based alias, and the non-Jews are extremely unlikely to have.
Because the belief in Judaism is that following the rules in an end unto itself. Living according to “God’s law” makes you a better person. God has little to do with it other than being where the laws came from.
This is probably the biggest difference between Judaism and Christianity. At least as big as the whole Christ thing. We don’t work for an afterlife, we work for now because it makes our current lives better.
ETA: belief isn’t necessary to be a good Jew and isn’t required anywhere in the Torah or (I believe) the Talmud.
“Jewish” doesn’t just mean a religion. It is also an ethnicity. So you can be Jewish and atheist the same way you can be Italian and atheist. There have been various attempts to find a new word for either the religion or the ethnicity so we wouldn’t have the confusion of using the same word for both, but they haven’t really caught on.
Some atheists still enjoy the holidays or traditions from their faith background- lots of non-Christians celebrate Christmas, for example. Some atheist Jews like holidays like Hanukkah and Passover. Some want to expose their kids to their religious tradition (so the kids can make an educated choice of whether to accept it or not, like the parents presumably did). Maybe some of them just like belonging to a community.
That’s debated. One point of view says that one of the Ten Commandments says you have to believe in God. Another point of view says that you either believe or you don’t, and you can’t make yourself believe if you are commanded to (also, if you don’t believe in God, who or what is commanding you?).
The emphasis in Judaism is definitely on practice, not belief. When I was studying for conversion, the classes had a lot of material on “what Jews do” (holidays, Shabbat, life cycle events like weddings and funerals, and the like) but we spent very little time on stuff like the nature of God, the afterlife, and what not. I was asked to do stuff like try keeping kosher and Shabbat as part of the conversion process.
When the Bet Din (group of rabbis that decides whether or not to let a convert in, generally by asking them some questions) asked me questions, they were about practice. I wasn’t asked “do you believe in God”?
**NAF1138 **and **Anne Neville **both responded pretty much as I would have (thank you, you two), so I don’t think that there’s anything more factual that I can add.
I will say this, though: Whevenver people find out that this kippah-wearing (most of the time) (kippah sort of =yarmulke=skullcap) Jew is both an atheist and a practicing Jew (albeit not Orthodox), and they ask me (understandably so) how I can be an atheist and a Jew, I tell them that Judaism doesn’t require that I believe in God–it does, however, require that I believe in tzedek (justice), tikkun olam (repair of the world), g’milut chasadim (acts of lovingkindness), and living an ethical life. Honestly, what more could you ask for? IOW, for me, Judaism can be a religion, a culture, etc., but, basically, it’s a way of life.
I also tell them that my belief (and, most definitely, Jewish belief) is not that our way is the only way–it’s just our way.
Okay, cool–I’m glad to see that I was headed in the right direction.
As you have correctly imagined, our community is not immune to its own inter-group battles re who’s right and who’s wrong (a.k.a. stuipid shit). Fortunately, most of us strive to rise above the foolishness and try to live the best lives that we can.
And thank you, my dear–I remain confident that things will go well with my teacher once I explain the situation. And I’ll certainly come back and give an update for those who might be interested.
Thank you very much.
I must say, when I bought the coursebooks the other day and opened them up, I was like, “Oh, shit!” It’s all (well, 99.x%) in aleph-bet, with very little English. And it’s unpointed, too! I am sooooo screwed. Then I realized that, no, I’ll be fine once I get into the habit. If I don’t make a complete fool of myself first.
(For the few here who might not know, Hebrew can be written with dots and dashes underneath some of the letters (pointed Hebrew), or without. These serve as vowel sounds–ay, ee, oo, etc. Because I don’t have to read Hebrew often (my shul uses a prayerbook that has a great deal of transliteration–putting the letters in “regular” alphabet–except for the prayerbook we use for High Holy Days, which has less transliteration), I prefer the vowel sounds. And while I’m certainly capable of reading some unpointed Hebrew, the vowel sounds are helpful until one becomes re-acclimated.)
Amen!
But yes, there are apparently a great many Jews–especially white American Jews–who don’t know this kind of stuff.* Like I alluded to in one of my earlier posts, though, it seems that in the past, ohhh, 10-20 years, it’s been getting better in terms of Reform and Reconstructionist Judaism. One of my friends not too long ago sent me a link to a Reform site that had a poster (part of an “advertising” campaign) that showed Jews of various ethnicities.
I have to say that your post cracked me up WRT the Lubavitchers. I suppose that’s one thing that I’m able to avoid, what with not “looking” Jewish. Lord knows, if I’m in town around Shabbat eve, and I’m either rushing home so I can get out my shoes and strip down to my boxers and drink some wine, or (on the rare occasion) on my way to one of my favorite gay bars to toss back a few, the last thing I need is to be accosted in the streets by people that I don’t know. 
Well, no, actually, if the Lubavitchers recognized me as a Jew and asked me to step into the Mitzvahmobile for a few minutes to light Shabbat candles, I’d (a) be shocked, and (b) think it was kind of cool, but ONLY if it was to light candles and say the Shabbat blessings. Okay, and maybe sing some Shabbat tunes, too. Hey, what can I say?:o
*Incidentally, during my travels in Europe in the mid-90’s, this wasn’t an issue. I mean, when I was in Switzerland, I went to shul with a friend of my then-husband, and no one batted an eyelid upon seeing me. It was kind of funny, though, to see all these old men (this was an Orthodox shul) moving about having their own conversations while the rabbi led the services. Of course, they would join in the prayers at the appropriate moments, but other than that, they were free agents. Cracked me up.
Yes, by asking us our Hebrew names (what she called our Jewish names).
No, it’s Columbia. Definitely secular.
I guess that her assumption was largely (and, apparently, not incorrectly) that most, if not all, of the students would have some connection to Jewish life and so therefore might have Hebrew names. But you’re right–if one didn’t have that connection (and there’s at least one non-Jew in the class), being singled out as “the other” could potentially sting (as I, of course, discovered).
And I think you’re right about not needing to create a divide. ISTM, though, that the professor’s “shtick” is to kind of bring eveyone into the “fold” of Jewishness. I understand her intentions–and, certainly, the non-Jewish student didn’t seem to mind–but yes, something like this has to be done carefully. Not that I necessarily think that she was careless in that regard–just that if someone identifies him/herself as a Jew and they don’t “look” Jewish, it’s not a good idea to attempt to vet them when you haven’t done so with those who *do *“look” Jewish.
Hey, there! Another RJ Doper, huh? Cool!
If *you *know in your soul that you’re a Jew, I’d say that it really shouldn’t be necessary for you to go through a “formal” conversion. If someone has the temerity to tell you that you’re not “really Jewish,” I’d suggest you tell them, “Well, so you say, but at least *I’m *not REALLY an asshole.” That also works well if somone tells you that you don’t “look” Jewish. You just respond, “And *you *don’t look like an asshole, yet here we are.” I know, I know–I am evil and I will be destroyed. 
But seriously, people get tired of hearing that shit.
Amen! And thank you so much for your lovely thoughts! I really do appreciate it. If you ever find yourself on this side of the pond, I’ll be more than happy to take you to my shul in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. That’s about 100 miles from me (I now live in the New York metro area), but they’re terrific folks (which is why I maintain my membership even from such a distance), and I’d be happy to make the trip. (Besides, I need to get to shul more often anyway.) It’ll be best, though, if it’s not during the summer since we have limited services during that time of year, but even then we can see what’s going on.
I could be wrong, but I’m pretty sure 3acres is not a he.
Hey, unspun!
Well, first of all, you have no reason to feel guilty about identifying yourself as a Jew. It is, after all, what you are. As I and several others in this thread (and elsewhere on these boards, I’m sure) have pointed out, there’s more than one way to be a Jew. I, myself, am an atheist (as are some other Jewish Dopers), and I have no compunction about identifying myself as a Jew. In my soul, it is what I am, and can’t anyone take that away. And so, I reckon, it is with you.
About racism in the Jewish community: I think you’re right–there are many who are afraid to touch it. I can assure you, however, that I’m not not one of them. I didn’t broach the issue in my OP or otherwise in this thread because (a) I’m really not convinced that that’s what I’m dealing with, and it’s an accusation that I don’t want to levy lightly, and (b) (though not that it really matters) from what I’ve seen on the Dope–good thinkers notwithstanding–whenever someone (most likely a black person) speaks about racism, someone (or two, or three, etc.) always comes in to tell us that we’re imagining shit or that we have a chip on our shoulders. (NOTE TO ALL: That last part was *not *meant in any way to be a reference to **3acresandatruck **or zweisamkeit. It’s just that this is the kind of language that those in denial tend to use against blacks who speak out about racism.)
I understand your advice to stand down and see how things develop, but as I said earlier, this really got in my craw, so I don’t think I’d be comfortable waiting it out. And even if I were, I feel a need to speak up now so that this professor doesn’t in the future make that kind of mistake with another Jew of color. Again, not that I think she meant any harm, but still, business has to be taken care of.
Oh, and thanks for the link you provided! Very interesting!
I wonder, if I may ask: How long ago did you make aliyah, and from where? Do you have family there? And how do you like it? If Hebrew is not your first language (or one of your first languages), how did you find picking it up? Just curious.
Oh, that’s interesting, because I think I remember him at some point identifying himself as a man. But you know, you could be right, in which case, 3acresandatruck, I apologize.
If I’d met you and been told your name was Carmen and you’re from (uh… where are you from?), I’d be curious as to how did you end up with that name. Were your parents opera fans? Rita Hayworth fans? Would you spell and pronounce it like that “back home”?
If I then found out you were giving me a false name… I’d be pissed out of my ears. It’s paternalistic to say the least, as well as being stupid and unrealistic given the amount of international firstnames Hispanics have been getting for generations.
Cut-the-friendship stuff, that. Don’t assume I can’t say your name right until I’ve at least tried.
Oh, and don’t assume that because you don’t know the Spanish version of your name there isn’t one. Lots of people who call their kid Jennifer are very surprised when I tell them it does have a Spanish version: Ginebra.
Heh - in my Japanese class you got a katakanized version of your name no matter what it was, which is fine for me but sucked the goat ass for Clarence-san.