I think i’ll borrow a page from julius ceaser.
True friends stab you in the front.
Of course, if he aint a true friend, go the fuck ahead and drop him.
He does sound like a jerk to you but, depending on his age, I’d bet his real feelings are somewhere in between what he’s telling you and what he’s telling the girls.
I agree that “sex should be a sacred act” is not a justifiable reason to be mad at someone.
I also wouldn’t be so quick to judge him before the fact. The girl could very easily 1) Be just as on to him as you are, or 2) Want it.
No matter how well you know these girls, you don’t know what they’re thinking.
I’d tell him what you just told us, and then tell him you really don’t have any use for him in your life anymore because you think he’s a disgusting pig and life is too short.
Of course, I have no way of knowing for sure, but based on this statement from the OP:
Engineer Dude may be assuming the girl in question is just like the girls at his church, when she might be anticipating the “popping” just as much as John is. That, plus his statement that sex should be reserved for certain situations, and the use of “deflower,” suggested to me that he is uncomfortable with casual sex, and feels that all these innocent virginal girls must be protected. It just seems kind of condescending to me.
That could be true, certainly. I had assumed from the OP that these girls that John is persuading are similar to the “nice, virginal church girls” (perhaps they are one and the same), but perhaps they are not. Either way, certainly John is behaving like a first class ass when he talks about them in such a way.
Yeah…you might have a point there. I always thought “deflower” was rather a neutral term (neither negative nor positive—just a colorful way of saying “popping one’s cherry”). I think that the OP is erring on the side of caution, figuring that if these girls are still virgins, then they are that way for a reason—like they are waiting for the “right guy,” like a sensitive guy with marriage in mind. He could be wrong about these girls, but he could be right. If he’s wrong, the girls aren’t hurt (but John’s still an ass). If he’s right, the girls are hurt, and John’s still an ass. Either way, John’s an ass.
I didn’t get from his OP that he would have been so concerned or upset had these girls not been virgins who required long periods of “persuasion.” (i.e., they were also into casual sex.) I suspect that if this were the case, the OP still might have ranted about John’s “loose morals,” but the tone of his rant would have been different. Perhaps he would have focused on John’s callous use of the word “bitch” exclusively, but not so much about the sacredness of sex. That’s what I’m getting from the OP, anyway.
I think that the OP’s own moral standards are relevant to the rant to a certain extent, because he assumes (and possibly rightfully so) that these “virginal maidens” share similar values and they are being duped by asshole John.
But, Sam Stone does bring up a good point—perhaps John is all tough talk, and is actually treating these girls quite well. Who knows? I await more information from the OP, about all of this, because of course I don’t really know anything either.
Thanks for all the advice (it has helped me calm down quite a bit), and sorry for the not-so-speedy response; this Memorial Day weekend was pretty busy for me.
I use the term “deflower” simply because it’s a short word that everyone is familiar with, rather than “cause a person to lose their virginity”. I guess I never had the term’s connotation in mind. I do not think sex is a sacred act, I just think that it is a good idea not to put sex on the same level as working out at the gym, since sex will almost invariably cause some level of emotional attachment toward the other person, even if the two parties set out not to have that happen. As far as religion is involved, I consider my view to be fairly moderate, since I also believe that sex need not be reserved for marriage (just two people who enjoy being around each other). But I can understand how my view could be seen as religious and extreme by people like John and whatever people don’t have a problem with casual sex.
I should make a distinction here. The girls that John has sex with are by no means virginal maidens. The girl, or “bitch”, that John desribed this time is a girl that happens to be a virgin, but is by no means on the same moral level as the church girls I describe. It’s just that for whatever reason, I always picture these church girls in my mind whenever John mentions “popping cherries”, (I don’t know why, maybe I’m just a glutton for punishment), which is why I just don’t want to hear about it from him.
That’s a good point; he may be doing it to sound impressive. Sometimes, whenever he talks about his sex life, I get tired with his stories, so I start to go into a nonchalant “cool, yeah, uh-huh” mood. It could be that he thinks I’m hanging on his every word, rather than just filling spaces in the conversation. Instead, maybe I should say things like “heard it before, John” as well as the talking to that you described (but not the flaming that I wanted to do above).
Yeah, I should’ve included some ages in my OP. The girl is in her late teens, I believe, although I never inquired from John what her age is and don’t particularly care. I’m 21, and John’s 20.
That seems like the best way of going about it. Although I disagree with his morals and his way of life, John and I do share common interests such as sports and partying (although not to John’s degree). What I’ll probably do is tell him that his actions bother me (as you suggested, and despite it being painful, as you suggested), and that I don’t want to hear about his flings any more. If he continues talking about them, than then, and only then, will I drop him as a friend (although I can understand why some posters think I should drop him as a friend simply because he’s a jerk).
I dunno about getting him to change his ways. Although by just letting him know about my disagreement with him, perhaps it will influence him to soften up a bit. Not counting on it, though.
You’re probably right. Although Evil Captor’s “tell her parents” suggestion is damn tempting.
I’ve been in a similar situation. My advice:
- Have a talk with the young lady in question.
- Get a whole lot of gone between you and John.
That’s good, catchy advice. Kinda like “click it or ticket”.
Why on earth should the OP “talk to the lady in question?” There is a presumption inherent in that advise that it some somehow Engineer Dude’s personal business who this chick chooses to bone.
There isn’t any question of consent or legality here is there? If not then it’s none of the OP’s business. If he doesn’t like the way his friend talks bout women, then by all means he should say so to the friend, or maybe rethink the value of the friendship, but I see no value in advising him to insinuate himself into the situation by trying to talk to the girl, or warn her or whatever. If the OP’s friend is an asshole, she’ll figure it out for herself but it’s not the OP
s responsibility to safeguard anyone’s hymen.
The importance of this girl’s virginity and the circumstances in which she loses it are judgements which belong to her alone.
I don’t understand the thinking that a broken hymen is some sort of tragedy anyway. So she won’t be a virgin any more. So what?
ahh…DtC always direct and to the point…
In any case, I would wonder if this guy is really the dick he seems to be, or is he just acting the part? Funny thing is I have a few friends like that, but when im with him and his “bitch”, lol, he is a freakin pussy cat. Yea when its just us he talks shit, but I just scratch it off to guy talk. If your friend is a good person in every other way, I would expect hes just talking because he thinks guys should talk like that. And “guys” do talk like that, “men” dont.
See, now maybe I’m old fashioned, but I tend to think that sex is sex. So, your opening with the fact that the young lady in question has already taken your pal to the heights of oral delight leads me to believe that her ‘deflowering’ is not nearly the big deal to her that it is to you.
The only situation that would worry me would be if you suspected that he was doing more than persuade her into intimacy- that there was coerciaon involved. If that’s not the case, why bother? It is a lesson that I learned long aog, after a lot of heartbreak.
btw- to the OP- got a sister? Because I might have some bad news for you.
Only child (thank God), but I’m pretty sure I know what you’re getting at.
If she is 17 or under, then my advice changes. Tell her parents then.
Otherwise, generally butt out, altho a small talk with your freind (“Dude, sometimes the way you talk about women makes me a bit uncomfortable…”) isn’t a bad idea. 