Classic Dio, Deny reality and substitute your own.
Only one of those mentions conjugal exclusivity by the way, and as a third definition at that. Fidelity means, faithfulness to one’s promises or obligations. It’s usage in American slang doesn’t invalidate my definition of the term, which is more accurate at any rate. Feel free to keep using the “my post is my cite” method though.
The OP mentioned that he isn’t satisfied, but would like to keep his vows. Those of us in open relationships are explaining to him that such promises only hold weight between the partners themselves who are open to interpret, redefine, or release one another from them. Why do YOU seem to feel that the only solution is to pull up his grandpa britches and deal? You made yer bed sonny, now you lie in it!
Nothing bothers me at all about a fulfilling monogamous relationship. Indeed, I am well aware that this is the current societal standard and we are in the minority. One that is viewed as strange, perverted, or immoral by many at that. The OP and his wife need to have a discussion about the situation though, because obviously his needs are not being met. A marriage is an equal partnership and he has the right to male accommodation with his spouse. Our solution IS a very real, fulfilling, and plausible way to rectify the issue. Just because you don’t agree with it, doesn’t mean you get to shut down every person who has found another way of doing things.
Maybe it’s just because I have a fairly high sex drive, but I can’t imagine this being an acceptable arrangement if I were on the receiving end of only climaxing 1/3 of the time I had sex with anyone, let alone my husband. Is she having difficulty being aroused enough to be interested? Are you spending enough time on foreplay? Has she ever masturbated, or is she interested in trying to figure out how to better reach orgasm during each session? You may find a slightly more interested spouse with a higher libido if she’s able to climax during every session at least once. Many women can’t reach orgasm through PIV stimulation, so you may have to spend more time getting her to reach orgasm via other methods before the both of you engage in penetrative sex.
Additionally, how does she feel about her own body? Does she think her genitals are ugly, awkward, or just plain gross? You may be in for an uphill battle if the main issue in her lack of interest and inability to reach orgasm is psychological.
See, this is where a narrow snapshot that can be presented on a forum is incredibly misleading. I have done nothing BUT try to get her to be more of a sexual person. She doesn’t masturbate because she doesn’t want to. I’ve thrown every kind of tool at her short of a Sybian and they do nothing for her. She gets to a point where things get too sensitive too early, and go numb too late.
Believe me, I’ve researched the heck out of this, it is not due to a lack of trying or insensitivity on my part. There are times when she gets hers first, and times where she gets hers second and a lot of times where it’s either ‘for me’ (which is kind of a turn-off), or she doesn’t want to continue after I’ve climaxed.
People who claim not to be interested in open non-monogamy are generally only that way because they refuse to educate themselves on the subject, or have been subjected to religious brainwashing. It’s a good thing to try to fight this kind of ignorance. Monogamy is not the natural state of humanity; it is not possible for one person to satisfy every single one of anybody else’s sexual needs.
People keep trying to stuff themselves and their partners into monogamy-sized boxes, and wonder why they’re sexless and divorcing 15 (or fewer) years later. It’s something that’s so easily remedied with more partners and less jealousy. Why should we NOT advocate this?
Advocate it to single people. Teach it to teenagers. Don’t make a monogamously married man crazy.
Honest question: have you ever seen a monogamous marriage - between people who are unaware of polygamy in a positive sense - successfully opened later? I haven’t, and I have tons of poly friends (and, again, am poly myself.) If those conversations aren’t present before the marriage, they’re exceedingly unlikely to be successful later.
I meant, conversations between people while they’re dating/before they’re married. As in, “I’m intrigued with the notion of polyamory and think we should try it out.”
Some of my parents are poly, actually, but we didn’t have conversations about it until my ex and I started dating and I was contemplating the poly choice for us. It was just a non-issue when I was growing up. I knew they had “roommates”, but I didn’t even consider whether they were sleeping with or dating them, so I never thought to ask. They would have answered honestly if I had, but it never came up, so they didn’t bring it up. I didn’t know their marriage was open until I was a teenager - I just knew there were other cool grown-ups around I could depend on.
ETA: Don’t get me wrong, I think polyamory is a good solution to many couple’s issues, and I’m far more in favor of open marriages than cheating (although the two are not exclusive, of course. You can be poly and still cheat.). I’ve just never seen a real indication from you that you’re poly, and so the harping on it in this thread seems…off. If you think it’s right for you and your wife, of course you should try it, but just be exceedingly careful - there are a lot of emotional and logistical landmines in opening up a previously monogamous marriage.
You’re not talking to the right people, obviously!
You and your wife have significant libido mismatches, which is unfortunate but common.
It’s good you’ve been able to talk about it, and be open to trying some things to cope with the situation.
Whatever arrangements a couple can work out openly and honestly to deal with such situations are okay in my book. The honesty is the key part.
Dan Savage and his podcasts are a great resource for how to deal openly and honestly with such issues, and also pretty good at pointing out the consequences when folks aren’t open and honest.
Hey, weh we talked about it, it really got my mind going in a good way. I mean, heck, who WOULDN’T want a new playtoy after 15 years? Especially when you considered you’d never get to add another notch to the bedpost.
The problem as I see it is keeping sex sex and love love, plus the seriously risky act of pulling a third person into the bedroom, you then have to consider what negatives THEY might bring to the situation.
I’ve heard Savage recommend trying swinger’s clubs for couples like you. Not to actually have sex with others, but to watch the activity and flirting go on all around. It seems to have a positive effect on a lot of people’s low libidos.
Some of these folks progress onto things like “watch and be watched” with other couples.
Some of course progress further and succeed or fail or have other outcomes, depending on their circumstances.
When I’m in a relationship with someone, I orgasm with each of our encounters. Random hook ups? Na, as us women are fickle creatures who sometimes need specific buttons pushed on the launch code. . . but I sort of expect my partner to know what those buttons are.
Actually, yes. I’m friends with oodles of swingers and some of them certainly started with an open marriage, I’d say just as many had no idea it was an option, then opened up. In fact, two very good friends had it suggested to them *by their marriage councilor * and now they have one of the happiest, healthiest marriages of all my friends.
Don’t get me wrong: there are also the couples where one partner is very clearly forcing (I use that term very loosely, but you know what I mean) the other to have an open marriage, but I’d say those are the exception, not the rule. As far as long term success, I guess I can’t say if swingers have lower divorce rates than “vanilla” people, but they generally seem pretty happy :D.
I’m very glad to hear that. I wouldn’t put swinging in the same category as polyamory, myself, but I’m glad your friends worked things out to their satisfaction.
Do whatever you want. I don’t care. But spare the the sanctimonious, sophomoric bullshit about how you’re really just so much more evolved than the norm.
You’re right, of course. But is anyone suggesting to the OP that he actually get an actual girlfriend? That’s polyamory to me. It sounded to me like people were suggesting an open sexual relationship to the OP, which is more in line with the swinging. There are definitely men in the swinger groups who have permission to play (and it’s verified with the wives-- the swingers tend to be VERY judgey of cheaters, banning them from activities) as single men, without their partners. NSA sex= swinger stuff, less poly.
I meant, conversations between people while they’re dating/before they’re married. As in, “I’m intrigued with the notion of polyamory and think we should try it out.”