Lost 1.3: "Tabula Rasa" (some unboxed spoilers)

Managed to get hold of a tape and see it last night, and I had the same problem. I put myself in that position, unlikely as it may seem. Sure, I’m upset. I’m so upset I don’t even want the cigarette I just took out … but a true nicotine addict would never discard one of a finite amount of cigarettes on a beach where it could be obscured by blowing sand or (even worse) stepped on and shredded by another survivor.

I think only smokers can truly understand this, but I also think the smokers will agree with us, Dooku. :slight_smile:

So, it seems Kate told Jack about the repeating signal, but not about the bear. I’d think that a polar bear on a South Pacific island is just as important, as long as we’re sharing …

And I really like StarvingButStrong’b political activist idea. Makes Kate a murderer without the real intent.

For not reading the thread, or for using the joke that was made in post #7? :slight_smile:

“hungry bellies think alike”

Antonius Block, I certainly concede your point. Sayid also mentioned laptops and we can assume at least someone has a PDA that does trig functions. I think it’s also safe to assume that there are maps in the cockpit. Combined they should be able to figure a decent approximation for latitude and longitude. If I am ever stuck on a desert island, I’d like to be stuck there with you… At least an attractive female version of you.

However, I think this last episode is a good example of where the show is heading. It’s not going to be about “wilderness survival”. How are they feeding 47 people? Where is their excrement going? The show is not too concerned about it. It’s more concerned with character background and interaction and the mystery of the island’s wildlife. The reality is that this is a prospective series, not a mini-series, and we will not see them get off the island anytime soon, or ever, unless the show is cancelled. The whole scene with Sayid’s presentation avec flaming stick was just ugly exposition for the benefit of new viewers.

Rod Serling.

Well, a creepy, modern version of Rod Serling without the cigarette.

Again, what is preventing him from picking it up moments later, and smoking it? This was just one brief scene. We don’t see what happens moments later. Sawyer threw his cigarette down in frustration after he had trouble with his lighter. He was stressed. He just shot a man in the chest, which didn’t kill, and he was listening to a man suffer because of it. Plus, there is obviously some other personal demons banging inside his head. Throwing a cigarette down makes perfect sense when put in context.

Excellent points Saranga! The Producers have stated this as well. The show is really about the main characters, not wilderness survival 101. This isn’t Mark Trail: The Series. :wink:

I know I’ve said this before, but I really, really hope the producers made a deal with the actor who plays Hurley to gradually lose weight over the course of this season. It wouldn’t make sense for the character not to, and it will be really cool to watch.

Has such a thing ever been done in series television before? With an actor who really started out fat, not with a fat suit.

Wow, wouldn’t that be interesting! Real time seems to be progressing rather slowly on the show. There have been 3 episodes and only 3 days have passed. If they keep this pace up, they could go an entire season with only a couple weeks passing. In this scenario, weight loss wouldn’t be an issue for Hurley.

Hmm, well see. :wink:

I take it you don’t smoke? :slight_smile: The mere possibility of something happening to it would be enough to prevent him from throwing it like that. Examples: sand getting in it, it had just rained, if it gets wet, forget it, it was dark and windy so he might not find it, if he threw it too hard it might break upon release, etc etc. Bottom line, no smoker throws an unlit cigarette away in frustration for any reason. Especially if there’s a chance that they’re not getting anymore cigarettes for a long time.

Plus, he didn’t just throw it on the ground in front of him, he wildly hurled it and didn’t even pay attention to where it went.

A minor point, obviously, but still…

Because it’s **defined ** to be so. Before 1884, people did indeed set their clocks according to “local solar noon”, but then Greenwich Mean Time was established as the international reference point. Cecil has a Straight Dope column about this here. What this means is that “noon” in Sydney is no longer determined directly by where the sun is in the sky, but by a globally-agreed upon slicing of the world into “time zones”. This makes life much easier for all concerned. So it doesn’t matter that Sydney isn’t exactly 150 degrees east of Greenwich. “Sydney time” i.e. the time that all official clocks, airport clocks, radio and TV clocks strive to be accurate to, is exactly GMT+10, not GMT+10 and a few minutes. There’s an hour difference for Daylight Saving Time, when relevant, but that can be accounted for.

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That would have been the correct usage before 1884. Nowadays, if you’re meeting someone for lunch at noon, do you get out your sextant and take a solar reading or simply meet when your watch says it’s 12:00?

But it is exactly GMT+10 (correct for DST if applicable). That’s the beauty of the post-1884 system!

I can’t tell you when the sun is at its highest, but I can tell you when your watch reads 12:00. For instance, right now it’s 11:45am Pacific Time. You’re on the East Coast, right, Trunk? OK, through the magic of the system I know that your watch says 2:45pm, even though I don’t know exactly where you’re located! Now, imagine that you woke up today with amnesia, and are suddenly “LOST” in your own location. You somehow let me know that the sun was at its highest today at 12:53pm, according to your watch which you know is set to Eastern Daylight Time. I can calculate that your Longitude is about 76 degrees and 36 minutes West (I hope my math is correct, I’m a bit rushed at the moment).

Put it another way: let’s imagine that two of the “LOST” survivors are from Maine and Ohio, and that due to forgetfulness they haven’t adjusted their watches since leaving home. Their watches will read the same, and be potentially just as useful as any other watch on the island, provided that they know that the watch is set for Eastern Standard (or Daylight, as applicable) Time. It doesn’t matter when the sun is at its zenith in Maine or Ohio, because since 1884 that’s not how we keep time. However, if you’re “LOST”, you can use your watch to calculate your longitude rather accurately.

All of that said, I agree that this is not going to happen on the series. My posts are in the spirit of fighting ignorance to the meager extent that I can.

Wouldn’t the series be different if the plane was full of Dopers returning from a G’Dopefest in Sydney, huh? Qadgop the Mercotan would have fixed up the injured Marshal better than Jack, I bet. We’d have Latitude and Longitude by the second day. The corpses would have been disposed of. We’d have fixed the transceiver and rigged up batteries from the surviving cell phones / laptops / PDAs to keep it running.

Colibri would be showing us what is edible in a rainforest. Polycarp would be providing, oh, let’s see, many fishes (someone would be spearing fish!). And so on – but that’s another thread (LOSTdope)?.

From the IMDB trivia listing for Cast Away (2000):

Not quite the same as gradually losing it over a series run, but still…

You say the corpses would’ve been disposed of?
Never heard of the Donner party have you?
Slowly roasted…or salt cured is my question?

Polar bears live 25 to 30 years according to the Oregon Zoo, so it seems possible the bear is from the other crash/incident.

I appreciate your thorough response, but I apparently didn’t make my question clear (or misunderstood your original point). Obviously the world is divided into 24 time zones, and ignoring the exceptions Cecil describes, everyone in the world is exactly some “x” hours offset from Greenwich.

I thought you were claiming that someone on the island would easily know their longitude simply by noting the time on their watch when the sun was at its highest point on the island. That knowledge is necessary but not sufficient – the islander also needs to know the offset from Greenwich of the time zone that their watch is set to. The rescuers would certainly know this, but not most of the islanders.

(And of course, Dopers would know because we all set our vBulletin time stamps as an offset to GMT. :slight_smile: )

Actually, I’ve been a smoker for 19 years and counting (ugh!). Throwing a cigarette on sand, no matter how hard, isn’t going to damage it enough to be unsmokable.

I’ve dried out a wet cigarette, and smoked it.

I’ve lit the wrong end of a cigarette, and smoked it.

I’ve re-attached a broken cigarette, and smoked it (many times).

Hell, I’ve even be known to fish other peoples cigarette butts out of ashtrays… and smoked 'em! :eek:

Where there is a will, there is way! :wink:

Most of the islanders don’t need to know this, only one. He/she can explain the situation to the others. Many of them may not understand or give a damn, but they won’t be the ones doing the calculations. Sayid probably knows, as would anyone who travels internationally frequently. Someone on an Oz-US flight must either be a regular world traveler, or at least have a guidebook (“Frommer’s Australia”?) which would have this info in the first chapter. In any case, as has been already been agreed upon, even if they can’t do the math, just the raw data that they can get will be sufficient, including (as I said in post #36) where the watch was last set.

As an aside, I’m sort of surprised (but not really) that we haven’t seen more (or even any?) Aussies among the 48 (now 47). Yes I know it’s a US show, but Aussies (and Kiwis) are renowned world travelers and I’d expect a Sydney-LA flight to have dozens of them. Of course we may meet them later, or it may be a whole “Saving Private Ryan” thing. I’m aware that this is drama, not a documentary, I’m just askin’.

Keep in mind that there are a whole lot of dead people to account for, too. The survivors are not necessarily going to be a representative sample of who all was on the plane. They just happened to be the ones lucky enough to be sitting in the right place. For all we know, all the dead folks were Aussies.

BTW What airlines was this? I didn’t think Qantas ever crashed. Must’ve been A/A.

The pregnant woman is Australian, isn’t she?

It’s “Oceanic Airlines” which, by virtue of being nonexistent, reduces the possibility of lawsuits. Apparently “Oceanic” was also used in the movie “Executive Decision”, so it seems to have a history of danger. Avoid it like the plague in future!
And whatever you do, keep away from wherever Jessica Fletcher is staying this week!

The fictitious “Oceanic” airlines. I think it’d be a hard sell to any real world airline to show one of their airplanes crashing (over and over again) in a network TV show! :slight_smile:

I remember seeing Oceanic before, though, in a movie maybe… Maybe “Executive Decision” or something like that.

EZ