“But the wearing is slow in Lorien,” said Frodo. "The power of the Lady is on it. Ric are the hours, though short they seem, in Caras Galadon, where–well, I’ll be damned. It says Galadriel, not Gandalf!
Never mind. :smack:
Dwimmer also appears in Dwimeredon–have forgotten what place ir refers to (sometimes this everything having 6 names bugs me)…
Theoden is coming back to “life” at present. I keep expecting the book to switch back and forth between Frodo/Aragorn/Ents, but it doesn’t (not really).
As opposed to Dwimmer Lake, which was the Nazguls’ nickname for the Sea of Nurnen, back when they went skinny-dipping in it with the orcs before Sauron got his attitude…
(Anyone that inspires to fanfic, I’ll deny any influence whatsoever! :p)
Well, dude, they were pretty high level by that point. Those Bracers of Protection probably had a pretty high bonus to AC, and Boromir’s player had obviously dropped out of the game, 'cause he didn’t roll up another character…
I never understood that take on it; it’s entirely contrary to Aragorn’s character. I took it as “I should take something of his back to his father. These are easiest to carry.”
In the book, IIRC, Boromir’s body survives its plunge over the Falls of Rauros (sp?) and is found by a Gondor patrol downriver. In the movie, Faramir has a dream where he sees his brother’s body on the boat, but it is only the shattered horn of the Kine of Araw that is eventually delivered to Denethor, who has it in his lap when Gandalf comes calling.
Close. In the book, Boromir’s body survives its plunge, but is seen only by Faramir, who is bemused by what he sees and thinks he is dreaming; the boat (swamped but still afloat) continues downriver and is believed to have reached the sea. Both halves of Boromir’s horn are indeed found and returned to Denethor.
OK, since there seems to be no shortage of nitpicky Silmarillion knowledge…
It always bugged me that there appeared to be two Glorfindels (one in the Silmarillion, and one at the Ford [Rivendell, ringwraiths, lotsa water, etc.]).
I seem to remember the Silmarillion one being pretty darn powerful, as (I think) he killed a Balrog to get out of the Hidden City (name escapes me…) in Beleriand. I don’t remember if he was killed in the act.
Then there’s the one at the Ford…if it’s the same guy, I’d have expected him to whomp all over the ringwraiths.
It seems sloppy for Tolkien to use the same name twice…I don’t think he does it elsewhere.
And mark me down as one tally on the “Bombadil is an avatar of Illuvatar” sheet.
I’d have to go digging, but I think that Tolkien worked his way to rationalizing that it was, indeed, the same Glorfindel. (Might have been in his collected letters.)
Anyway, it is assumed that after Glorfindel died fighting the Balrog in Gondolin, he was “re-bodied” in the Halls of Mandos – and then caught a ride back to Middle-Earth with the Istari. Or maybe with the host that brought down Morgoth.
The Nazgul seem to be about on a par with a Balrog, threat-wise, and Glorfindel explicitly was at the Ford to find Frodo because Elrond knew he was one of the few elves who could hope to meet a Ringwraith and survive. But even if he could have defeated one Ringwraith as he’d done with a Balrog, he’d’ve probably died again – and he was up against all nine, anyway.
Nonetheless, I think that the use of Arwen at the Ford in the movie is actually an improvement over Tolkien bringing in Glorfindel – who is, in LotR, just one more guy with a too-complicated backstory for his cameo appearance to warrant.
I’ll mention that I have not seen any of the movies…just lazy. I’m a huge, huge fan of the books, though.
Lightray, I’m not buying the reembodiment angle (nothing personal!). If that was the case, then why didn’t Mandos ship a couple thousand Eldar over during the Eldar’s long decline?
I don’t know if I’d peer the Nazgul and the Balrogs, either. One group was Maiar, and the Nazgul were Kings of Men, no? That’s one heck of a promotion conferred upon them by Sauron.
I forget who initially posted it, but I also love the idea that, in the past, the Eldar were far stronger than in LOTR-time. The Men were stronger, the dragons bigger, etc. It gives the LOTR an immediate feeling of despair (maybe too strong a word), or the true meaning of the word ‘nostalgic’.
Not hardly. The Nazgul’s power was largely in their ability to instill fear, which is why Aragorn could stand up to them with some success. (Although even he admitted he didn’t know why they ran from him on Weatertop.) (I personally think they left because they simply didn’t care; they had accomplished their intention, which was simply to wound Frodo so he, too, would slowly turn wraithlike and under their control, and thus saw no point in bothering with Strider. But as to their being on a par with a Balrog–no way. Can you imagine Aragorn standing up to even one? I’d say the set of persons still living in Middle-Earth who could do so consisted of Gandalf, Glorfindel, Elrond, and possibly Galadriel.
I must disagree. The problem with using Arwen as PJ does is that it entirely undercuts Frodo’s accomplishment in defying the Ringwraiths armed with nothing but balls.
Quoting Skald, re the Flight to the Ford: “I must disagree. The problem with using Arwen as PJ does is that it entirely undercuts Frodo’s accomplishment in defying the Ringwraiths armed with nothing but balls.” So True! When I reread LOTR, the moment Frodo faces the Black Riders alone and says “You shall neither the ring nor me” is one of the best in the whole trilogy.
(And is the desire to own the ring himself already stirring deep within Frodo, even at this point?)
As I’ve said, I love the movies despite everything, but I really didn’t like the downplaying of Frodo’s character. In the films he comes across as strong when Gandalf tells him about the ring, and at the Council of Elrond, but that’s about it. Oh well.
1420 was a good year for the Shire, but then, it was a good year for pretty much everyone, all around. It’s not due to Sam’s selfless use of Galadriel’s gift (at least, not entirely: That surely helped), but to the fact that the Great Evil was overthrown, and the World was healing from it.
As for Bombadil, I think the best answer is the one given by Goldberry: “Who is Bombadil?” “He is.”. If you insist on fitting him into a category, he’s in the category of “Beings who are Tom Bombadil”.
It is great. It was a thread like this that got me hooked.
It is possible that he was just reborn in Middle Earth isn’t it? Elves were supposed to be reincarnated IIRC. They spend a little time in the Halls of Mandos, and then pop back into the world. I always assumed that the path they took for this was through someone’s vagina rather than fully formed. If so, it could explain him being the same guy, yet a bit less powerful for the experience.
Also, I have always seen that current of sadness in Tolkein. A constant struggle of good against evil while both are descending into mediocrity.
If I recall, they were split into two groups at that point and the group attacking did not include the witch-king. Also, they were severely depleted in power because they were so far from Mordor and without the One Ring Sauron’s power waned greatly as distance from him increased. Also, they figured they had him stuck there and there was no real chance of escape. That combined with the wound they had already dealt made them decide not to bother. Man did they screw up.
