I think it’s interesting that in our last game, when I made my bullcrap claim and you were highly suspicious of it, you very emphatically demanded that there should be no counterclaim. But here you are calling for a counter.
I am curious as to why.
And since I am off today.
What story said.
If anyone claims vanilla in this game I say we lynch them. 
Aren’t Witches a self confirming role? If he isn’t really a Witch I think the other witches will probably let us know and he won’t be long for this world.
I highly doubt Nanook is lying. Each scum group has too many enemies in this game for it to be worth it to throw one overboard to idenify a witch. Let’s say he was wolf. His claim would hurt the wolves (as he would get found out sooner rather than later), slightly hinder the town, really help the cabal, and help the undead. This just isn’t a good tradeoff. I suppose is possible that he is cabal trying to out a witch, However, the witches would already know who he was then, and could probably deal with him on their own.
I wouldn’t have expected a real witch to claim truthfully on the first Day. Just like we were discussing with the mass role claims, the real witches need to stay hidden for as long as possible. So color me incredulous that a real witch would just say so on Day One. Something smells fishy to me.
Vis-a-vis the confirmable claim, pending an eventual outing if it is false, I will remove my Nanook vote.
Unvote Nanook..
Now, this leaves me w/out a vote, and eventual danger of a lynch. Hrm. And I do like storyteller’s point on OAOW. You did, and I will have to refresh my memory here, tell the town if anyone was a detective, to leave be. Why do you want another witch to pop out? Worst case, we have 2 witches visible…best case 1 witch and one Non-town (as I cannot see a townie lying about being a witch). Is that a trade off worth it this early in the game? Nanook will be confirmable in the future at some point.
In the other game, when you were claiming inv results, if one of those was subsequently killed, we immediately find out if their alignment matches what you said. here there is a delay. Also, Witches are a team role.
Again this relates to the delay, a lying scum can string us along for quite a while, and even if we test them, we don’t find out for a couple of game days.
Nah. The mass role claims and the present situation are entirely different. In the context of a mass claim, a Witch would lie because (s)he would be expected to, and because (s)he would be in no immediate danger. This is different. A Witch needs to stay alive first, stay hidden second. If Nanook is, in fact, a Witch, any claim other than Witch might have led him to the gallows post-haste, or forced a second Witch to claim in his support. That would have been much worse than simply outing himself but having various protections to fall back upon.
Could this be a false claim? Sure, it could. We should remain vigilant, and open to lynching Nanook if the slightest evidence surfaces that he is lying. But this is not Cecilvania - no matter what Nanook is, he now has a target on his back. To at least some, and possibly all, of the scum groups, he is either a Witch or an enemy. There are enough ways that he can be discovered if he’s lying that a counterclaim at this point would be grossly unproductive.
And you know what? It’s early, and I’m tired of waiting on votes:
vote OneandOnlyWanderers, pending an explanation of why his opinion on counterclaims has changed so dramatically from the last game to this one.
You mean the explanation that is directly above your post?
Yeah, but so what? I don’t really see the relevance of this. Honestly, I don’t want to discuss that aspect of the game any further, as it is stil in progress and anything I say could affect gameplay over there; it was bad form to bring it up in the first place. So let’s just concentrate on the why-you-would-encourage-a-counter thing without reference to the previous game. Is that fair? Sorry about that.
I also don’t see what this has to do with anything.
Here’s the problem: from the standpoint of a scum group, a counterclaim would absolutely rock in this spot. Think about it. You’re a Wolf (let’s say). Somebody claims Witch. Somebody else (not a Wolf) counterclaims. Well, now you know that you’ve definitely identified a Witch, and also definitely identified either a Cabalite or an Undead. Which is a great situation to be in as you try to plan out a strategy that puts you ahead of both Town and your others enemies.
My vote stands, pending a more thorough re-read of Wanderers’ activities so far.
What, “I’m a Witch”.
That’s it.
No PM, no mention of which witch you are?
Sorry, currently not buying it Nanook.
I will quite happily say, that the Witches should not counter or confirm at this point in time. Certainly not without a little more info from Nanook.
I’m going to ponder some tests for our claimed Witch, but for the moment, my vote stands.
Wait, this is making even less sense. First of all, if Nanook is lying, I’m guessing he’s as capable as anyone of copying and pasting the Witch PM from Pleo’s Google Doc into a reply box. I don’t understand for one moment why posting a PM has any relevance whatsoever.
And why should he tell us which witch he is, if he is indeed a witch? What possible pro-Town use could there be to that information? Especially given that we don’t actually know for certain:
- That the witches have individual roles like last time;
- That, if they do, there is any difference among them in terms of powers;
or
- That their powers, if tied to their individual roles, are the same as or similar to last time.
I suppose we could ask for a full and complete claim, but frankly I’m not seeing the value here. He’s claimed Witch, which is ultimately confirmable at some point. Giving out additional information on who he is and what he can do, if he’s telling the truth, benefits the scum groups and definitely not the Town.
Geez, can I vote for both of them?
I’ll keep my vote where it is, but strong additional Finger of I Think You Might be Scum After All in the direction of CatinaSuit.
Like what, pouring a bucket of water on him to see if he melts?
Any possibility of testing his claimed witchly powers would mean he’d have to somehow survive beyond tomorrow’s Dawn, which seems unlikely no matter what alignment he is.
And now it begins. If we believe Nanook then it has to be in the town’s best interest to remove a vote for him. Losing a witch by lynch would be really bad. Even being exposed the rest of the coven can protect him at night or play WIFOM with the scum.
So now, we move on …
I come back to what I posted long ago. What roles are worth what? Where do we draw the line after a witch, coroner, vivar, warlock, etc. claim (it would be rather helpful if the wolves, cabal and undead - if all factions are in play - would truthfully claim)?
And if there are multiple claims (since my PM said a not the) does a counter claim with the original confirmed result in insta lynch?
And since it takes two Days for the role to be confirmed what goes on in the intervening time.
Just keep stacking the bodies in the corner hoping that the Nec doesn’t do a brain conversion or what?
unvote nanook
<Snipped>
Thank you, I needed this. It made me laugh out loud.
Nanook: Do you, or do you not have a special secret power?
Well, crap. A confirmable, vital role. One that paints a target on your back from every scum faction, except your own, assuming you’re not undead. I’m willing to assume that you’re not an idiot, which means if you’re town, you’re telling the truth, and you’re not undead, with no knowledgeable teammates to support your claim. If you’re a wolf, you’re still out on a limb, as you’ll have a hard time showing results, though you will have added a Day or two to your longevity, and maybe will be able to reduce the number of your enemies in that time.
If you’re cabal, you’re trying to get a real witch or two to expose themselves. The issue here is the size of the cabal. If there are enough of them, one claiming witch, and perhaps even one confirming him may be worthwhile to expose the witches to nightkills. After all that’s the only anti-town thing the cabal care about, they have same win condition as the town, except they’re alive and the witches are dead.
I doubt the cabal is large enough to take the risk, but I can’t be certain. I can be certain that lynching a witch would be a bad way to start the game. I still don’t like your inconsistency earlier, and does lessen my ability to trust your statements. However, I’m going to:
unvote Nanook of the North Shore
and reread.
peekercpa, that makes a lot of sense now that I think about it. A witch is absolutely the worst thing someone could false claim, because ALL the scum factions want the witches dead. **Nanook ** just painted a giant bullseye on his back if he’s not a real witch that could be protected by the other witches.
unvote Nanook
Cat, I will not be providing you with that information. I see no good reason that you need it, and I can see possibilities for it to be beneficial to scum. I find it interesting that you’re willing to vote a confirmable, pro-town role. Cabal? Wolf maybe? I could see either of those factions being willing to take a shot on losing a member for the chance to lynch a Witch.
Vote CIAS
Drain, I, myself, do not. I will say nothing further on that topic, for reasons which should be obvious to all.
Cookies, that was freakin funny. 
Why do you say that? If his claim is believed by a protector role, he is the obvious one to protect toNight.