Mrs Hudson's teatime gathering - Mafia penut gallery [No Spoilers]

The Game Room
1

NO SPOILERS - NO LIVING ACTIVE PLAYERS!

With Storyteller’s permission I am starting the peanut gallery thread. This is for observers to pass comment on the game, ask questions, discuss the game mechanics, make wild arse guesses and generally enjoy the game.

Active players must stay out.

Dead players are welcome, Mrs Hudson makes an excellent breakfast ideal for the morning after the night before, however decorum must be maintained and you may not reveal any spoilers or hidden knowledge. Hence the big No Spoilers in the title and at the top of this post.

A selection of teas and some fine bacon butties are available just over there.

2

And to kick things off;

Interesting mechanic with no night time, everything happening during the day, I wonder if it will keep the pace up and it keeps the action going. The individual Role PMs to help prevent handshaking is a nice touch.

What’s the take on the piece of information everyone will have. If someone reveals something that can be demonstrated to be false, either they are town or lying scum who lied about their piece of information so that doesn’t really help much.
Revealing something that is true is not much of a tell, unless somehow you can make a determination if it is a pro town or pro scum piece of information. Either way it certainly gives something to talk about and kick of discussion.

3

I REALLY want to say things, but obviously can’t. I will just say that I’m mildly surprised by how much revelation of clues has occurred already on Day One.

4

I’m not.
Actually, I would have considered there would be more sharing. But then again, I don’t have a clue myself and the contents of such a clue might cue to me do something different, but I would lean towards sharing.
Clues are volatile information. Sharing volatile information is generally good.
I guess I don’t understand the reticence. If the clues are an unknown ‘gotcha’ then that would be a weak setup. I doubt the game would hinge on whether or not someone revealed a clue. The idea that a town clue would inform scum to the identity Holmes would be very bad game design and seems like unnecessary paranoia.

I am shocked at the anti-Pizza sentiment. I myself have endeavored in anti-Pizza ranting, but that was mainly due to a bit of snootiness and irritation rather than actual reasoning. Pizza’s random vote is hardly worth bothering about and yet there is way too much discussion about it. Personally, my read is that those who poopoo Pizza’s random vote, and possibly even threaten to vote him or express desire to vote him, but DON’T vote him this early are my top candidates for scum. It seems to me that scum are fanning the Pizza flames but aren’t willing to start an actual bandwagon.

5

Again, I just want to point out that the actual rules say that public reveal of clues can be a Bad Thing ™ for the revealing side.

6

Just occurred to me scum can coordinate as everything takes place in the day, I think most games I have played Scum have been restricted to night talk only. Will be interesting to see how things swing close to a lynch. Then again, it was always town bouncing back and forth panicking over a tied lynch whilst scum sat back and laughed at the futile vote swapping analysis.

On clues - I suppose “can be a bad thing” does not mean “is always a bad thing”
Probably best not answer that Story, I am just thinking out loud and some people my be accidently seeing this thread.

Chronos CLUE: James Moriarty, the Scum leader, can lose his Godfather status under some conditions.
So the options may be;
Town and true clue - so a power role or a game mechanism ( recruitment ? doubt it, scum choice if Moriarty is on the lynch list?) can cause scum leader to loose a power. Down side of reveal, maybe Mr Moriarty and his wasn’t aware and now knows they need to tread carefully as he is not guaranteed to turn up town with an investigation. upside town may know if they get Moriarty the godfather is still out there. I suppose we will have to wait and see what is revealed on a lynch and death of town.

Town and False - may cause town to be confused and worry that when they get Moriarty , the godfather may be still out there and hence still be suspicious of “investigated town”

Scum - true - Scum know that Moriarty can loose GF status, but don’t know how and so are assuming a role is out there and are fishing for someone to hint they know this to be a true clue and so must have something to do with it. Downside - town knows they can get Moriarty if the investigator and blocker’ or whatever the power is that causes M to loose GF status work together in the end game?

Scum - false - Chronos intentionally lying about his clue (scum get only true clues I think) and sowing additional confusion, hoping for a glimmer of a role reveal by someone and also hoping to get more clue reveals out of town. Ballsy move if so. Obviously no downside as he has lied and not revealed his own clue.

PCM - Confused/overthinking/thinking poorly - most likely outcome.

Dizzy MrsLizzy
CLUE: Scum players have all been given complete, detailed false identities, including clues.
Town True - cant think of a downside of revealing, then again not all clue reveals may have a downside.
Town False - If scum have to reveal then no one will question the made up false identity as they would believe it is a Mod given false identity thus examine it less.
Scum true - Wouldn’t really be a clue as they already know it as they have the false identity. Unless the clue in the false identity is this? Layers upon layers
Scum false - Scum lying about the clue and figure it would be good to get out there so town do not examine any scum revealed identities too closely.

Most likely - PCM is less perceptive than Lestrade

Time for a healthy shot of gin in this tea.

7

I draw a distinction between ‘bad thing’ and ‘game breaking.’

8

I think we’ve played long enough that her argument about Mahaloth shows serious holes and I have a hard time reconciling it either way. She seems to say that Mahaloth had to know full well that clue reveals is a ‘bad thing,’ but is trying to get town to do it anyway. We’ve seen this argument before so many times! I feel like I should write up my dissection of this argument and save it for future cut and paste.

No way does a scummy Mahaloth both know clue reveals is a bad idea and suggests it. If clue reveals is so obviously bad as sinjin states, then scummy Mahaloth would know its bad and not dare try and steer the conversation that way. Town isn’t stupid and won’t act simply on Mahaloth’s say-so.

That said. Historically, the person who does this kind of illogic tends to be town.

9

Agree, a scummy Malahoth would be talking to the rest of the scum and discussing what they should do. It is unlikely they would all agree that Mal should go out and push something that may not benefit town. Lie lowish and see how town ties themselves in knots and give the odd nudge in the wrong direction.
More likely Malahoth was just putting out a train of thought and not reading all the posts.
Sinjin, could be scum trying to pin a case on a town, Agree though mostly likely a town who thinks they have found something.

More Clues

Gnarly Charlie

CLUE: All ties are resolved via random.org.

Septimus
CLUE: One Scum player, a woman, has a power that targets protective roles. If her target is protected, the player doing the protecting will die.

10

I’m so lousy at this game. So I appreciate the read-along! Hopefully I can learn.

Here’s my question: is Dizzymrslizzy’s clue saying anything at all? No, **story **hasn’t explicitly said in the rules that scum get cover roles (which I’ve seen in previous games), but it is a pretty common mechanic. As a town player, I’d kind of expect it, even if it wasn’t explicitly said. And we already know from the rules that scum get clues anyway. The fact that they also might get false clues maybe adds another facet, but I don’t really see how. And if they did get some false clues too, doesn’t that just make it easier for them to lie? They don’t even have to think up anything. Seems weird to me - her “clue” reads all kinds of wonky.

I don’t like the “skimming is a scum tell” mechanic either, but it’s true that **Mahaloth **missed explicitly being called out. And maybe it’s because I’ve only played a couple of games (both as town), but I know that I read the posts closely. I missed stuff, sure, and badly misinterpreted most things (as usual), but I certainly didn’t miss anything explicitly directed at me. It smells, but I’ve seen Mahaloth play fast and loose (and absentmindedly) before. Null tell, I think.

11

The read along threads are good, it is how I got into the game, by following along, and it can be a good recruiting thread for future players. You get to follow along and ask questions, and the experienced players drop by if they are not playing.

On Dizzys clue, if Story as the Mod has form for providing cover identities then it would be reasonable to think that the clue is no value as people may know this anyway. So it could be a true clue and Story just added in a few simple clues as coming up with 20+ clues that are coherent and balanced is a big task. Or it is something scum know, so was an easy “clue” to toss out to lure others into revealing.

ATPG in post 209 says his vote for Darth Sensitive was not random, after talking a lot about random voting. That sort of " oh I didn’t really vote for that reason" pings me a bit. I may well have mischaracterized why he voted for Darth first time, but ATPG writes a lot, and I don’t have a spare lifetime to read it all.

12

Oooh these matching clues are intriguing. I think Town may have really screwed up by tipping their hands on the clues. Could the matching clues be a handshake for non-coordinating Masons?

Anyways, I feel like there is a ton of Day 1 discussion which is awesome!

13

And now Sherlock Holmes potentially outed on Day 1. Don’t know if it’s the players or the setup (good work story!) but this game is really exciting for Day 1. Can’t wait till someone, y’know, dies and they really get going!

14

sigh

I guess it’s kind of a compliment to get whacked on Night One by town, yeah? Still a bit disappointing. I was really enjoying this one!

Can’t wait until after the game is over so I can see the scum’s reasoning for picking me.

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What makes you think you were whacked by town?

16

Oh, damnit. No. Scum. Whacked by scum.

Though I guess it’s possible I was whacked by a town vigilante and that scum went ahead and tried for Daphne, who was protected by a Doc. Hadn’t even considered that.

17

Oooh. Chronos getting called out…

18

I’m surprised there hasn’t been more discussion about the clue regarding a female scum player that has the power to kill a protector if she targets the protectee. That has immediate relevance to an outed Sherlock Holmes.

I assert that the described scum power is both plausible and good game design. Outed Cop Hidden Doc is a very powerful combination for town. So much so, that scum pretty much HAVE to have some sort of counter. Often the counter power is a role blocker so that an outed cop becomes useless. But that has its own difficulties and balance issues. Useless cop is kind of boring.

While we don’t know if the clue is true or false, the described power is nearly perfect for dealing with an Outed Cop Hidden Doc. The power will kill the Doc, but the Cop will live and receive an investigation. Cop dies next day.

What we have here is a presumed Outed Cop who received an investigation (I’m not getting Daphne’s weirdness here, it actually makes me suspicious). Therefore, there is presumably no role blocker. It seems that the Clue Power is even more plausible. But why then didn’t we wind up with a dead Doc?
Possibility #1) The Doctor did not protect DaphneBlack
Possibility #2) The clue is false

There is also Possibility #3) Scum have the power but didn’t use it on DaphneBlack, but that is stupid. Scum should use it on DaphneBlack whether DaphneBlack is scum or not or the Cop or Not. She was the most likely to be protected.

In my opinion, the most plausible scum actions were they targeted DaphneBlack with their kill the protector power and killed a non-claimant under the assumption that DaphneBlack is either scum herself or would be protected.

19

If the “kill protector” power is a true clue (get my note book Blue!) then the most logical thing for scum to do would be to target Daphne with it. They could then chose to kill someone else on the chance of hitting another power role and hoping for a bonus kill on the town protector. The other thing that would make more sense would be to kill Sherlock as well. If it is a true power they either kill the protector, or Sherlock , I doubt both would die as protection occurs simultaneously with the killing of the protector (simultaneous resolution of actions right?), but they would be guaranteed at least one power role kill.
As a false clue it is massively disadvantageous for town for that to be out there. They become suspicious of any female (role) town and could cause the protector to make poor choices and not protect someone who needs it.
I think it is a possibility that the protector guessed it was a false clue and took a chance and protected Sherlock, Scum knew it was false and assumed the protector would stay away from Sherlock and tried to kill him, and we only ended up with one night kill from another killer role.
Maybe too complex?
Or Protector stayed away and there is a redirector that diverted a scum kill?
That said I a don’t believe Chronos, the power does give some cover for a scum who was found near a dead person, but still, don’t buy it.
Daphnes claim is not that she investigated but saw , which doesn’t seam like a traditional Sherlock type role. Maybe his deductive power is they can determine the results of others actions , or is a watcher rather than detective.

Shoes?

20

Nice to see that my death might end up getting a Day 2 scum lynching. I don’t see Chronos getting out of this one. And on the plus side, if he does flip town then Lightfoot is exonerated.