This is the troubling part for me:
She is making allowances for the situations she knows about and claiming there is no way he would cheat under any other circumstance.
Strip clubs are not the moral equivalent of ‘get out of jail’ free cards. The idea that this asshole would be completely faithful if only those pesky tittie bars didn’t exist is nonsense.
I hardly think it’s the strip club that’s the problem. Men can cheat anywhere.
The guy’s using alcohol consumption at a celebration as an excuse. Somebody who can’t have fun without apparently impairing his own judgment to the point where any behavior is excusable has a problem with alcohol.
DoperChic, I can sympathize with your position on strip clubs given his past behavior. But it appears that your anxiety extends beyond this isolated event and I’d like to caution you that there’s a profound difference between a legitimate concern and an irrational one. Being upset that he’s going out to a strip club because he betrayed you there is legitimate. Being anxious every time he goes out with the guys is not. Being ticked that he crossed the line with a stripper is legitimate. Weeping all night about it a year later and twisting that into some sort of indictment against your body is not.
He needs to start respecting your feelings; you need to quit hiding them. He needs to quit sharing gritty details that will only make you feel more insecure; you need to stop trying to be the “cool fiance” or “perfect mother” and give him your real self.
Hopefully your discussion last night went a long way to restoring trust. I also hope that you have girlfriends to enrich your life. We all need friends that we can get crazy with. Your husband is no exception and neither are you.
I agree with this; from everything we’ve seen here, I would say couple’s counselling is in order. That make-up scene left a bad taste in my mouth, too - something about it doesn’t sound right to me. This problem is not completely solved yet (it was about a whole lot more than just hubby going to a strip club), and I don’t think DoperChic is the only one who needs to work on her issues.
He wasn’t dry humping a stripper. He was getting what sounds like a typical lap dance. The fact that he ended up coming doesn’t make it cheating. It makes it hilariously embarrassing for him.
Although the issues have been discussed at length, this particular point hasn’t been addressed specifically. The o.p. is making an assumption here that is wrong and probably grossly so, to wit, she’s assuming that her husband is essentially a woman with male plumbing but archyptically female emotions and sexual response. The fact is that while many women require an intense (if possibly transitory) emotional connection in order to be stimulated to orgasm by a partner, for men it is almost an entirely mechanical operation; most men can be stimulated to erection and orgasm without any emotional connection whatsoever (although, at least in my personal experience, an emotional bond heightens the experience and duration of said sexual encounter). Your husband did not have a strong emotional bond with a stripper; she simply rubbed herself on him until enough neurons clicked over to energize the Semen Cannon. The same thing occurs with self-stimulation and, perhaps surprisingly, with nocturnal emissions which are sometimes caused by dreams that are not particularly sexual in nature.
For what it is worth, as others have noted, strip clubs are not selling sex, but rather the appearance and form of sex without the act itself; it’s actually a pretty nugatory and unsatisfying experience for most men. See the book Self-Made Man: One Woman’s Journey into Manhood and Back for a woman’s first-hand perspective on strip clubs in the guise of a man. Even individual strippers who resort to prostitution are simply regarding it as a service act, not any kind of bond, and most strip clubs don’t encourage this sort of thing, as it results in legal, civil, and behavioral problems.
So the o.p. let him think that it was all more-or-less okay, and then (from the man’s point of view) went postal when he took her at her word. This is classic “Mars vs. Venus”, assume-rather-than-communicate type of disagreement, and frankly the o.p. is just as responsible for the situation, if not moreso, than her husband. Which is not to say that it is okay for her husband to go to a strip club, and in fact, an ultimatum to the effect that he should not go to such a club is not (in my mind) and unreasonable request. But said demand and the reasons behind it have to be explicated, not presumed. The o.p. should be as angry or moreso with herself for creating the very situation which caused her to ride “one of the craziest emotional rollercoasters I have ever been on in my life.” This particular issue may be resolved but it is probably indicative of other communication problems in the relationship that should be brought to light.
Stranger
Any counselor worth his salt will notice that the dynamics of this relationship are far from perfect. You’ve resolved this issue perhaps, but at the cost of tears, fighting, mistrust, and drama. There are better ways to communicate.
Look, your marriage doesn’t sound all that bad, but I do see some major red flags that others have hit upon. You don’t need a horrible marriage to benefit from couple’s counseling. Do it. Do it now.
How come when people recommend counseling, I can’t help but think that the main purpose is to get a third party “ally” for the woman who will back her up in scolding her husband?
I see a lot of assumptions with only half the story.
I don’t know, maybe you should get counseling for that.
I don’t know. Why do you think that way?
It could be that after taking in all the information, the counselor will talk to her about…
Or whatever. And there may be things the guy has to work on as well. I bet it starts with what agreements they made when they decided to get married, what was discussed and what wasn’t, and so on.
I don’t think these things happen in a vacuum. It’s like tracing back your ancestors. Maybe he was miffed about something she did, so he went to the strip joint to get even. But he may not realize that he triggered what she did by something he said. And he said it because of something she did.
At least, that’s how it was when my marriage fell apart. Better to nip it early.
Why pay some stranger to work this kind of thing out? No need to go to Defcon 3 over a simple lack of communication.
I guess my wife shouldn’t have married me. I don’t trust me in that situation. That’s why I stay away from them.
Offer 4 dollar blow jobs…
Sorry…I had to…
Counseling is not IMO going to help this scenario. You have two immature, manipulative, and willful people who want what they want, and are used to using drama, subterfuge, and emotional wiles in getting their way. They have backed off from the final battle in order to try and salvage their relationship, but this is a high drama relationship and in modernity those usually end with single mothers, child support, and weekend visitation.
She made a bad choice in the type of man she is attracted to vs how she wants that man to behave. Per Stranger what she tacitly approves of then goes postal about when (quite predictably) it goes over the line, is an absurd game that is going to destroy the marriage.
A successful marriage needs clear guidance and rules that are understood and agreed to. This marriage is still one big Kabuki dance.
That’s the problem with society’s conception of therapy in this day and age. Therapy is not Defcon3. It is not just for people with huge problems. A skillful therapist can help immensely in unraveling the twisted web inside our heads. I’ve never been to couple’s therapy, but I know my parents have, and I witnessed the techniques and communication practices they learned there save our family from collapse.
In any case, I’m rambling now, but my point is that therapy is not just for fucked up situations. And it’s better to get it when things are going well than when they are already in the shitter. If her insurance covers it, then she should try it.
Wait a sec, hubby described the details of his earlier visit to the strip club in lurid detail?
That’s just weapons-grade stupid.
FYI, I have no problem with my husband going to strip clubs, but our agreement is “look all you want, but don’t touch.”
That being said, your husband crossed a line when it went beyond lap dancing IMO, and I have to wonder if it were really a strip club he went to.
The posters who don’t consider their SOs engaging in sucking nipples (on either side) to be cheating are much more open-minded than me.
Agreed. Never, never, never, never tell that stuff. Never. Tell the old lady that they were a bunch of fat hags that you couldn’t believe would have the audacity to take their clothes off in a strip club. Tell her that the whole night you were wondering why you paid to see naked ugly women when you had a beautiful woman at home.
Don’t, don’t, don’t, fucking tell your wife/girlfriend that you got a lap dance, sucked her nipples, and let her grind on you until you came.
If you need to confess, find a fucking preacher. How dumb are some guys?
Can’t shoot 'em, either. Damn.
It wasn’t a stupid oversight it was quite deliberate. She probably was giving him some attitude about it and he got pissed and decided to throw down an honesty nuke “Oh so yeah … and then she rode my lap for what… a good half hour … and so I sucked her titties, and finally I came in my pants”.
Even if she found his pants and confronted him he could have easily cleaned himself up or changed them before coming home. He’s throwing it in her face. They’re both playing whack a mole with each others emotional buttons, and they have been playing this game for some time.
I don’t agree with these people who say he shouldn’t have done anything just because it would upset you. I won’t comment on the specific situation, as I don’t know you very well, but there is a prevailing attitude from most of the women I’ve dated that their feelings are the most important thing in the world.
But people can’t expect their partners to cowtow to their every insecurity. You don’t like his/her new friend Jake/Sarah, because they make you jealous? Tough titties, that’s your problem that you need to get over. You either trust your partner or you don’t. I think it’s harmful to enable any of these reckless, emotionally blinding thoughts by just saying that it isn’t worth the hassle to fight, because you’re looking at the “big picture.”