Every time I make the mistake of reading one of Jack of Words’s submissions, I am reminded of Tywin Lannister explaining to Cercei: “You’re not nearly as clever as you think you are.”
What can I say, it looked to be the makings of a good barroom brawl.
It is VERY tempting to wade in again. What the hell was that latest thesis LinusK just posted?
I enjoyed the smack down that Jack just got. It is astounding how many words he can use to say nothing.
C’mon, you know you want to. One little post isn’t going to suck you in-- just post once and then go back to ignoring him - no harm done. Just do it – it’ll feel soooo good.
For me, following the last few pages of this thread has become like watching Celebrity Rehab or its much better sequel Sober House*-- no matter what anyone claims, the only reason they watch it is they want to see has-been “C” list celebrities slip up. So respond to the troll, you know you want to.
- Sober House was way better than Celebrity Rehab because the recently rehabbed “Celebrities” were given plenty of opportunities to misbehave and since most of them took on the show for money or publicity they weren’t really committed to the idea of staying sober.
Welp. I lapsed again.
If you can all manage to restrain yourselves then it will eventually just be LinusK and Jack talking to each other and the thread will probably be locked.
I did have to exercise some self-control Trinopus posted this:
…but I managed to do my part to avoid prolonging that thread.
Since I brought it up, I’ll say here that I’m a librarian and AFAIK most of the sexism male librarians have to struggle against comes from outside the profession. It isn’t female librarians who think it’s high-larious that a man would want to do a “woman’s job”. While I’m sure many male librarians have also had to deal with sexism from coworkers, this hasn’t prevented men in the profession from being overrepresented at the director level or on average making more money than women doing the same job.
Don’t be silly, women can’t be sexist…
From that study, by the way: “In technical services, women actually make 6% more than men do.”
Going by the dates, the only thing I can find is “Lol”. Oooh, that stung. No wonder you lot have to hide away here, where facts are irrelevant and you can tell each other whatever stories you like. Eh, iiandyiiii 
And you can’t read.
I stand corrected. I have only a very limited anecdotal level of experience, and I will accept that it is not properly representative.
It won’t die until the mods kill it. Again. LinusK is the energizer bunny of internet anti-feminism.
And, yes, male librarians, like male K-12 teachers and nurses, do face sexism in that they are perceived as doing “women’s work,” and therefore as less than masculine, but not generally in the workplace itself. They are certainly disproportionately represented in leadership roles in those professions. At least in library and school systems. Not so sure about nursing.
ETA: Er, after a closer reading, what Lamia said.
Jack, kindly do fuck right off. You can’t read worth a damn, nor is your writing anything to laud. You gave me a resoundingly stupid response to an honest question and you contribute absolute fuck-all to the discussion.
In fairness, he can apparently read well enough to decide which parts of a quote he wants to edit out.
Actual quote:
Edited quote:
Well, I read co-workers of male librarians to be other librarians - and if they’re being sexist to male colleagues, we can assume they’re female. But I suppose we can allow for librarians in schools, who might be exposed to sexism from male teachers…who are in the macho role of schoolteacher, so can look down on girlyboy librarians… :dubious: Maybe it’s the gym teachers?
As for your ‘honest’ question, you’re not fooling me - are you fooling yourself? All this lip service to ‘equality’, and you ask if women are at all disadvantaged. Ask yourself how you can measure equality by only looking at one side. Feminism, at least your feminism, is clearly not about equality. It’s not feminism, it’s womanism. There’s no ‘good’ bigotry, you chump.
And again, my sales and fans and all the rounds of applause (and the occasional groupie) are my guide as to the value of my writing. A bunch of butthurt bigots imagining their insults impact on me because they have no arguments that can? Get over yourselves.
My honest question was directed toward an egalitarian who loudly decries the injustices suffered by men in relation to those privileged women, but when asked if there are ANY cases where women are disadvantaged, responds with literal fucking pissing contests. It;s not a question of anyone being “fooled.” I am honestly wondering if your gender-blind equality even notices that in some cases, women are disadvantaged. Other than not being able to compete in urinary contests.
ETA in that thread, and others, feminists acknowledged areas where men get the short end of the stick. Can you, o gender blind one, acknowledge that in some cases, women do get a raw deal?
Yep, snipped the relevant bit, left out all the bits I had no comment on. Granted, I carelessly forgot to indicate that with […], as I usually would, but I was careless because…well, even you can probably work that out
Moreover, there is a huge affirmative-action mindset in elementary education in favor of redressing the gender imbalance by getting more male teachers into elementary schools. As this September 2014 New York Times article described it:
Similarly, male registered nurses on average make significantly more money than female ones across most settings, specialties and positions.
If men are discouraged by sexist prejudices against “women’s work” from going into elementary education, library work or nursing, despite the fact that men in those fields are usually more sought-after, more quickly promoted, and/or better paid than women are, then what’s needed to correct those sexist prejudices is feminism. The fundamental principle of feminism is that both women and men should do what they as individual human beings want to do, rather than being constrained by rigid gender expectations of what men or women are “supposed” to do.
I’m more interested in feminism’s claim that overall women get a raw deal. There are no rights (in the UK at least) that men have and women lack. The reverse is not true. And yet feminist activism focuses on ‘manspreading’ and the terrible problem of women not using democracy properly to elect people with similar genitals. Rather than equality, its nominal goal.
You’ll have to explain what you think you mean by ‘gender-blind equality’ (and ‘honesty’, it seems). You could also demonstrate how to properly answer a question by bothering to answer the one I posed to you after taking the trouble to answer yours. That you think one (admittedly trivial) example disregards any or all other examples is a matter of your ignorance.
How’s that abstinence programme going for you all, by the way
You are only looking at the men’s side, so you tell me. Feminism – at least in the US – looks at both sides, Well, at least according to the actual feminists who have posted. You on the other hand…the only inequality that concerns you is when men are the harmed party. So anti-feminists, and egalitarians, only concern themselves with bettering men’s positions.
So I repeat:
Kindly do fuck off.
But making sure they don’t get promoted, or end up earning more by working harder and longer (the usual causes of average pay disparities)? What an appealing notion that must be for so many men…
My own experience of working in primary schools is that I’ll be the only man in the building apart from the caretaker - and that female teachers are quite often feminist bigots who don’t think men can be trusted near children. Or women.
No, the fundamental principle is that men are an oppressor class who created a patriarchy because they hate the awesome power of the womb, or something. Then it’s manspreading, slut shaming, and somewhere down the list ‘women can do what they want’ (which so many took to be a moral code). After that is ‘men can do as they’re told’.
No, the point is that male teachers do tend to get promoted more rapidly and/or get more pay than female teachers.
So whatever is keeping men out of seeking work in elementary education, it isn’t discrimination against them in hiring, pay or promotion. Because male elementary teachers tend to be favored over women in those respects.
[QUOTE=Jack of Words]
No, the fundamental principle is that men are an oppressor class who created a patriarchy because they hate the awesome power of the womb
[/QUOTE]
Nonsense. Like all the Islamophobes who insist that the most violent radical-fundamentalist version of Islamist extremism is the “only true Islam”, because that’s what gives them the best excuse for hating all Muslims indiscriminately, you continue to insist that the most exaggeratedly militant-radical perspective on feminism is “the fundamental principle of feminism”, because that’s what makes it easiest for you to hate and smear all feminists indiscriminately. It’s a cartoonishly bad-faith argument.