Sorry Shags, but you’ve unintentionally derailed an otherwise (darkly) fun thread. Let’s have a sharper discussion of what you did start here. Personally I do not believe I would call what you did rape. It’s just that the Carlin quote popped into my head when I thought about what you and your “friend” did to this girl. Anyways, I thought this would be an interesting thing to hash out.
Sorry if we’ve done this before. You mentioned that you’ve told this story before, I just didn’t know where.
I’m not going to defend the implication in Shagnasty’s post that he thinks he did nothing wrong - though the post is in a “pranks gone awry” thread - but the 17-year-old Shagnasty is presumably not the same person as the adult one.
When I was about 14 or 15, my buddies and I attended a youth club had a game called “squeeze the tit”, where we chased girls around and, if we caught them, squeezed their tits. It was wrong - it was sexual assault - but we did not know at the time, and nor did we have the empathy to realise the distress we were causing. Eventually, after one girl stopped attending for a few weeks, the penny dropped, and I personally felt absolutely dreadful about it.
I would never do that again (without consent!). I am sure that Shagnasty regrets his participation in a version of sexual assault too (not rape - he says they did not perform intercourse). Perhaps his apparent lack of contrition is because he’s rehashed the story several times.
If it is purely a fantasy of his, well, it seems he’s not alone - it’s the plot of the misogynist Roald Dahl short story Switch Bitch.
I also don’t think I’d call it rape, but since he’s full of excuses and considers this a “prank” then I’d say that the adult Shagnasty is about as worthless as the 17 year old.
Well gosh, he didn’t think it was an assault so I guess it’s all okay! The only thing we’re missing (and might get if he responds here) is the old “wait, there’s more information!” like “Oh we talked about it later and she said she knew and didn’t care!”
He says he’s told the story here before, and he certainly didn’t hesitate to tell it now in a thread about pranks. If the grown Shagnasty really thought it was that bad, I’d think he’d be too ashamed to share it . Instead he’s more or less bragging about how they’d pulled off such a difficult thing without any detection! He also makes it sound as if he would have had sex with her if she hadn’t been on her period, so it isn’t like he wasn’t willing have sex with an unwilling partner.
The creepiest part? His last line…
What a guy.
Legally that counts as a rape.
Which definition, in which jurisdiction?
FWIW, in England and Wales, inducing someone to consent to a sexual act by impersonating someone known to them creates a conclusive presumption that:
a) the person did not consent; and
b) the defendant did not believe that they consented.
If there was no penetration with his penis though, it wouldn’t be rape, “just” assault by penetration or sexual assault depending on what happened.
I should have read the link more carefully: there was no penetration, so it wasn’t a rape. Under NZ law, it would be sexual assault. And by any standards it isn’t a remotely funny story, let alone something to smirk about on a message board.
The story’s been told a few other times if you’re looking for the long version. It doesn’t seem to have stirred up too much ire in its past tellings.
Here (no reaction)
Here (some reaction)
and here (very little reaction)
Setting aside the morality of this “stunt,” and assuming that it wasn’t technically rape, I’d just say that it was a lot of effort to do something that NEVER WOULD BE FUNNY.
Just because you’re seventeen doesn’t mean your humor must function on the lowest common denominator. If you’re going to go to a lot of effort, at least make it something that actually is funny. Shagnasty can plead youthful misguidance all he wants for deceiving the girl, but there’s no excuse for doing so just to pull off a very UNfunny joke.
Jeeze, at that age I was overthrowing my high school student government.
What makes me go :dubious: is I’m sure I’ve seen the story on Snopes or similar site. But for all I know it started with Shagnasty
Here’s what a search for his posts with ‘girlfriend’ and ‘closet’ turns up:
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7256450&postcount=12
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8207227&postcount=2
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8939141&postcount=37
The weird thing is he used the same text word-for-word each time.
Could just be that he composes his posts in word and saves “story” posts in case he needs to repost them later.
Which would be strange enough…
That’s basically right. I was young, I shared it in a pranks gone bad thread for a reason and I certainly am not bragging about it. Age is important. Imagine if she was say, 15. That would be an even worse twist to the story. The reason prior posts repeat themselves is because the full-version is long and I have it saved off. I thought that I once wrote it from scratch another time but I may be wrong about that. It is real although it sounds very unlikely and I am not proud of it in a few different ways.
Pit it all you want. I already said it was a terrible idea and posted it to a thread with that idea in mind. I know the general theme appears all over the place. It is even in Revenge of the Nerds for god’s sake. This happened as stated and I didn’t expect it to.
I’m not getting the outrage here. Was this a smart or kind thing to do? No. But (and I’m sorry to have to say this) teenage boys are not always smart or kind when it comes to girls, sex, or “jokes”.
I suppose it could be considered sexual assault, but why the need to depict it so? Every boy who felt up my ass or tried to grab my chest when I was a teenager is also guilty of sexual assault. I hate to sound like “guys are pigs” but sometimes they are. Commonality doesn’t make it right, but it also doesn’t make it a tar and feathering offense. I think if we were all to look closely at our teenage behavior, we’d all find something of which we are heartily ashamed now. If not, you were one boring teenager.
I think the girl was too embarrassed to admit she’d been duped. Either that or she is er, mentally challenged and if so, THAT would trigger my outrage meter. This is not setting it off at all. IMO, one person’s “dark fun” is another’s outrage. I’m more “outraged” at Porky Pig and Elmer Fudd, frankly. YMMV.
That poor girl. Not only did people she trust betray her, but all her friends knew about it and laughed about it too. That whole thing is digusting, and it’s kinda sick that save the story so you still brag about it. I’m sure it would have been a laugh riot if you slipped her a roofie too.
Man, you guys cut people a lot of slack when it comes to doing fucked up shit to women! What if she had one of her smallish gay boy friends dress up like her and take over sucking his dick in the dark and then told all his friends about it? He didn’t take it up the ass, mind you, so it’s not rape, so no biggie! Would you blame him if he was pissed at/felt violated by the guy who sucked him off? Even if the wasn’t “into it”? He would have kicked the living shit out of that gay guy when he found out, wouldn’t he? And most everyone would think he was right to do it. And just because teenage boys do “a lot” of disgusting illegal crap to girls in our culture does NOT make it okay. These are your daughters, guys. Think about it.
Not just rape, violence against women in general can be funny. E.g., that famous exchange of rapier wit between Lady Astor and Winston Churchill:
LA: If you were my husband, Winston, I’d put poison in your tea!
WC: And if you were my wife, I’d beat the shit out of you!
Exactly, except more than kinda sick. Especially where he says how it was the perfect joke. It’s like he’s trying to convince us how cool he is and is almost scared that we wouldn’t believe his daring exploits. Well Shagnasty, I actually hope you are lying because that behaviour was illegal and immoral and if brought up on a message board at all should be in the context of major regrets one has rather than pranks. Do you have a daughter? If so would you chuckle if you overheard her boyfriend bragging about how he did something similar? This is mind-boggling.