In my experience, you’re describing a very good profile for a humanities / liberal arts student (and eventually professor?). He could put all that energy into writing a thesis on “digital interaction in society” or some such thing. This would of course beef up his vocabulary and intellectual skills along the way.
Contrary to other posters I think the military would be a lousy fit .
I doubt that a career in academia is going to be a good option for astro’s son. It takes a ton of self-discipline and drive to finish a PhD program in the humanities and make it through the brutally competitive process of an academic job search, and you have to really, really have a passion for your subject and for academia in general. (Successfully completing an undergraduate major is a different story, but only a tiny percentage of students who study any subject at the undergraduate level become professors in that field.) Also, poor vocabulary and reading skills are normally a deal-breaker.
That said, I doubt that his deficiencies are going to put him hopelessly behind if he does decide he wants a degree of some sort. Most colleges are not particularly selective, and there are plenty of resources available for getting students up to speed. (I teach at a four-year state school that has, at least, some nominal entry requirements – and many colleges have none at all – and I’m pretty sure that not only do most of the students in my remedial comp class not know what “tenacious” means, most of them don’t even know that they don’t know. Consider it a good sign that he actually asked.)
Most of those narratives are similarly uninspiring for me. And similarly nauseating. What might inspire you might completely turn someone else off. I suggested literature that the guy in question would probably like, and that would probably inspire him. While I do read biographies and autobiographies, mostly they don’t inspire me. Especially the “captains of industry” ones…they tend to drive home the point that the subjects are monomaniacs.
I think you missed the joke here. He’s saying liberal arts majors are losers with no skills…har har har.
None of the books I suggested even remotely fall into the category you’re describing…look them up if you don’t believe me. Fantasy literature will only inspire this guy to play World of Warcraft and read more fantasy literature.
Just a thought. If the kid NEEDS a car and a phone and internet to get a job there is nothing wrong with the absolute minimum to get the job done. Need a cell phone? Here’s your bulky assed Jitterbug (with no features) with limited minutes. Car? Well, here’s your clunker. The mechanic says the brakes are good and the engine and transmission seem decent. No AC? Too bad. No heat? Thats what coats are for. No radio or CD player or Ipod slot? You can hum “working in a coal mine all day long” can’t you? Its rusty and looks ugly? Get used to it, think what we are saving on insurance. Its a lame assed pickup truck that I can only drive around in with one friend? Sure, you two can make some extra cash moving peoples fridges. You need an email account for job searches? Sure, give them mine (and use it ONLY for job searches) and I’ll be sure to inform you of what comes up.
Or, in other words, you can give em what they “need” without coddling them. If they actually appreciate it and strive to do better THEN you can reward them with better stuff or they can get the better stuff themselves or some of both. What you need and what would be nice are way different things.
Cite?
The guy is interested in fantasy milieus. The books that I listed will appeal to him, while I doubt that the books that you listed will resonate with him. I don’t think that he could relate to someone being a top chef, or going off to a remote location to live simply, for instance. I think that would be too alien for him.
On the other hand, I DO think that he could imagine himself as a low-level soldier in a centuries-long war, who is given a sword with a blessing and a curse on it, and how the soldier solves this problem. Or maybe he would enjoy reading about a failed magician’s apprentice, who loses everything when his aging master dies before teaching that apprentice anything other than a single spell. The point is, this guy would more than likely read my books than yours, and get more out of them. And the point of the exercise is to get him to do SOMETHING that will make him more active. This guy is used to not having to do stuff if he doesn’t like it. And I doubt that he really will enjoy your examples.
I could very easily get caught up in WoW or similar MMORPGs. I know this. I know the personality type. I know what appeals to people who are susceptible to this. And your books are not likely to appeal to such people. I’m not saying that your books are not worthwhile, I am saying that they are not likely to be effective. And yes, I’ve read Walden and Kitchen Confidential (though I admit I read Walden in my teens). I did find them interesting…but I’m not caught in the throes of WoW withdrawal.
How in the world is reading fantasy stuff that by definition can’t possibly happen going to encourage him to get out and do stuff in the real world? Thats his problem, he spends his time in a fantasy world. A different fantasy world is just as bad as the one he is in.
Maybe if he reads about some REAL LIFE adventures (big or small) he might be motivated to actually get out in the real world and try those for a change of pace.
No, I was NOT. Please do not make accusations. Some people thrive better in academia and there is nothing wrong with recommending a liberal arts program as an option. It may attract some dissolute rich kids (not talking about the OP), but it’s not a crowd of losers.
It’s like weaning a baby. You don’t start a baby off with steak and artichokes. They can’t handle it yet.
He might never come to prefer the real world to fantasy worlds. But giving him books isn’t going to do any good at all unless he actually likes the books. He likes fantasy worlds. I’ve given examples of a couple of fantasy books where the hero has to deal with the realities of his world, and think and work to overcome obstacles. I think that the books I recommended are better for him than books written by people who are obsessed with something.
Well, I figured I’d give him the benefit of the doubt…
ETA: … which he deserves, it seems. (I somehow missed seeing his next post when I replied to this.)
I agree 100%， This is especially important if you want him progress gradually instead of carelessly leaping and backsliding.
Online gaming is a real addiction, and it creates real brain changes which have to be undone. My former best friend dropped out of his first degree because of counterstrike addiction (he recovered and eventually started at another university where he met me). A WoW addict will not be able to pick up a university textbook right away, there concentration has been eroded too much.
Here’s the order I’d recommend to rebuild his concentration and boost his independence.
[ol]
[li]Offline computer games[/li][li]good game tie-in novels[/li][li]Fantasy novels[/li][li]Realistic/inspirational novels[/li][li]Interesting non-fiction[/li][li]Academic books.[/li][/ol]
I also deliberately chose young adult books, because I think that the young man in question is not really an adult, emotionally, and he needs to grow up. He might not have the background to understand the cutthroat food industry. But he does identify with fantasy settings and characters.
Giving this guy an “inspirational true life story” is like handing one of Shakespeare’s more esoteric plays to a second grader, with no notes, and expecting the kid to be able to understand it. The kid doesn’t have the background to understand the concepts.
Playing WoW does not mean you are interested in Fantasy. I play WoW, D&D and can’t really stand reading Fantasy/SF. I like Historical Fiction, Romance and Realistic Fiction.
I think that by 21 you either know you are a reader or you aren’t. You don’t get through high school, even barely, without having had to read and if it didn’t grab you, it probably won’t. I also think that even if he were a reader, adding another immersive, addictive, escapist, time consuming hobby isn’t a good thing. All us readers know its as easy to stay up until 3am because you have to finish the book as it is because you are mid-raid.
I agree that getting out of the house is where its at. Volunteering if he doesn’t have enough hours at his job (in exchange for the car and cell phone, perhaps?). The military wouldn’t be a bad idea.
On the other hand, I wouldn’t be too worried about the word “tenacious.” Or vocabulary in general. I know a lot of fairly successful people who have held jobs and raised families to whom I often have to explain the meaning of the words I use. The real question is if he can translate his own tenacity in completing a raid and the strategic skills from WoW into a job. And make the decision that independence is cooler than living with Mom. That may take a few years and maybe a girlfriend who says “you still live with your Mom?” That seems to be the final straw for a lot of young men.
This has only been mentioned a few times - but counseling. Not online, but face-to-face with a therapist. He has some inkling that his life is not going according to plan but I don’t think this is something you want to diagnose at home, nor do you necessarily want to supplant the WoW addiction with something else.
I feel for this kid, as someone noted, because he hasn’t been parented - but he’s seen enabling behavior all around him, and as someone noted upthread, even you astro have been doing this. He sounds like a reasonable kid and not in denial. I would help him get in touch with a therapist (hell, you should enable this behavior and potentially pay for this) and see where that takes him.
Sounds like he needs some friends or a social outlet in “meatspace” (cringe). Is he good with kids? Maybe he could work with young kids with computers as a volunteer and see how that goes.
We have a similar problem at our house. My stepson is twenty years old and hasn’t graduated from high school yet. He’s been taking online classes, but is constantly threatened with being dropped from the program because he doesn’t keep up with the minimum pace. It’s weed instead of WOW, and he’s no Eagle Scout, but other than that, he had an indulgent mother, my husband was financially supportive, but not involved with the daily upbringing, and here we are. 
I like billfish’s thoughts expressed in post #86.
Sorry. Since he hasn’t shown any particular skill in research, writing, analysis, abstraction, or really any of the skills useful to an academic, I figured you were pulling our legs. I mean, I don’t see anything in the OP that suggest he has what it takes to be an academic any more than he has what it takes to be, say, an underwear model.
astro, I just came in to this thread to say that I was a pretty big screw up in my early 20s, but when I was 25 years old, I got it together. My problem wasn’t that I was a WoW addict, I was just a plain old pothead. Around 25 I realized that I needed to get it together if I didn’t want to be wearing a hair net at work for the rest of my life. I went back to school, then to grad school and then a career I really enjoy. It can happen, so don’t lose all hope.
There are plenty of real life adventure stories that don’t involve amazingly successful workaholics or complicated concepts or once in a lifetime opportunities or superhuman abilities.
There are handful of caving and cave diving books, some real, some fiction that are quite gripping. And most of these involve “average” people doing exploring on weekends and long weekends or typical vacations. (PS, don’t even think of doing either without getting training from people who know how to do this stuff right).
Now, let me think of a few other “recreational” activities (skip to next paragraph when you get bored). Rock climbing, mountain climbing, hiking, deep sea fishing, boating and boat building, paddling/canoeing/kayaking, white water paddling, scuba diving, camping, astronomy and telescope building, rock collecting, fossil collecting, heck collecting of probably a thousand different things, water skiing, snow skiing or snowboarding, surfing, sail boarding, road tripping, hang gliding, glider gliding, flying small planes, building your own plane, gardening, car repair, car customizing, mountain biking, 4 wheeling/offroading, hunting (of many different types, competive shooting or archerry, making models of a dozen different things, woodworking, cooking and baking, homebrewing beer and wine, homebuilt robots, remote control planes and cars, motorcycle and “supped up go cart scale” racing, on foot racing, paddling racing, woodworking, glass blowing, pottery, sailing, kite surfing, fly fishing, volunteer firefighting, volunteer work with local Search and Rescue Units, volunteer with Civil Air Patrol, volunteer with Animal Rescue, helping biologists locate and document plants and animals of interest, home repair or improvement, painting, photography, videography, sky diving, skate boarding (hoverboarding is just around the corner), geneology and or historical research, helping with archeological digs, Meals on Wheels, Goodwill/Salvation Army/Hospital Volunteer work, trained dog competitions, triatholons, model rocketry and probably a good bit more.
Now take any of those real life activities. You can be pretty sure that there are books (and usually a BUNCH of em) about all those things that are designed to appeal to, be understandable to, and impart the wonder/magic/excitement/satisfaction that the activity brings to the beginner reader. There will also be numerous books on adventures big and small, some funny, some scary, some good and exciting as people engage in these activities. And of course plenty of how to books which will appeal the “engineering/hands on/how does it work?” types. Again, keep in mind many of these activities do not take large sums of money, that most of the people that do them are not geniuses or workaholics or rich or superhuman or hypercompetive assholes.
Instead these adventures are often experienced by normal people with 9 to 5 jobs, often a spouse and kids, who have found something other than WOW or other fantasy stuff to fill their weekends. It gets them out of the house, away from the often times IMO dreck of the internet and television and gaming world, get ems some exercise, stimulates the mind and senses in a way the dreck doesn’t, and usually involves socializing with other folks who are interesting, motivated, and often with a significantly different socio/economic/educational/occupational back ground than yourself which leads to mind expanding casual conversations.
And you never know what exciting thing will happen on any given weekend. Last weekend I got to paddle over a 4 foot alligator in 2 foot of crystal clear water. I could have reached out and touched him. Pretty damn neat.
Find something, anything, that sounds like it might be interesting and DO IT. If it doesn’t float your boat try something else.
I feel for you Astro. Both of my kids went through phases of addiction similar to this and it took its toll. One barely made it out of high school and then wasted 4 years playing Halo and online poker before I finally convinced my wife to cut him off. The younger son had a problem with WoW that kept him from getting things done for the first couple of years of college but has dropped that for the most part. The problem is addiction, not just WoW or some other game. But WoW is the best drug you can get right now.
The only advice I can offer is, don’t try to take away the gaming. It is pointless to take away the WoW because he will find something else equally useless to fill his 10-12 hours a day - solitare, posting to the STMB or or some other internet something. Better is to find things that can replace the gaming. Exercise, as many have suggested is a good idea but not that attractive by itself. You need to continually offer alternatives that might break him out of his addiction: Take him to a movie, send him or take him on a trip. Instead of telling him to get out of the house, show him what in interesting outside.